tv Erin Burnett Out Front CNN October 24, 2019 4:00pm-5:00pm PDT
service is tomorrow in baltimore, former presidents barack obama and bill clinton are the speakers. i interviewed him on many occasions, he was a great american and lawmaker and a wonderful, wonderful person. we will miss him. erin burnett out front starts right now. out front next, breaking news. democrats discuss what articles of impeachment would be against trump. plus the secretary of state dodging impeachment question, the same secretary of state who listened in on trump's call with the president of ukraine. does mike pompeo have explaining to do? and a major reversal by joe biden now opening up to big money. will it hurt biden with voters? let's go "out front". good evening. i'm erin burnett. out front tonight, the breaking news, lawmakers and aides telling cnn the democrats are
now discussing what articles of impeachment against the president will look like. this includes how many of them there will be, what exactly they may include. make no mistake, this is a pivotal moment for the country, the articles of impeachment are it, right? that's what they're going to vote on. it's not just a do you impeach him. it's on exactly what? bullet point by bullet point on whether there is a vote to indict the president of the united states and we are told there's disagreement on exactly how to go about drafting the articles and we'll have much more on those crucial details and the breaking news in just a moment, but it comes as republicans are launching a new attack on the investigation, ignoring the damning evidence of a quid pro quo with ukraine and instead focusing on the process. here's senator lindsay graham with a stunning admission. >> i'm not here to tell you that donald trump's done nothing wrong. i'm not here to tell you anything other than that the way they're going about it is really dangerous for the country.
>> so that is trump's staunchest defender on ukraine. unable to say that the president of the united states did nothing wrong which is pretty incredible if you're going to be the staunchest defender and you can't say he didn't do anything wrong, but graham is defending him on is saying that the people investigating trump are hurting their country and he says his anger is at how they're going about the investigation. the problem is that self-righteous indignation does not add up. here is lindsay graham defending republicans conducting the exact same kind of investigation, impeachment, in the exact same way behind closed doors in 1998. >> the depositions, i think, will determine whether or not we go forward with hearings. i think it is a very smart thing is to depose these people and find out what they've got to say and not drag this thing out unnecessarily. >> very smart thing to depose them, right? well, i guess the times have changed and the president has changed so graham's view has changed, but graham and trump's other allies are worried after
bill taylor, trump's top diplomat in ukraine laid out that evidence of a quid pro quo telling lawmakers, democrat and republican on the committee in the room that president trump withheld military aid until the ukrainian president announced an investigation into joe biden. so today the best graham could do to push back against those allegations was to say this -- >> did he talk to the president? >> he talked to ambassador sondland who talked to the president. >> that's hearsay. ? hearsay? taylor is a meticulous note taker and he served under all presidents beginning with reagan and his first ambassadorship since george w. bush and in his opening statement which took him an hour to read because he had it in such detail, and the hand picked million dollar donor ambassador including quotes like key phrases because he'd taken so many notes. ambassador sondland had recommended to president zelensky, i will leave no stone unturned with regard to, quote,
investigations. when president zelensky spoke with president trump. investigations he said was a term he used when talking to him referring to biden. he put it in quotes. the facts that tonight have democrats openly discussing those actual and informal articles of impeachment and republicans like lindsay graham yelling about the process. manu raju is out front live on capitol hill. else are you learning about what democrats are saying where theyor possible articles of impeachment? >> it is very early in the process on moving forward of votes and drafting articles of impeachment. there are discussions among rank and file members and people that sit on key committees about how they're restructured and there's multiple hours of impeachment to vote against some and vote for others including abuse of power and the obstruction of justice
and obstruction of congress. among those discussion, but what democrats will tell you is that this investigation that's happening is the initial phase, the closed-door deposition phase and they've just added two more witnesses to a round of four witnesses who will come next week week and another one on saturday and the people from the state department and the national security council and how and why that ukrainian aid was held and how much it was tied to the president's demand -- to have ukraine mount investigations that could help him politically. after those closed-door deposition, that's where they look at the more public phase when we can look at public hearings and then they'll actually draft a report that will be sent over to the house judiciary committee that would be the committee that would consider actual articles of impeachment. so as you can see, we're in the first phase of several key steps that could eventually lead to what many democrats are saying that it is inevitable that the president would ultimately
