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tv   Consider This  Al Jazeera  November 28, 2013 9:00am-10:01am EST

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in the credits that no animals in the credits that no animals were harmed in the making of were harmed in the making of
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this film worthless? this film worthless? also game show host and legend also game show host and legend bob barker joins us with his bob barker joins us with his effort to save animals overseas. effort to save animals overseas. plus, in spite of all the plus, in spite of all the criticism, could john kerry criticism, could john kerry become one of the become one of the most important most important secretary of secretary of secretary of states in years? secretary of states in years? are many people getting are many people getting duped, we'll tell you the best duped, we'll tell you the best way to protection your way to protection your donations. donations. butterball's great slinking butterball's great slinking turkeys, how turkeys have never turkeys, how turkeys have never been bigger. been bigger. this year movie goers and this year movie goers and animal lovers might want to pay animal lovers might want to pay more attention to the pledge more attention to the pledge that no animals were harmed that no animals were harmed during filming. during filming. a a stunning investigation into stunning investigation into how animals are treated, how animals are treated, injuries and even deaths, injuries and even deaths, including life of pi including life of pi and the and the
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hobbit, the man who broke the hobbit, the man who broke the story, no animals were harmed, story, no animals were harmed, gary good to see you thanks for gary good to see you thanks for doing this for us. doing this for us. the american humane association the american humane association is the association that is is the association that is charged with monitoring tv and charged with monitoring tv and film to ensure that animals are film to ensure that animals are being treated properly. being treated properly. your investigation pretty much your investigation pretty much says they're not doing their says they're not doing their job. job. >> correct. >> correct. we found the claims that they're we found the claims that they're making in public are different making in public are different that be the ones -- the that be the ones -- the information they have information they have internally. internally. >> some of the cases are pretty >> some of the cases are pretty extreme. extreme. the hobbit, was something the the hobbit, was something the ama didn't investigate when 27 ama didn't investigate when 27 animals animals died from exhaustion and died from exhaustion and in many cases drowning? in many cases drowning? >> yes, we found that a trainer >> yes, we found that a trainer that brought that information to that brought that information to them was rebuffed. them was rebuffed. they were not in the aha was not they were not in the aha was not interested in finding out why interested in finding out why that off-set production facility that off-set production facility holing facility for those holing facility for those animals wasn't properly checked animals wasn't properly checked
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to make sure that it was to make sure that it was safe. safe. and they did not want to discuss and they did not want to discuss those issues. those issues. not exactly what you'd expect of not exactly what you'd expect of a a self-professed robust animal self-professed robust animal welfare organization. welfare organization. >> isn't the whole system, to >> isn't the whole system, to put it in the simplest terms put it in the simplest terms silly? silly? the reality is the aha almost the reality is the aha almost has an inherent conflict of has an inherent conflict of interest because the money that interest because the money that funds it comes from the funds it comes from the hollywood production companies. hollywood production companies. >> correct, that's true. >> correct, that's true. it's always been a fundamental it's always been a fundamental problem. problem. the aha is funded by almost the aha is funded by almost entirely in its film and tv unit entirely in its film and tv unit operations which is the operations which is the operations that send out these operations that send out these on-set monitors through grant on-set monitors through grant funds bestowed on it by the sag funds bestowed on it by the sag afh afh rampleta workers union, rampleta workers union, which the industry studios which the industry studios network pay for these services network pay for these services and it is privatized operation and it is privatized operation and it seems not to be working. and it seems not to be working.
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>> let's look at the examples, >> let's look at the examples, the bengal the bengal tiger nearly drown in tiger nearly drown in a water tank when he was snagged a water tank when he was snagged with a rope and dragged to the with a rope and dragged to the side of the tank. side of the tank. in another example, a dog was in another example, a dog was punched by a trainer punched by a trainer on the site on the site of eight below, and four of eight below, and four horses horses died during died during hbo's luck. hbo's luck. all these things were happening, all these things were happening, and you would think that they and you would think that they would be more careful. would be more careful. >> yes, these things continue to >> yes, these things continue to happen but what seems to have happen but what seems to have been taking place is we have a been taking place is we have a system where the aha feels that system where the aha feels that it is a collaborator that it is it is a collaborator that it is a partner with the industry and a partner with the industry and it isn't an independent force it isn't an independent force and that seems to be what's and that seems to be what's really needed is a truly really needed is a truly independent monitoring service independent monitoring service that can ensure safety first. that can ensure safety first. right now, we have a situation right now, we have a situation where the where the aha seems to be aha seems to be bending over backwards for its bending over backwards for its industry patrons and the results industry patrons and the results
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are that animals aren't are that animals aren't always -- what's really going on always -- what's really going on with the animals isn't always with the animals isn't always the first thing that comes out, the first thing that comes out, and it's not clear, and the -- and it's not clear, and the -- what's most important is that what's most important is that the no animals were harmed the no animals were harmed credit which is a very broad credit which is a very broad statement. statement. there's not much room to wiggle there's not much room to wiggle there. there. just doesn't hold just doesn't hold true. true. >> but what does it mean in the >> but what does it mean in the end? end? it just seems like it means it just seems like it means nothing. nothing. because you also write about the because you also write about the fact there are very few people fact there are very few people that go onto these sets for the that go onto these sets for the aha and they are there for very aha and they are there for very short periods of time. short periods of time. >> occasionally they are >> occasionally they are understaffed. understaffed. for small periods. for small periods. it took it took me, an investigative me, an investigative reporter to find out what reporter to find out what happened, for them to finally happened, for them to finally admit in various cases that admit in various cases that there were these discrepancies there were these discrepancies and they bring up all sorts of and they bring up all sorts of quibbling details. quibbling details. the fact is they don't have the fact is they don't have answers to these largers issues answers to these largers issues which is which is accountability and accountability and
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responsibility and oversight. responsibility and oversight. they have the ability to they have the ability to investigate. investigate. they have certified humane they have certified humane officers to issue citations, to officers to issue citations, to make arrest, to investigate. make arrest, to investigate. here in los angeles, the d.a. here in los angeles, the d.a. reliance on it to pursue animal reliance on it to pursue animal cruelty investigations, not the cruelty investigations, not the police. police. they just don't do these things. they just don't do these things. so this public trust in various so this public trust in various manifestations have been manifestations have been enrusted to them and they aren't enrusted to them and they aren't making use of it. making use of it. >> hermella what is the viewer >> hermella what is the viewer question? question? >> on twitter wants to know, >> on twitter wants to know, does each animal have its own does each animal have its own advocate on set and how are they advocate on set and how are they held held accountable? accountable? >> sag >> sag afhra productions because afhra productions because of this grant have these of this grant have these monitors on set i believe most monitors on set i believe most of the time although there are of the time although there are holes where sometimes there are holes where sometimes there are late notifications and distant late notifications and distant notifications where different notifications where different things come up where they're not things come up where they're not there. there. but basically what happens is
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but basically what happens is that the on-set monitor oversees that the on-set monitor oversees the action and writes up reports the action and writes up reports on a daily basis of what they on a daily basis of what they find and then send it into find and then send it into headquarters for review. headquarters for review. >> the aha gary says in a >> the aha gary says in a lengthy statement they sent to lengthy statement they sent to us that your piece is a massive us that your piece is a massive overreaction and that the overreaction and that the article paints a picture that is article paints a picture that is completely unrecognizable to us completely unrecognizable to us or anyone who knows the american or anyone who knows the american humane association's work. humane association's work. what do you say to that? what do you say to that? >> what else are they going to >> what else are they going to say? say? that we got busted? that we got busted? there's not much for them to there's not much for them to say. say. they -- you know there's a they -- you know there's a mass -- it's not a surprise that mass -- it's not a surprise that they say that they don't they say that they don't recognize things because they're recognize things because they're not looking. not looking. they like to turn a blind eye. they like to turn a blind eye. i spoke to many people inside i spoke to many people inside the organization, and they -- the organization, and they -- there's a massive issue with there's a massive issue with management not looking at what's management not looking at what's going on. going on. and there's a discrepancies and there's a discrepancies between those on the ground and between those on the ground and those in the position of power. those in the position of power. they're in damage control now. they're in damage control now.