become the third to be impeached in history. erin? >> manu, thank you very much. out front tonight, house majority leader steny hoyer. i appreciate your time tonight and of course, as you heard, we understand democrats are starting to discuss what articles of impeachment would look like and your colleague david sisilini says members of congress would be talking about what the articles can include. what can you tell us? >> the speaker and i both said that we want to wait to get all of the facts on whether or not we make decisions to move forward. i'm not surprised that members are talking about this possibility, that possibility and the other possibility, but what we are doing now is the fact finding investigation portion of our responsibility under the constitution. when that's completed then it will be timely to discuss, if it is prop tore move ahead, how so,
what should the articles of impeachment be or article of impeachment be and i'm sure members are discussing that themselves. so do you think -- you're using words leak if and all the facts is it still an "if," do you think after going as far as what you've seen, are you putting out there that you might not do it? >> no. what i'm saying is we have not done it at this point in time and we're waiting to conclude the investigatory part of the investigation and that's proceeding now and when we complete that then i'm sure we will sit down if the articles are required and appropriate then we will discuss what articles they will be and whether they'll be one, two or more. >> when you say one, two or more. we do understand that among democrats you're still dealing with, you and the speaker with two camps and those who want to keep any articles focused on the
quid pro quo in ukraine and those who want them to be much broader including things from the russia investigation and from the mueller report. are you open to it being broader than the quid pro quo and ukraine? >> i'm certainly open to it based upon what the facts dictate that we ought to say. i think there are a lot of members who believe that the american people get that it is improper to be asking a foreign head of government to involve himself in our elections. they think that's not the right thing to do under the constitution and laws of our country or under election laws. so that i think that most members believe that is something that most americans believe should not have happened, should not have occurred and they believe it's an abuse of power and we don't believe that anybody is above the law including the president of the united states. so that articles, i think, if we move ahead, and i keep saying if
because we have not concluded the investigatory process yet and we ought to wait until we do that, but clearly, i think you're right. >> you're saying it from a procedural point of view and not an intellectual point of view. >> correct. >> some of the most damning testimony that we have seen publicly at least when we saw the prepared remarks came from bill taylor. the top u.s. diplomat in ukraine and he testified there was a quid pro quo. no military aid unless joe biden was investigated. >> i want to play most exchange between manu raju. >> he talked to ambassador sondland who talked to the president. >> that's hearsay. >> you don't trust him? >> if rudy giuliani had a 15-page statement saying he did nothing wrong wouldn't you want to know more? would you accept that statement? i've got nothing against bill taylor. it's the process. >> do you buy, congressman, that
lindsay graham who we just showed he defended this process in the past, do you buy it's an issue with the process or do you think he's trying to make this witness look untrustworthy? >> i think the process argument is a distraction and is phony. what is at question here is the substance of the president's actions. >> did he act and did he abuse the power he has as president in not giving the 391 million to the ukraine and russia. we know it is headed by putin and we don't know if the president or putin have talked about this and russia has been advantaged by what happened in turkey. so i think mr. graham's argument with respect to process is simply a distraction, a pounding on the table. >> i also want to ask you about one other thing and that is the
service of your friend elijah cummings. i know you spoke today, and the house speaker nancy pelosi and others, not surprisingly, perhaps to many american, and congressman mark meadows. here is some of what mr. meadows said. >> sondland sdreebed it as an unexpected, but for some of us that know elijah, it is not surprising. perhaps this place in this country would be better served with a few more unexpected friendships. i know i've been blessed by one. >> what can -- what can democrats and republicans learn from congressman cummings who was able to move his friend mark meadow to tears as he remembered him today?
>> first, i think, any american who did not know elijah cummings, nevertheless, they watched him on television and they heard him speak, they knew he was a man of great principle, of great empathy, civility, passion for civil rights, but at core, he was a good human being. he was a human being who respected others. he was a human being who would listen to others. i think that's what mark meadows was saying. we need more of that. unfortunately, we have a very confrontational politics in our country, which is reflected in our congress, and that, i think, it disturbs the american people. my advice is to elect people like elija cummings and it is bassed on principle. >> thank you. out front next, trump's
secretary of state grilled by reporters about rudy giuliani in ukraine. his answer, you'll hear it in full. >> trump's top diplomat in ukraine among some republican, but does that mean they will say it publicly? and presidential candidate beto o'rourke is out front. will he qualify for the next debate? ...they work together doing important stuff. the hitch? like you, your cells get hungry. feed them... ...with centrum® micronutrients. restoring your awesome...daily. centrum® feed your cells.