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>> so what happens now? >> so what happens now? what will the a ha do, and will what will the a ha do, and will the u.s. department of the u.s. department of of of agriculture get involved? agriculture get involved? >> it's to be determined. >> it's to be determined. a lot has to do with public a lot has to do with public sentiment. sentiment. when these measures were put when these measures were put into place decades ago, public into place decades ago, public sentiment about animal use and sentiment about animal use and tv wasn't where it is now. tv wasn't where it is now. here in 2013 people care about here in 2013 people care about these things deeply and on a these things deeply and on a granular level. granular level. it seems as though the it seems as though the aha aha hasn't kept up with times, hasn't kept up with times, they're out of step. they're out of step. as far as the industry and the as far as the industry and the industry's political arm in the industry's political arm in the form of the mpaa will step in form of the mpaa will step in and do something, whether the and do something, whether the industry will take notice or industry will take notice or congress will take notice it's congress will take notice it's something we'll have to see. something we'll have to see. >> gary baum, interesting piece, >> gary baum, interesting piece, thank you for joining us to talk thank you for joining us to talk about it. about it. >> thanks for having me. >> thanks for having me. while films say no animals while films say no animals were harmed, one organization were harmed, one organization
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can say with pride animals were can say with pride animals were saved, the rescue saved, the rescue of 25 lions of 25 lions from a number from a number of traveling of traveling circuses in circuses in bolivia. bolivia. >> human beings being forced to >> human beings being forced to live in their bathrooms for the live in their bathrooms for the whole of their lives. whole of their lives. no sensory no sensory experiences, giving experiences, giving them something to do, a bit of them something to do, a bit of fun, something to play with. fun, something to play with. >> joining me to talk about the >> joining me to talk about the film film are jan are jan creamer the creamer the executive executive producer of the film producer of the film and bob barker, the and bob barker, the legendary legendary television are television are producer and producer and philanthropy. philanthropy. your your organization has worked organization has worked to to get laws bassed
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get laws bassed banning banning comploitation of comploitation of animals. animals. , , exploitation of exploitation of animals. animals. let's look at you in action. let's look at you in action. >> scratching the >> scratching the tires. tires. >> stop that boy, stop that boy, >> stop that boy, stop that boy, get that boy. get that boy. stop stop it. it. get that please. get that please. you're not letting them out. you're not letting them out. i don't care. i don't care. leave them where they are. leave them where they are. no. no. no. no. no. no. you're not touching them. you're not touching them. this is not a committee. this is not a committee. so stop it! so stop it! >> it's a pretty frightening >> it's a pretty frightening moment jan. moment jan. how were you able to pull it how were you able to pull it off, a whole number of circuses off, a whole number of circuses a couple of dozen lobby lions a couple of dozen lobby lions you saved. you saved. >> it was, it was 29 lions in >> it was, it was 29 lions in
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total in two rest accuse and the total in two rest accuse and the lion arc focuses on the rescue lion arc focuses on the rescue of the whole of the 25 from of the whole of the 25 from bolivia. bolivia. as you say we worked under cover as you say we worked under cover for 25 years. for 25 years. we released the findings to the we released the findings to the public and to the bolivian public and to the bolivian congress and they decided that congress and they decided that they didn't want this going on they didn't want this going on in their country. in their country. they didn't want animals to they didn't want animals to suffer behind the scenes just suffer behind the scenes just for a few moments of for a few moments of entertainment. entertainment. and they were determined to ban and they were determined to ban them and they stopped all them and they stopped all animals from traveling with animals from traveling with circuses, and it was a year circuses, and it was a year later that we wept back when later that we wept back when some of the circuses said they some of the circuses said they were going odefy law and they were going odefy law and they thought the -- to defy the law thought the -- to defy the law and working with the government and working with the government we were able to show them that we were able to show them that we were determined to enforce we were determined to enforce this law. this law. >> and bob you enforced the >> and bob you enforced the effort to get this lions out. effort to get this lions out. you have been a you have been a stand-out stand-out activist for a long time. activist for a long time.