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new tonight, secretary of state mike pompeo says he isn't worried president trump's impeachment inquiry will damage his reputation. >> i don't think about that stuff. i work hard. i do the right thing as best i can tell every day. you all talk about this noise an awful lot. you all are fixated on this. the state department, you should know, is not. >> pompeo clearly irritated during an interview with the wichita eagle. he was obviously in wichita today. case in point this exchange about five minutes later over president trump's decision to abandon the kurds in syria, and
what he said there was what good really is the work -- i'm sorry. we do have that. okay. >> what good really is the word of the u.s. in light of the president's treatment of the kurds? does that undercut u.s. credibility? >> the whole predicate of the question is the word of the united states, i'll give you a good example. the word of the united states is much more respected today than it was just two and a half years ago. >> the whole predicate of your question is insane. how does he feel? out front now, greg bower and pete naftali and congressional reporter, and evan peres, evan, let me start with you. pompeo was on the phone when trump was on the phone with president zelensky.
since then pompeo has refused to -- and he's not concerned about the impeachment inquiry. do those things square? >> it doesn't and here's why. there is a parade, a virtual parade of people from his department, from the state department that is heading to capitol hill to provide these depositions. there is clearly a disconnect between the way pompeo is trying to portray things and the way things are behind the scenes at the state department. we know that one of his closest aides actually resigned in protest essentially because of how things were being handled. so i think a big part of the story, erin, is exactly what was going on behind the scenes under pompeo as, you know, the ukrainians was trying to figure out where the aid money was and the whole effort that rudy giuliani was running behind the scenes and pompeo has a view of all of this and so i think this is why i think, you know, he's trying to put on a brave face,
but there's a lot more to come from his department on this. >> and, tim, not only did pompeo obviously show his frustration there, but he was asked about rudy giuliani's work in ukraine and he's in his home state and he gave a bunch of interviews and maybe he thought these were friendlier than these seem to have been and they are in kmw radio in kansas and say do you support the work rudy giuliani was doing in ukraine? this is a simple question, right? pompeo starts off as secretary of state, and we have a singular mission with respect for ukraine and he goes on about that and he's asked again. so was mr. giuliani's efforts aligned with the state department? again, simple answer. that's not what we've got. pompeo said we've been working tirelessly and this is refusing to talk about giuliani. >> the giuliani unofficial channel is a real problem for
secretary pompeo and here's the problem. he's either corrupt, that is secretary pompeo or he's a bad manager and secretary pompeo did superbly at west point. he was an army officer. >> he's a very well-respected person. >> he also understands process. >> he was an executive officer in the u.s. army. he oversaw supply management issues. so he cares about process. the giuliani channel was something either he didn't know about in which case he's not running u.s. foreign approximately see or he knew about it and he bears the same responsibility as giuliani. it's a problem for him. either way he's in trouble, either as a bad manager. >> is it possible that mike pompeo didn't know about this and i say that not to be coy, but he's on that call at the very least where the president of the united states and the president of ukraine talked to rudy giuliani, and you've got
$391 million of aid held up for these investigations as we understand it at this point. it would seem to me that it's just obvious that pompeo knew about it. >> i think it is obvious. anything is possible, but it does not seem likely. both given his role as secretary of state, the fact that he office that call, as you mentioned and the fact that he seems to be very close to the president and the president seems to rely upon mike pompeo for an awful lot. so the idea that the president would be pursuing this sort of shakedown effort without trying to get mike pompeo to help him with it or at least keep him in the loop just doesn't ring true to me. >> so rachel, i want to ask you about another moment today in this series of interviews that secretary pompeo gave, in one of them he was asked about something bill taylor said in his testimony which was bill taylor was worried about what was going on in the ukraine. he talked to john bolton and bolton said tell pompeo
directly. write him a memo. taylor does it. he gives it to pompeo. he understands pompeo gets this cable. so pompeo is asked about it today, right? what did pompeo know and when did he know it? let me play that exchange for you, rachel. >> what did you do? >> i'm not going to talk about the inquiry this morning. >> did you relay his concerns to the president? >> look, i came here today to talk about workforce development. i came here today to talk about the great things going on here in kansas. >> rachel, he -- he was not ready for that sort of questioning in his home state. that's clear, and i don't say it to be funny, but that warrant a stro strong performance. >> kansas is a red state and he thought he'd get more friendly press there. here's the problem. the impeachment inquiry is a big, big problem for him in terms of politics. right now republicans are very much behind the president