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you refer to the circus as your you refer to the circus as your archenemy. archenemy. >> i do. >> i do. aren't you impressed with the aren't you impressed with the way jan handled that situation. way jan handled that situation. for a petite very for a petite very ladylike lady, ladylike lady, she can really be pretty tough, she can really be pretty tough, can't she had? can't she had? >> she can, she was there. >> she can, she was there. why do you think the circus is why do you think the circus is the archenemy bob? the archenemy bob? >> i >> i believe they're archenemy believe they're archenemy because they abuse animals and because they abuse animals and not just lions and not just lions and tigers, but tigers, but elephants, chimps, they abuse elephants, chimps, they abuse the animals, in some cases they the animals, in some cases they kill the animals and they cause kill the animals and they cause the animals to have absolutely the animals to have absolutely miserable lives. miserable lives. i've said in speeches that i've i've said in speeches that i've made, i've said that an elephant made, i've said that an elephant in a circus, or a lion or a in a circus, or a lion or a tying ner a sir d-tieser in a tying ner a sir d-tieser in a circus, the best day of its life circus, the best day of its life it dies, because that's the only
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it dies, because that's the only time it gets any peace. time it gets any peace. >> you are speaking about >> you are speaking about that, that, let's listen to that. let's listen to that. >> how are they there trained, >> how are they there trained, they are they are beat with ax handles, beat with ax handles, golf clubs, they shock it with golf clubs, they shock it with all kinds of electric devices. all kinds of electric devices. they never know a day that is they never know a day that is really pleasurable. really pleasurable. and finally after 20, 30, maybe and finally after 20, 30, maybe even 40 years, they even 40 years, they die. die. and that day, that they die, is and that day, that they die, is probably the best day of their probably the best day of their lives. lives. isn't that a horrible thought? isn't that a horrible thought? >> it is a horrible thought, >> it is a horrible thought, bob. bob. how pervasive is the problem? how pervasive is the problem? >> well, how many circuses are >> well, how many circuses are there in the world? there in the world? i don't suppose there's a circus i don't suppose there's a circus anyplace in any country that anyplace in any country that isn't isn't mistreating animals and mistreating animals and certainly not in the united certainly not in the united states and we can only hope that states and we can only hope that the united states eventually the united states eventually becomes as civilized as bolivia becomes as civilized as bolivia and causes all circuses to stop
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and causes all circuses to stop using animals. using animals. >> and jan as we've said you've >> and jan as we've said you've had a lot of success in bolivia, had a lot of success in bolivia, you've had a lot of success in you've had a lot of success in latin latin america america ecuador and peru, ecuador and peru, where is your effort where is your effort focused and focused and how successful are you being? how successful are you being? >> we are hoping to reintroduce >> we are hoping to reintroduce legislation next year, we've got legislation next year, we've got a bill in the parliament of the a bill in the parliament of the united kingdom, we recently got united kingdom, we recently got a ban in greece and in el a ban in greece and in el salvador. salvador. people don't want animals to people don't want animals to suffer for entertainment. suffer for entertainment. when members of the public see when members of the public see how these animals live and how how these animals live and how they're treated and how they're they're treated and how they're suffering they don't want to go suffering they don't want to go to the an plal circus. to the an plal circus. there are lots of other circuses there are lots of other circuses that can survive without the use that can survive without the use of animals. of animals. this is really a worldwide this is really a worldwide movement now and we see the movement now and we see the
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united states is going to get on united states is going to get on board. board. >> animal defenders >> animal defenders international has international has collected collected evidence throughout the evidence throughout the years, years, you use it sparingly in the you use it sparingly in the film. film. animals are found to have animals are found to have feelings. feelings. the animals who grow through the animals who grow through this kind of suffering. this kind of suffering. >> it is the -- it is the >> it is the -- it is the deprivation, and you know in a deprivation, and you know in a recent court case, we prosecuted recent court case, we prosecuted a circus owner for cruelty to an a circus owner for cruelty to an elephant. elephant. and actually, one of the experts and actually, one of the experts said that in his opinion, the said that in his opinion, the fact that she was chained to the fact that she was chained to the ground, 24 hours a day, for ground, 24 hours a day, for weeks and weeks on end, probably weeks and weeks on end, probably caused more pain and suffering caused more pain and suffering because of her arthritis, than because of her arthritis, than the actual beating she endured. the actual beating she endured. but as we see in the film, when but as we see in the film, when you look add one of the lions, you look add one of the lions,
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colocolo, who spent his life in colocolo, who spent his life in a tiny change, 12 years, tiny a tiny change, 12 years, tiny cage, nothing to do, bare walls, cage, nothing to do, bare walls, bare floors, nothing to bare floors, nothing to stimulate him, as you say, these stimulate him, as you say, these are intelligent feeling are intelligent feeling creatures. creatures. they have a way of they have a way of communication, they feel fear communication, they feel fear and pain and distress just as we and pain and distress just as we do. do. it is the deprivation often that it is the deprivation often that is far worse than some of the is far worse than some of the beatings. beatings. >> they demonstrated pacing and >> they demonstrated pacing and show that depression in all show that depression in all sorts of ways. sorts of ways. let's talk about the positive let's talk about the positive side of the film and the side of the film and the positive side of your efforts. positive side of your efforts. and bob, you helped fly these and bob, you helped fly these lions 5,000 miles from bolivia lions 5,000 miles from bolivia to a sanctuary in colorado. to a sanctuary in colorado. i want to i want to see see you greeting these you greeting these lions. lions. >> line number one. >> line number one. >> what is life like for the
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>> what is life like for the lions now? lions now? we have some beautiful images of we have some beautiful images of the sanctuary. the sanctuary. >> oh, at long last! >> oh, at long last! they're living the way that they're living the way that nature intended for lions to nature intended for lions to live. live. and the difference between the and the difference between the expressions on their faces, and expressions on their faces, and the difference in their attitude the difference in their attitude from what it was back in from what it was back in bolivia, is absolutely bolivia, is absolutely astounding. astounding. it's -- and it's -- and heartwarming. heartwarming. they're behaving like little they're behaving like little kittens now, running around, kittens now, running around, wrestling, playing, sleeping wrestling, playing, sleeping with each other, their heads on with each other, their heads on each other. each other. oh, it brought a lump to my oh, it brought a lump to my throat, it really did. throat, it really did. >> and it happened almost >> and it happened almost immediately, right? immediately, right? from this horrible depression to from this horrible depression to happiness. happiness. >> from stepping out into what >> from stepping out into what they knew their life was to be they knew their life was to be from now on. from now on. they seemed to sense it. they seemed to sense it. they thought ah, at last, we've they thought ah, at last, we've been released, at last we can
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been released, at last we can live the way nature intended. live the way nature intended. and they began from the first and they began from the first moment around they're still moment around they're still living just as happily living just as happily today. today. >> it is wonderful to see and >> it is wonderful to see and bob bob barker jan creamer we really barker jan creamer we really appreciate you bringing us this appreciate you bringing us this wonderful story and thank you wonderful story and thank you again and have a wonderful again and have a wonderful thanksgiving. thanksgiving. coming up. coming up. john john kerry, the kerry, the president's president's second choice for secretary of second choice for secretary of state, but could he go down for state, but could he go down for one of the most popular? one of the most popular? and and hermella aregawi, what's hermella aregawi, what's coming up? coming up? >> i'll tell you, coming up. >> i'll tell you, coming up. what do you what do you think think ? ? are are @ajconsiderthis or on our @ajconsiderthis or on our facebook or twitter pages. facebook or twitter pages.