evening with the support for impeachment growing and republicans were with nixon back then and then the impeachment inquiry started unraveling things and republicans left and if something like this were to happen to trump and we're hearing republicans express frustration with what they're seeing and hearing reported. there is a possibility that he will be a casual tee and this is a guy who is young and ambitious. he wants to run for senate and thinks he has a political future and these are questions that he doesn't want to answer. bill taylor, from my understanding, he took notes and right now the state department is blocking this from the impeachment investigators and they'll go to court at some point and they'll try to get these and bill taylor himself, perhaps he gives it over to congress. it will be a matter of time before we see the details of this and what he did or did not do to help his colleagues. >> you talk about his ambitions
and presidential ambitions maybe part of the reason he does spend time in his home state. he has made a bet on president trump. it's an echo, including the phone call with the ukrainian president. here is the president and the secretary. >> the conversation was absolutely perfect. absolutely appropriate. >> found that to be wholly appropriate to try to get another country to stop being corrupt. >> she said i wasn't pushed, meaning pressured. he wasn't pressured at all. >> the most important reaction was from president zelensky himself who said i didn't feel pushed. i didn't feel pressure. >> nobody has been tough or russia than donald trump. >> this administration has been tough or russia than any other administration. >> i didn't put in pompeo siding with trump on the cia on the murder of jamal khashoggi. the word echo is not accidental. >> it's just not credible to
support the president to the extent that mike pompeo seems to be supporting him. look, it's one thing to serve in this administration and there's talk whether people who serve in the cabinet will be tarnished or not. some of my friends serve in the administration and it's a whole other thing to support what the president does and says and i am afraid for his sake that mike pompeo is seen by many as going too far. >> all of you stay with me because our conversation will continue. >> next, the prd calling members of his own party calling them human scum, and the doubling down on the sentiment and the word choice. how many of the swing voters are having second thoughts as they learn the allegations against the president. any of them? >> if it was out in the open and everything was discussed and he did something wrong impeach the did something wrong impeach the guy. we see patterns.
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corrupt president in our nation's history. when i called for his impeachment two years ago, washington insiders and every candidate for president said it was too soon. but i believed then, as i do now, that doing the right thing was more important than political calculations. and over eight million people agreed. we proved that there is no challenge that americans can't meet when we work together. i'm tom steyer, and i approve this message.
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new tonight, a game changer. republican sources telling cnn's jamie gangel that the opening statement from bill taylor, that, of course, was the top u.s. diplomat to ukraine is, quote, reverberating among house republican members and that his testimony was so detailed and so specific that it is having an impact. another gop source admitting, quote, it points to quid pro quo. everyone is back with me. tim, as we pointed out as rachel was saying, look, this person's reputation is pristine, okay? this person gave a one-hour long detailed opening statement with quotes all over the place because of the detailed notes that he kept. >> uh-huh. >> it defies reason and reality
to say that he is making these things up or it's untrustworthy or whatever that lindsay graham is implying, right? how significant is it that republicans now according to jamie's reporting are responding to that saying, look, this is an issue. reverberating was her word. >> bill taylor is a non-partisan american patriot. it's very hard to argue that he was some kind of covert never trumper. he accepted a position in the trump administration to be a fill-in in the ukraine. before that he was our ambassador to ukraine for george w. bush. it's very hard to argue he's some kind of democratic plant. you can't, seriously, argue that. so then you have to take his evidence on their merits, and what he is saying is that you had an informal channel right around the experts at the state department that was seeking a quid pro quo on behalf of the president of the united states. that's very damning. the fact that republicans are
beginning to murmur about it is because donald trump has made his defense hinge on whether or not it was a quid pro quo which is a very dangerous thing for him to do. in the mueller instance, he talked about collusion and he knew he hadn't done it. in this instance, it's clear from the evidence we have now that it's highly likely, highly likely that there was a quid pro quo in which case president trump lied to republicans. don't forget, republicans have asked him and he lied about it. >> do you think this could force more republicans to reconsider their support for the president when it comes to impeachment and are we looking at what justin came out in favor of impeachment and then had to leave the party and one or two republicans, at most, supporting it in the house. >> i think it the reverberate. let me pause on ambassador taylor. this president who went out of his way to avoid military service has made a habit of