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>> could john kerry end up as >> could john kerry end up as one of the one of the most significant most significant secretaries of start in recent secretaries of start in recent memory? memory? he has he has revived mid east peace revived mid east peace talks, iran's chemica talks, iran's chemica iran's -- syria's iran's -- syria's chemical chemical weapons, and weapons, and iran's iran's nuclear stand nuclear stand down. down. david roy, form columnist david roy, form columnist for reuters, for reuters, two two tine tine pulitzer pulitzer prize winning journalist. prize winning journalist. >> i spent months with him. >> i spent months with him. >> i know you did. >> i know you did. it's looking more and more it's looking more and more possible that when the history possible that when the history of early 20th century of early 20th century diplomacy gets written, it will
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diplomacy gets written, it will be with kerry making the state be with kerry making the state department relevant department relevant again. again. the consensus in washington was the consensus in washington was kerry was a boring if not kerry was a boring if not irrelevant man stepping into a irrelevant man stepping into a boring boring irrelevant job in the irrelevant job in the state department. state department. >> he's >> he's benefited from this benefited from this position, hillary clinton was a position, hillary clinton was a rock star. rock star. the relevance of the state the relevance of the state department is department is the bown the bown administration is administration is bowrm bowrm obama obama administration, in terms of administration, in terms of policy related to syria and iran policy related to syria and iran the white house has had iron the white house has had iron control of that through hilary control of that through hilary clinton and john corey. clinton and john corey. who's going to be interested who's going to be interested in in
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john kerry? john kerry? >> but really he's had more >> but really he's had more break throughs that hillary had break throughs that hillary had in the four years she was in the four years she was there. there. >> to be fair, they are >> to be fair, they are different people. different people. his risk taking which is his his risk taking which is his hallmark will seem wise. hallmark will seem wise. she is a more prudent she is a more prudent person. person. hillary clinton is this hillary clinton is this voracious reared and she would voracious reared and she would read all the briefing papers, read all the briefing papers, john kerry does not read through john kerry does not read through his briefing papers. his briefing papers. he's more of a one man show. he's more of a one man show. she is much more cautious in she is much more cautious in general. general. they are different people. they are different people. he is a high risk high reward he is a high risk high reward secretary of state. secretary of state. we'll see what happens with that we'll see what happens with that approach. approach. >> and she also had to be more >> and she also had to be more careful because she has a careful because she has a political future which kerry political future which kerry probably does not anymore. probably does not anymore. so she may be thinking more so she may be thinking more about the white house, she may about the white house, she may be more risk be more risk adverse. adverse. >> her >> her
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aides flat deny that. aides flat deny that. it is not fair to say she was it is not fair to say she was cautious. cautious. there wasn't there wasn't one particular one particular instance where she was thinking instance where she was thinking about a run and about a run and didn't take a didn't take a chance. chance. kerry visited more in his first kerry visited more in his first eight months in office than she eight months in office than she did throughout hurry entire four did throughout hurry entire four years. years. another journalist said she was another journalist said she was very careful to not try to make very careful to not try to make her name as a deal broker in the her name as a deal broker in the middle east, that's a pretty middle east, that's a pretty risky endeavor and kerry has risky endeavor and kerry has leapt into the middle east and leapt into the middle east and decide that's where he's going decide that's where he's going to make his name. to make his name. >> leading to >> leading to recognition and recognition and positives, they are still risky positives, they are still risky deals and they could come back deals and they could come back and to put it bluntly kick him and to put it bluntly kick him in the butt. in the butt. already, hamid karzai has to already, hamid karzai has to some extent embarrassed some extent embarrassed him. him. kerry and president obama talked kerry and president obama talked
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about drawing down troops and an about drawing down troops and an ongoing agreement with ongoing agreement with afghanistan but karzai has blown afghanistan but karzai has blown that up sort that up sort of. of. >> the afghanistan deal you >> the afghanistan deal you talked about now up in the air, talked about now up in the air, appeared to be done but not appeared to be done but not clear. clear. there was reviving the middle there was reviving the middle east peace talks and that wasn't east peace talks and that wasn't a peace agreement, it was an a peace agreement, it was an agreement to bring the parties agreement to bring the parties back to the table to negotiate back to the table to negotiate for nine months. for nine months. >> which is a point on its own. >> which is a point on its own. >> getting the ball rolling, >> getting the ball rolling, there was a recent agreement there was a recent agreement with iran about an interim with iran about an interim nuclear deal, that is really a nuclear deal, that is really a freeze in iran's program and not freeze in iran's program and not an agreement. an agreement. in january there's going to be in january there's going to be peace talks related to the war peace talks related to the war in syria very low optimism that in syria very low optimism that that's going to go anywhere. that's going to go anywhere. >> and while they are taking >> and while they are taking control of the chemical weapons, control of the chemical weapons, assad still manages to continue assad still manages to continue to kill some of his own people. to kill some of his own people. and in effect one of the issues and in effect one of the issues
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with the whole syria with the whole syria negotiations was it may have all negotiations was it may have all happened by accident. happened by accident. let's look at that exchange that let's look at that exchange that led to this conversation. led to this conversation. >> yes. >> yes. >> is >> is there anything thich that there anything thich that his government -- at this point his government -- at this point that his government could do or that his government could do or offer that would stop an offer that would stop an attack? attack? >> sure. >> sure. he could turn over every single he could turn over every single bit of his chemical weapons to bit of his chemical weapons to the international community. the international community. in the next week. in the next week. turn it over. turn it over. all of it. all of it. without delay. without delay. and allow a full and allow a full and total and total accounting for that. accounting for that. but he isn't about to do it and but he isn't about to do it and it can't be done obviously. it can't be done obviously. >> so he does this, and all of a >> so he does this, and all of a sudden, the russians jump on sudden, the russians jump on board, assad starts saying he'll board, assad starts saying he'll do it and this all leads to a do it and this all leads to a deal. deal. it's been referred to as gaff it's been referred to as gaff diplomacy. diplomacy. >> kerry said it was a >> kerry said it was a purposeful comment. purposeful comment. there were private talks for there were private talks for
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months even before kerry was months even before kerry was secretary of state. secretary of state. >> where this had been brought >> where this had been brought up. up. >> yes, the administrators, >> yes, the administrators, administration, everyone doesn't administration, everyone doesn't want the chemical weapons to want the chemical weapons to fall into the hands of fall into the hands of jihaddists, the jihaddists, the idea idea was was suggested by president putin to suggested by president putin to president obama. president obama. again no one thought the again no one thought the russians were serious, so kerry russians were serious, so kerry puts this out there and within puts this out there and within hours foreign hours foreign minister minister lavrov lavrov was calling him. was calling him. >> you what about his >> you what about his relationship with president relationship with president obama, he certainly was not the obama, he certainly was not the first choice for the job, susan first choice for the job, susan rice whose hopes were rice whose hopes were scuttled scuttled
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with the with the benghazi benghazi , what does he , what does he have with obama? have with obama? >> he has a long history with >> he has a long history with obama. obama. his his first appearance on stage first appearance on stage was at was at the 2004 democratic the 2004 democratic convention where kerry was the convention where kerry was the nominee. nominee. the real break through for kerry the real break through for kerry surprisingly was performing surprisingly was performing as -- this was for debate as -- this was for debate preparations during the 2012 preparations during the 2012 race, kerry race, kerry portrayed another portrayed another tall politician with good hair tall politician with good hair and apparently kerry was such a and apparently kerry was such a good mitt romney that he got good mitt romney that he got under the skin of obama, but under the skin of obama, but there were days and days of there were days and days of preparation for those debates, preparation for those debates, and they kind of and they kind of bonded, they bonded, they both operate with small staffs, both operate with small staffs, and very private people, kerry and very private people, kerry
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is more patrician, he is more patrician, he solidified solidified his position with the president his position with the president because he has taken on the because he has taken on the issues and worked tirelessly in issues and worked tirelessly in the middle east. the middle east. >> you talk about his real big >> you talk about his real big desire for results. desire for results. is there a danger that wanting is there a danger that wanting to achieve things might lead to to achieve things might lead to him settling for less than he him settling for less than he should? should? >> that's the criticism is that >> that's the criticism is that a, he's arrogant and has this a, he's arrogant and has this big ego and he is too eager for big ego and he is too eager for deals, forced the deals, forced the israelis and israelis and palestinians back to the table, palestinians back to the table, where there isn't any room for where there isn't any room for compromise, all these major compromise, all these major issues that have snarled issues that have snarled negotiations for decades, same negotiations for decades, same issue for syria and iran. issue for syria and iran. time will tell how serious those time will tell how serious those break throughs are. break throughs are. >> you mentioned his arrogance, >> you mentioned his arrogance, not that likable a guy but a lot not that likable a guy but a lot of of people people -- not a lot of people
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-- not a lot of people like him but it seems like you like him but it seems like you like like him. him. >> losing the 2004 race to >> losing the 2004 race to george w. bush makes him a more george w. bush makes him a more private person. private person. but he can show his passion for but he can show his passion for foreign affairs, his fluency in foreign affairs, his fluency in french, i think kerry has french, i think kerry has changed. changed. one diplomat said, every one diplomat said, every secretary of state has an secretary of state has an enormous ego. enormous ego. >> you don't get there without >> you don't get there without it. it. >> that's part of the package >> that's part of the package when you're dealing with this when you're dealing with this level of a leader. level of a leader. time will tell about kerry's time will tell about kerry's performance. performance. >> it's a great read. >> it's a great read. david, great to have you with david, great to have you with us. us. happy holidays. happy holidays. >> thank you very much. >> thank you very much. >> let's check in with >> let's check in with hermella. hermella. >> antonio, the day after thanks >> antonio, the day after thanks thanksgiving, thousands of thanksgiving, thousands of people are going to protest low people are going to protest low wages. wages. black friday protest to be the black friday protest to be the biggest yet. biggest yet.
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last year the median wage in the last year the median wage in the united states was about $27,000 united states was about $27,000 the lowest since 1998. the lowest since 1998. though it's not the only one though it's not the only one walmart is the biggest target of walmart is the biggest target of these these protests. protests. activists say most of them will activists say most of them will be taking place across walmarts be taking place across walmarts across the country. across the country. lynn tweeted, i hope it lynn tweeted, i hope it works. works. these people deserve to get these people deserve to get better pay and benefits. better pay and benefits. they are not endentured they are not endentured stlaifs. stlaifs. david said, find a better job. david said, find a better job. even waiting tables you can make even waiting tables you can make more than $250 a week. more than $250 a week. thank you for joining the thank you for joining the conversation. conversation. you can read more at the you can read more at the website website website, website, america.al america.al jazeera.com. jazeera.com. antonio. antonio. >> you probably already have >> you probably already have your big your big turkey for thanksgiving turkey for thanksgiving dinner but was it a little dinner but was it a little harder to find a harder to find a family-sized family-sized
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turkey this year? turkey this year? determining using some sort of determining using some sort of subjective interpretation of subjective interpretation of their policy as to whether or their policy as to whether or not your particular report was not your particular report was actually abusive, because if it actually abusive, because if it doesn't contain language that doesn't contain language that specifically threatens you specifically threatens you directly or is targeted towards directly or is targeted towards you specifically, they may not you specifically, they may not consider it abuse. consider it abuse. they may consider it offensive. they may consider it offensive. and in that case they just and in that case they just recommend that you block that recommend that you block that person. person. >> i don't want to minimise >> i don't want to minimise this, because i mean, there's this, because i mean, there's some really horrible things that some really horrible things that are on are on line, and it's not - it's line, and it's not - it's not just twitter, what has not just twitter, what has happened through social media happened through social media
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and the anonymity of the net is and the anonymity of the net is that you see websites, that you see websites, hate-filled websites hate-filled websites targetting targetting all sorts of groups, popping up. all sorts of groups, popping up. there has been a huge number of there has been a huge number of those that exist as well. those that exist as well. . . >> the season of giving is here. >> the season of giving is here. and last year americans and last year americans generously generously opened their wall opened their wall street.