criticizing veterans including vietnam veterans like john mccain, john mueller and now john taylor. as a veteran, i'm appalled by it, but it is, i guess the upside of the president going too far once again is that it will have an effect on republicans. look, there are many republicans in the house who will support this president no matter what, to the very bitter end, but there are a lot of thoughtful republicans in the house who have to be offended by this, veterans and others who are looking at this and saying this is not normal and at some point it's going to be too much, and we will see -- mow one wants to be first, but it will start happening. >> then there's the senate majority leader john thune. he came out yesterday and said something significant. he knew it was significant. he knew anything not supporting trump is significant. quote, the picture coming out of it based on the reporting that
we've seen i would say is not a good one, right? he's talking about taylor. so then today he -- he tried to walk it back. here's john thune. >> i went back yesterday and actually read what was said, and there is -- there's a lot of secondhand information, a lot of sort of hearsay -- not hearsay, but in the sense that it was passed on. it wasn't a direct conversation. >> so -- so -- so look, rachel. i'm curious, from your reporting covering congress what do you think is happening there? obviously, never mind the quotes and the detail, but the passing along. donald trump calls sondland and bill taylor takes notes and puts it in quotes and john thune is hiding behind gordon sondland and bill taylor. >> as if he didn't read it carefully the first time when he was critical of the president. when republicans speak out against trump, they don't do it
willy-nilly, they're arc trade of this guy. him trying to walk it back, it's siggi significantly. he's been lashing out and saying the republicans need to do more to defend him. the next day they listened to his advice to quote, take the gloves off and they stormed the impeachment proceedings and held them up for five hours and you have lindsay graham introducing this resolution saying the house democratic impeachment inquiry goes against the norms and it's too secretive and therefore unfair to the president and so trump is pushing people to fight for him right now, and for those that do speak out his allies go, and republicans are still popular with the base. >> what watchel -- the president of the united states actually called them human scum. human scum, and now not only did
he call them human scum, but his white house press secretary went on television to say -- to defend it, to actually defend it. here is stephanie grisham. >> the president yesterday called the never trumpers scum. does he regret that? >> no. no, he shouldn't. the people who are against him and who have been against him and working against him since the day they took office are just that. the fact that people continue to try to negate anything that he's doing and take away from the good work he's doing on behalf of the american people, they deserve strong language like that. >> it's kind of incredible, evan, to hear, just, you know -- >> it really is sort of incredible language to hear, but that's what the president wants. he wants people out there and that's one of the things he's missing right now. you notice rudy giuliani has been absent from the airwaves and that's what the president right now. >> is missing and he wants someone using combative language
and the kind that gets his blood flowing and not much of that is happening and so what we will see in the next few day, erin, you will see a bit of a retooling of the white house message machine. we know they're looking to bring on someone to communicate better. you heard lindsay graham talk about how to better message the president's point of view and that's what you will see in the next few days. >> if you're not with him, you're -- if you're against him you're human scum. well, they're, factive effectiv communicating that. in a state won by single digits are weighing in on the president. joe biden no longer swearing off super pac money. it's going against a whole lot of democrats in the field and beto o'rourke who has closed the door to big money responds. i've been plotting to destroy you. sizing you up... calculating your every move. you think this is love?
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tonight, president trump railing against house democrats calling the impeachment inquiry, quote, the greatest witch hunt in american history and a total scam. we have gone to the crucial swing state of north carolina, a state trump won by four points in 2016 to find out whether voters are standing by the president in the must-win swing states. martin savidge is out front from ♪ ♪ >> it's fair season. whether you like your bacon on the run or on a stick, it's at
the north carolina state fair. ? thank you. here, you can satisfy your wildest deep-fried dreams. we've come to measure voter appetite for impeachment. >> i think it's a waste of the taxpayer's money. >> do you think the president did anything wrong? >> absolutely. >> you don't follow the impeachment thing? >> i don't know much about it at all. >> it's a tilt a whirl of opinions. >> in this state that won trump by less than four points, he is angry for even considering it impeachment. >> i don't think he's broken the law and i wish they would do right for america versus wasting their money, our money on a lost cause. >> most we talked to were unmoved by days of revelations against the president. >> do you think it changes the minds of trump supporters? >> i do not.
the ones of us who support him will continue to support him. if you look at the economy there's no way to design that weir doing pretty amazing. >> sherry price hasn't changed her mind? >> he don't need to be taken out. he's the only one that will tell the truth and he can't be bought. >> the new and growing criticism by trump backers and a perceived lack of openness. >> if it was out in the open and everything was discussed and he did something wrong, impeach the guy. i just don't like the secrecy. it just sounds wrong the way they're going about it, that's all. >> dennis englebright is an exception. he also voted for trump, but he's starting to believe the president may have done something wrong. at first i didn't. i thought they was after him, but every time somebody talks more about it all -- besides what they think of impeachment, we'd like to know how they're following developments and there, too, folks are divided. >> gina hatch did vote for
trump. >> i follow it pretty closely. >> you do? >> i do. i try to stay educated. >> do you follow this? >> not much. i try not to, actually. >> how do you avoid it? it seems to be everywhere. >> i watch a lot of espn. >> reporter: another question that we put to voters was impeachment worth it given the fact that there's an election a year from now? that broke on party lines and supporters of the president say no and those opposed to the president say yes, but they all agreed on one point and that is if the question should the president remain the president? that they all said should be decided by voters. erin? >> and that, marty, is a really important point for a lot of people to hear in washington. next, joe biden is coming out swinging in a new interview. we will play something that he said next that's pretty interesting. and jeanne moos on trump trying to explain this. >> we're building a wall in colorado.
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tonight, a major reversal by joe biden. the former vice president says he is now open to accepting done eggs from super pacs. the shift coming after biden discovered he had far less cash on hand than four of his rivals, just to give you a sense of the scope, right in all of the way down with the 9 million. look at bernie sanders, 33.7, and 25.7. it goes against much of his rivals. eight of his rife will as, eight is sworn off big pac money. the former vice president has been unable to generate grassroots support and now his campaign is endorsing an effort to buy the primary. that's not how we defeat trump. out front now presidential candidate beto o'rourke and congressman, thanks for being with me. i want to make it clear, you're not taking donations from super pacs. do you agree with sanders that
biden is trying to, quote, buy the primary? >> we see far too much >> we see far too much from those who think they can buy the outcome in our elections. i agree. there is no room for political action committees, or superpacs. there is no truth to the idea that corporations are people and money is speech, and they can spend unlimited amounts of money to involve themselves in change and undermine our democracy. i haven't taken pac money for more than five years. we're running a grassroots campaign. everyone who has gone to beto o'rourke.com and donated to us has fueled this effort to make sure that we can get out to voters. that's way that our democracy should work, and i'm going to stay with my commitment not to take pac money or superpac money in this race. >> all right. obviously joe biden no longer doing that. cbs just released a clip of an interview with joe biden where he was asked about the trump administration. i wanted to play one clip. this just came in, congressman,
so let me play it for you. >> think of all the really solid people that were left, that started off in that administration. they've all left. they've all left. all the talent is gone. they've left or great americans like rudy giuliani is still engaged. what's going on? people see this. they're thugs. >> do you agree with the vice president, his word, this administration full of thugs? >> i think the place i hope that we agree on is that the president has broken the law of this country, has committed crimes in secret that he's tried to cover up, and then committed them out in the open for the entire world to see. and if we allow this to stand with impunity, then we will have set the precedent that some people are above the law in this country. so i hope that our focus in common will become on insuring the president is impeached, that there is accountability and justice at the end of the day,
that the members of the senate republicans and democrats alike are armed with the facts and do the right thing not for their party, not for their president, but for this country and for our future. that's what i'm focused on right now. donald trump has broken the law, must be held accountable. >> and congressman, obviously people can see where you are tonight. we have it up on the screen. you're in des moines, iowa. and cnn, our miguel marquez went there just the other day. he spoke to voters about impeachment. what they had to say is perhaps surprising to some. i wanted to play just a couple of them for you. >> to me, things seem kind of minor, i guess. >> minor in that all politicians do this sort of stuff? >> yeah, i'm sure they all do. >> it all becomes a hum. it all becomes a drone, a background noise. and we've also come to expect it. >> does that give you pause? they expect this kind of behavior. they're not -- by the way, both of those are people who had voted for president obama before they voted for trump. so they're not -- they're not