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street. their wallets. their wallets. but is all that charity going to but is all that charity going to use, claimed to have 41 state use, claimed to have 41 state chapters and about 66,000 chapters and about 66,000 members, but it turns out the members, but it turns out the whole thing was a shax and the whole thing was a shax and the man behind it all is facing a man behind it all is facing a minimum of ten years in prison. minimum of ten years in prison. in eight years he raised over in eight years he raised over $100 million and none of it went $100 million and none of it went to charity. to charity. joining us from washington, d.c. joining us from washington, d.c. is ken stern a is ken stern a former executive former executive of npr, the author of with of npr, the author of with charity for all, why charities charity for all, why charities are failing and a better way to are failing and a better way to give. give. ken rest ken rest start -- let's start start -- let's start with this case. with this case. how does something of this how does something of this magnitude magnitude happen? happen? >> 59,000 with the word veterans >> 59,000 with the word veterans in in the title, you set up a the title, you set up a boiler room you start calling. boiler room you start calling. it's easy to see how they can it's easy to see how they can raise raise
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money. money. without much information, a without much information, a lot lot of harry of harry ied ied donors hearing donors hearing another love stories. another love stories. >> he managed to bamboozle so >> he managed to bamboozle so many people, he was hobnobbing many people, he was hobnobbing with the with the likes likes of george of george bush, bush, john john boehner boehner . . john mccain. john mccain. how did he do how did he do this? this? >> he lawfully >> he lawfully registered registered the the organization as a charity. organization as a charity. came away with a, quote, clean came away with a, quote, clean bilch health. bilch health. he ran a careful operation and he ran a careful operation and it wasn't until two reporters it wasn't until two reporters from the tampa bay from the tampa bay tribune came tribune came sniffing around that it all sniffing around that it all began to began to
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un un ravel. ravel. a lot of what he was doing was a lot of what he was doing was actually lawful and if he hadn't actually lawful and if he hadn't done -- taken a few missteps done -- taken a few missteps there was there was nothing that nothing that regulators or reporters could regulators or reporters could have done. have done. >> as long as they keep their >> as long as they keep their heads above water when it comes heads above water when it comes to legality, they to legality, they have no have no obligation to pay this out. obligation to pay this out. >> the vast majority of >> the vast majority of charities are lawful. charities are lawful. but there are a group of but there are a group of charities who keep somewhere charities who keep somewhere between 90 and 99% of their between 90 and 99% of their revenue to come in for revenue to come in for fundraising costs for overhead fundraising costs for overhead and really for their own and really for their own accounts. accounts. and that's actually sort of a and that's actually sort of a successful business for them. successful business for them. >> in 2008 is when the irs >> in 2008 is when the irs looked at this particular looked at this particular charity and gave it a clean bill charity and gave it a clean bill of health and as you mentioned of health and as you mentioned before there are more than before there are more than 59,000 groups with the word
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59,000 groups with the word veteran in its name. veteran in its name. 1.1 million charities as you 1.1 million charities as you said. said. so it's pretty much impossible, so it's pretty much impossible, from what i've read and i think from what i've read and i think you've written, there's only you've written, there's only about 100 people across the about 100 people across the united states, at the state united states, at the state level, who are actually looking level, who are actually looking at these charities. at these charities. so by my calculations that means so by my calculations that means that you've that you've got one got one person per person per 1,000 charities. 1,000 charities. is it impossible for these to be is it impossible for these to be monitored? monitored? >> very had hill that the >> very had hill that the government can do or does, government can do or does, the the irs approve irs approve 99.8% of the 99.8% of the charities, there's only 100 charities, there's only 100 charity regulators whose job it charity regulators whose job it charities. charities. there is very little in the there is very little in the government level that regulates government level that regulates these charities. these charities. just as in your last interview, just as in your last interview,
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ca ca caveat caveat emptor. emptor. you better do your own research you better do your own research and make sure the charities you and make sure the charities you want to support are doing the want to support are doing the right thing with the money. right thing with the money. >> again as you said most of >> again as you said most of these charities are good these charities are good charities that are doing a lot charities that are doing a lot of very good work. of very good work. so what exactly would you so what exactly would you recommend that people do before recommend that people do before they they donate their money? donate their money? >> so i would say really two >> so i would say really two things. things. and this starts, a lot of what and this starts, a lot of what i've written actually is message i've written actually is message to domiers, the average donor to domiers, the average donor reports putting zero hours and reports putting zero hours and zero minutes into research each zero minutes into research each give. give. that is against an average gift that is against an average gift of $2,000 per household. of $2,000 per household. there's a lot of money at stake there's a lot of money at stake as you said in your as you said in your introduction. introduction. go to reputable sources on go to reputable sources on charities, givewell.org is the charities, givewell.org is the one i always recommend. one i always recommend. charity navigator and guide star charity navigator and guide star provide relevant information as provide relevant information as
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well. well. charity. charity. if the charity -- each charity if the charity -- each charity should be transparent as to what should be transparent as to what their goals are, how they're their goals are, how they're doing, what independent testing doing, what independent testing they have on the charity. they have on the charity. as to their effectiveness. as to their effectiveness. if they don't have that i'd say if they don't have that i'd say move on to the next charity and move on to the next charity and look to find the best. look to find the best. >> you also point out that most >> you also point out that most people give their money based on people give their money based on the brand, on the name of an the brand, on the name of an organization and that's a common organization and that's a common mistake because you say that mistake because you say that sometimes established charities sometimes established charities may not be the best charities to may not be the best charities to give to. give to. >> there's a really interesting >> there's a really interesting study out of harvard business study out of harvard business school a few years ago, looked school a few years ago, looked at the largest at the largest charities of 40 charities of 40 years ago and to today, they years ago and to today, they determined it was exactly the determined it was exactly the same, red cross, salvation army, same, red cross, salvation army, american cancer society. american cancer society. not because they not because they are the best are the best the most effective, it's because the most effective, it's because they're the most familiar. they're the most familiar. if you look at the for profit if you look at the for profit sector, think of the creative sector, think of the creative destruction that goes on there, destruction that goes on there,
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you wonder about the innovation you wonder about the innovation and supporting and supporting the best the best charities. charities. people's lives and fumes are at people's lives and fumes are at stake. stake. the current way that people give the current way that people give is really not supportive of is really not supportive of that. that. >> what people give has to do >> what people give has to do with time and what's happened. with time and what's happened. many times people's spirit of many times people's spirit of giving is motivated by the giving is motivated by the holidays or many times after a holidays or many times after a major tragedy but that actually major tragedy but that actually increases the increases the likelihood that likelihood that they could get they could get scammed. scammed. >> that's true. >> that's true. after katrina the fbi estimated after katrina the fbi estimated there were 2300 fake websites there were 2300 fake websites set up to deprive people of set up to deprive people of their their money money . . sounding sounding names, names, katrinasurvivors.org and mobile katrinasurvivors.org and mobile giving, many more chances for giving, many more chances for
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people to take advantage of people to take advantage of technology. technology. be careful that you support the be careful that you support the best chawrts. best chawrts. >> incredible >> incredible these these are these these are taking advantage of those who taking advantage of those who really really need need that generosity. that generosity. it's an important time to think it's an important time to think about it. about it. thanksgiving. thanksgiving. if you are looking for aturkey if you are looking for aturkey twice the size of steiny tim you twice the size of steiny tim you might be out of look. might be out of look. we'll explain in the data we'll explain in the data dive dive next. next. >> every sunday night al jazeera >> every sunday night al jazeera america brings you america brings you controversial... controversial... >> both parties are owned by the >> both parties are owned by the corporations. corporations. >> ..entertaining >> ..entertaining >> it's fun to play with ideas. >> it's fun to play with ideas. >> ...thought provoking >> ...thought provoking >> get your damn education. >> get your damn education. >> ...surprising >> ...surprising >> oh, absolutely! >> oh, absolutely! >> ...exclusive one-on-one >> ...exclusive one-on-one interviews with the most interviews with the most interesting people of our time. interesting people of our time. >> you're listening because you >> you're listening because you want to see what's going to want to see what's going to happen. happen. >> i want to know what works >> i want to know what works what do you know works? what do you know works? >> conversations you won't find >> conversations you won't find
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>> today's data dive talks >> today's data dive talks turkeys and the curious case of turkeys and the curious case of their shrinking size at least their shrinking size at least for one company. for one company. butterball's kerry butterball's kerry expressed expressed concerns that enough concerns that enough turkeys turkeys wouldn't grow to 16 pounds and wouldn't grow to 16 pounds and why. why. especially mysterious because especially mysterious because the department of agriculture the department of agriculture says the average weight of says the average weight of slaughtered turkeys is up 30% slaughtered turkeys is up 30% more than 30 pounds a bird, more than 30 pounds a bird, other companies other companies such as whole such as whole foods and cargill, said they foods and cargill, said they didn't have time. didn't have time. a major train big y supermarket a major train big y supermarket said it was told to expect half said it was told to expect half the the company's inventory of prior
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company's inventory of prior years. years. but even butterball's size is but even butterball's size is big. big. dpiercompared to a century ago. dpiercompared to a century ago. they have gotten nearly two and they have gotten nearly two and a half times bigger since then. a half times bigger since then. wired wired magazine examined the magazine examined the issue. issue. turkeys got so big they became turkeys got so big they became inefficient breeders. inefficient breeders. farmers started using artificial farmers started using artificial insell nation. insell nation. genes is another reason, the genes is another reason, the artificially insell necessitated artificially insell necessitated birds grew twice the size as birds grew twice the size as those who weren't using the those who weren't using the exact same bird feed. exact same bird feed. so why do we eat turkey on so why do we eat turkey on thanksgiving? thanksgiving? history says, been franklin history says, been franklin wanted them to be our national wanted them to be our national bird and our first secretary of bird and our first secretary of agriculture, alexander agriculture, alexander hamilton, hamilton, will well before the national
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will well before the national holiday in 1863. holiday in 1863. and then there's the the size and then there's the the size again. again. turkeys request feed more people turkeys request feed more people than than chicken. chicken. something especially more something especially more important as our waist lines and important as our waist lines and our appetites have expanded. our appetites have expanded. coming coming up, a college up, a college football star has faced football star has faced shocking shocking allegation he of sexual abuse, allegation he of sexual abuse,
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>> and now a techknow minute... >> and now a techknow minute...
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>> the front runner to win >> the front runner to win college football's college football's most most prestigious prestigious award, is embroiled award, is embroiled in a big scandal. in a big scandal. florida state quarterback jameis florida state quarterback jameis winston has been accused of winston has been accused of sexually assaulting a student sexually assaulting a student off campus the case was, quote, off campus the case was, quote, basically closed when they basically closed when they claimed that the witness had claimed that the witness had stopped cooperating. stopped cooperating. the case, though, picked up the case, though, picked up steam earlier this month when steam earlier this month when some media outlets requested some media outlets requested
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copies of the police report and copies of the police report and connected it to winston. connected it to winston. winston submitted to voluntary winston submitted to voluntary dna test which dna test which matched matched the the accuser's accuser's underwear. underwear. dave, innocent until proven dave, innocent until proven guilty. guilty. winston the top heisman winston the top heisman candidate, would he still be candidate, would he still be playing? playing? >> he would still be playing. >> he would still be playing. because florida state under the because florida state under the bobby bobby bowden regime, that was bowden regime, that was their former coach before the their former coach before the current coach, jumbo fisher, he current coach, jumbo fisher, he had been the coach for 40 had been the coach for 40 years, years, bowden had been. bowden had been. when there were when there were allegations of allegations of social misconduct that he had social misconduct that he had played played favorites. favorites.
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some players got suspended and some players got suspended and some didn't. some didn't. star players have taken place at star players have taken place at big football schools around the big football schools around the country. country. so florida state did something so florida state did something very smart. very smart. they enacted a team wide set of they enacted a team wide set of guidelines. guidelines. that said anybody accused still that said anybody accused still gets to play until they are gets to play until they are formally formally charged. charged. no matter what they are then no matter what they are then taken off the field until those taken off the field until those charges are dealt with and the charges are dealt with and the case is case is dismissor adjudicated in dismissor adjudicated in some way, shape or form. some way, shape or form. you can see the intelligence of you can see the intelligence of that policy in a case like this. that policy in a case like this. it immediately takes off the it immediately takes off the table, if this table, if this wasn't wasn't jameis jameis winston, florida state can waip winston, florida state can waip wipe wipe its hands and say, it's the its hands and say, it's the policy. policy. >> no pr surprise the florida >> no pr surprise the florida
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state is backing their state is backing their quarterback. quarterback. >> in cases of sexual assault >> in cases of sexual assault cross with the hero worship that cross with the hero worship that we often see in sports and yes, we often see in sports and yes, innocent until proven guilty, innocent until proven guilty, absolutely. absolutely. but what you're seeing on a lot but what you're seeing on a lot of somebody media outlets, i've of somebody media outlets, i've gotten gotten anonymous e-mails anonymous e-mails disparaging the young woman in disparaging the young woman in question, in a character question, in a character assassination of people who assassination of people who bring charges against sports bring charges against sports heroes, i'd argue in florida heroes, i'd argue in florida state i've never seen it as state i've never seen it as intense as this. intense as this. it's almost as these football it's almost as these football crazed fans are crazed fans are preemptively preemptively preemptively preemptively defending jameis winston because defending jameis winston because he is leading them to football he is leading them to football glory. glory. >> part of the argument that's >> part of the argument that's raised an even bigger scandal raised an even bigger scandal that the tallahassee police were that the tallahassee police were doing that too. doing that too. that plawr from the accuser -- that plawr from the accuser --