the core trump base as some may define it. does that give you pause when you think about pursuing impeachment as opposed to doing this as the polls? >> no, it doesn't. it just raises the urgency that we pursue impeachment accountability and justice. we've known for years now that the president has been working with foreign governments, has been trying to cover up his actions and about a struck justice in the process. and so perhaps those that your correspondent spoke to, having seen that we've done nothing over the last three years to hold him accountable might wonder whether he really has committed crimes or if there is anything wrong in his behavior. that's why it is so important to send the unambiguous signal through impeachment in a trial in the senate that this is not something we condone or accept in the united states of america. and furthermore, we have to come to the conclusion that regardless of how this polls or how politically popular it is, the future and the fate of this
country hangs in the balance. we've got to do the right thing while there is still time to do the right thing. >> you rolled out plan today, congressman, about the opioid epidemic. you wants to give states $100 billion to help states who to help people who are struggling with that horrific addiction. you surprised a lot of people when you said you supported decriminalizing opioids for personal use. why do you think that will help this crisis? >> when someone fears that if they come forward with an addiction or substance use disorder that they will be arrested and incarcerated, then they're less likely to come forward and they're more likely to die. we've lost the lives of hundreds of thousands of our fellow americans over the last decade. there are some simple steps that we can take to stop that. number one, removing the stigma and making sure that you will not become justice involved if you try to get the help you so desperately need. number two, making sure that we fund the resources necessary for treatment and long-term recovery. and the number three, and that
is important, we hold purdue phar pharma, johnson & johnson, the pharmaceutical corporations responsible for the devastation and death accountable for their actions. if we fail to do that, then we can expect to see the same kind of effect and consequences in our communities. >> all right. thank you very much, congressman o'rourke. i appreciate your time. >> thank you. >> and next, jeanne on trump bothing about building a wall nowhere near mexico's border. woman: what gives me confidence about investment decisions? rigorous fundamental research. with portfolio managers focused on the long term. who look beyond the spreadsheets to understand companies, from breakroom to boardroom. who know the only way to get a 360 view is to go around the world to get it. can i rely on deep research to help make quality investment decisions? with capital group, i can. talk to your advisor or consultant for investment risks and information. till he signed up for unitedhealthcare medicare advantage.
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when the border wall is no longer on the border, is it a wall? jeanne moos explains. >> reporter: president trump always likes to say he is doing something no one else has done, but building a border wall? where there's no border with mexico? >> and we're building a wall in colorado. we're building a beautiful wall, a big one that really works. >> reporter: he got a big beautiful ovation in pittsburgh, but to colorado's democratic governor, the idea is a dog. >> even first graders know that colorado is in the middle of the country surrounded by other states. >> reporter: great wall of colorado, mocked one tweet, and new mexico will pay for it. if you fall for a wall in colorado -- ♪ i got some ocean front property in arizona ♪
>> reporter: president trump later tweeted that he'd said it kiddingly. but with politicians covering so much ground, no wonder they lose their geographical footing. misstating the number of states -- >> i've now been in 57 states. >> reporter: or being in one state saying new hampshire and saying -- >> what's not to like about vermont in terms of beauty of it? >> reporter: trust the press to take pleasure in geographical bloopers such as when president trump made a solemn visit to paradise, california. >> we just left pleasure. >> paradise. >> paradise. >> reporter: citing the border wall in colorado incited a flood of doctored maps. critics made a point of using sharpies to make their point. senator patrick leahy shared some of the most popular ones. the southern border was adjusted in maps replacing the hurricane dorian one the president so famously amended. if president trump keeps rearranging things, he is going
to need a bigger sharpie. ♪ from the lakes of minnesota >> reporter: to the walls of colorado, jeanne moos, cnn. ♪ from sea to shining sea >> reporter: new york. anderson starts now. good evening. we have new reporting tonight on when the public will get to see public impeachment hearings on who may testify as well as the drafting of articles of impeachment against the president. and in the face of that, there are new signs tonight that his defenders still have few good answers on the actual substance of the ukraine affair, even though behind the scenes they are reportedly troubled by it. cnn's jamie gangel citing republican sources saying senior diplomat william taylor's testimony this week was, quote, a game changer, unquote, that is still reverberating within their ranks. privately, that that is. publicly, these republicans for the second straight day avoided directly confronting or discussing the evidence he gave. instead, they objected to the way th