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the lawyer for the accuser says the lawyer for the accuser says that tallahassee police told her that tallahassee police told her that tallahassee is a big that tallahassee is a big football town and if she pursued football town and if she pursued the case her life would become the case her life would become miserable. miserable. the question is what was the the question is what was the intent that police had there, intent that police had there, was it trying to warn her or was was it trying to warn her or was it trying to warn her don't go it trying to warn her don't go there? there? >> no matter how kind the intent >> no matter how kind the intent may have been, there are no may have been, there are no words how profoundly words how profoundly inappropriate that is for a law inappropriate that is for a law enforcement official to say enforcement official to say that. that. i mean give me a break. i mean give me a break. this young woman is in this young woman is in tallahassee for her not to know tallahassee for her not to know that this is a football mad town that this is a football mad town and she would be taking her and she would be taking her privacy and her well-being into privacy and her well-being into her own hands by coming forward, her own hands by coming forward, for her not to know that, for her not to know that, strains credulity to put it strains credulity to put it mildly. mildly. so no matter what happens out of so no matter what happens out of this case, maybe the case will this case, maybe the case will be dismissed against jameis be dismissed against jameis winston, maybe this will go winston, maybe this will go forward. forward. we don't know what will happen we don't know what will happen but no matter what happens, the but no matter what happens, the allegation from the young allegation from the young woman's camp come forward, the woman's camp come forward, the police officer said maybe you
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police officer said maybe you don't want to be doing that i don't want to be doing that i think is grounds for think is grounds for investigation in and of itself. investigation in and of itself. heads should roll if that is heads should roll if that is found to be true. found to be true. it is beyond it is beyond inappropriate, inappropriate, especially what we know about especially what we know about the number of women who don't the number of women who don't pursue the courts and don't pursue the courts and don't pursue legal justice in cases of pursue legal justice in cases of sexual assault and of course the sexual assault and of course the overwhelming majority of those overwhelming majority of those cases don't involve a famous cases don't involve a famous football star. football star. >> one of the cases where it >> one of the cases where it didn't involve a famous football didn't involve a famous football star but where a town star but where a town undoubtedly covered up for undoubtedly covered up for football stars, the town football stars, the town defended them, now attorney defended them, now attorney general mike de wine of ohio, general mike de wine of ohio, announced a coach, a principal announced a coach, a principal and a superintendent, so this is and a superintendent, so this is just how deep this went. just how deep this went. >> absolutely. >> absolutely. and in a town lie and in a town lie s.tuebenville, s.tuebenville, an economically depressed place, an economically depressed place, a place where the football a place where the football program is a major hub of not
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program is a major hub of not just the social life of the town just the social life of the town but the economic life of the but the economic life of the town, the cultural life of the town, the cultural life of the town, they have a stadium with town, they have a stadium with enough seats to actually fit enough seats to actually fit most of the town inside of it, most of the town inside of it, that's that's how big a deal it is, it how big a deal it is, it is the football policeman that is the football policeman that people feel like has put the people feel like has put the high school program on the map. high school program on the map. you see all the ingredients you see all the ingredients there, it's created a very there, it's created a very distorted culture where these distorted culture where these young people, 15, 16, 17 years young people, 15, 16, 17 years old are in effect playing the old are in effect playing the tune that the grown-ups dance tune that the grown-ups dance to. to. you can see the ugly truth, with you can see the ugly truth, with mike de wine who by the way mike de wine who by the way has painstakingly come forward has painstakingly come forward with this, this is a long with this, this is a long investigation, it is clear based investigation, it is clear based on the indictments that i read on the indictments that i read that they think something very that they think something very ugly happened in ugly happened in steubenville steubenville happened there, which happened there, which wasn't the wasn't the reactions of the parents reactions of the parents involved but where to go with involved but where to go with
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the football players. the football players. >> the >> the hacking group anonymous, hacking group anonymous, if that group hadn't gotten if that group hadn't gotten involved the case would have involved the case would have gone away. gone away. in some cases, i don't want to in some cases, i don't want to completely compare these, but in completely compare these, but in tallahassee had not tallahassee had not some media some media group not passed this, that case group not passed this, that case would have gone away would have gone away too. too. >> these anonymous group could >> these anonymous group could have five times as much time have five times as much time behind bars as the sexual behind bars as the sexual assaulters themselves but assaulters themselves but there's there's a big lesson, right, has a big lesson, right, has to do with social media. to do with social media. as we see in tallahassee, social as we see in tallahassee, social media media giveth and social media giveth and social media taketh away. taketh away. even though this even though this woman woman 's 's woman's woman's
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anonymity can be protected, the anonymity can be protected, the spoils of being a star athlete, spoils of being a star athlete, clearly, this issue in clearly, this issue in steubenville went terribly steubenville went terribly wrong. wrong. on monday, ten on monday, ten former former players filed a players filed a class action class action lawsuit lawsuit against against the nhl. the nhl. the cases are differently. the cases are differently. >> yes, the cases are very >> yes, the cases are very different. different. the number one difference is the number one difference is just the scope of the cases. just the scope of the cases. in the national football league in the national football league you're talking about over 4,000 you're talking about over 4,000 forward. forward. this is a case of 10 plaintiffs this is a case of 10 plaintiffs coming forward. coming forward. >> won't that grow? >> won't that grow? >> yeah. >> yeah. i'll tell you one of the things i'll tell you one of the things that is going to make this that is going to make this particularly interesting is the particularly interesting is the fact that the way the nfl case fact that the way the nfl case ended ended was that is national was that is national
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football league football league was indemnified was indemnified and didn't have to admit gift in and didn't have to admit gift in open court. open court. what's interesting is whether what's interesting is whether that will affect the that will affect the nhl players nhl players ability, their play in the ability, their play in the national hockey league, not in national hockey league, not in the juniors or minors coming up the juniors or minors coming up in the nhl that led to their in the nhl that led to their post-concussive post-concussive syndromes. syndromes. >> the nhl took some action >> the nhl took some action sooner than nfl and they sooner than nfl and they resisted what might have helped resisted what might have helped them. them. >> there has been >> there has been a code of a code of conduct in hockey about the way conduct in hockey about the way you are supposed to play the you are supposed to play the game. game. for a lot of players even the for a lot of players even the idea of wearing helmets which idea of wearing helmets which has now taken place over a has now taken place over a bizarre. bizarre. there is a hockey league near me there is a hockey league near me where the players actually wear where the players actually wear to.
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to. signs on the back of their signs on the back of their uniforms so if you are rushing a uniforms so if you are rushing a plear from behind it's like a plear from behind it's like a cue to make you hold up and cue to make you hold up and stop, for you to touch them. stop, for you to touch them. for a lot of young players that for a lot of young players that is not hockey. is not hockey. these lawsuits are important these lawsuits are important because they get out a lot of because they get out a lot of the information to educate the information to educate parents and young people that parents and young people that there may need to be some there may need to be some generational changes in how we generational changes in how we play these sports so people play these sports so people don't suffer for it decades down don't suffer for it decades down the line. the line. >> there's a lot of suffering >> there's a lot of suffering down there. down there. dave, great to have you on. dave, great to have you on. the show may be over but the the show may be over but the conversation continues. conversation continues. on our on our website. website. are are on @aj consider this. on @aj consider this. and on our twitter and facebook and on our twitter and facebook pages. pages. happy thanksgiving. happy thanksgiving.
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>> welcome to the news hour. from aljazeera's news centers, these are the main stories. outrage as young women in egypt sentenced to years in prison. >> in london with the news, including e.u. leaders trying to get ukraine dance i go to their tune, not russias, but moscow seems to have the better news. >> in belgium, change in the route to

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