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there to work with them and will give you what ever helped by that you need . . ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> for free transcript or to give comments about this program visit us at q and a.org..org. q&a programs are available on c-span podcast.
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>> wrote this month we are showing book tv programs during the week in primetime. if you are not the mayor with our weekend features, but tv on c-span ten to takes -- are signature programs are in-depth, like three or look at one others look, with questions from viewers, via phone, email via phone, e-mail and social media. in depth errors the first into afterwards as a one-on-one conversation of an author of a newly released nonfiction book and the interviewer who is either a journalist, public public policymaker, or legislative family with the topic. often with an opposing
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viewpoints. that airs every saturday at 10:00 p.m. easter. we will take you across the country visiting book festivals come other events, and book parties or others talk but their latest work. but tv is the only national network devoted exclusively to nonfiction books. book to be on c-span2. television for serious readers. >> this week on q&a, author and hudson institute sr. feller author herman discusses his book douglas macarthur, american warrior. ♪ arthur herman, what made douglas macarthur so controversial? >> guest: a number of things. i think think there is an aspect of his personality, an aspect of his politics. and then there is also simply the what can i say, the business of the man. and i and i will
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start with that first, here is someone who is a major american figure for more than half a century. someone who commanded american troops in action and help to shape american war policy, and now were, but three world war worse. world war i, world war ii and the cold war. here is somebody who really, with the possible exception of franklin roosevelt was presided at more events and made more decisions that shape the history of the 20th century united states then i think anybody else. with the exception of fdr. there. there is politics, he was a conservative republican which did not rub well with the democrat presidents he to work with, particularly fdr and harry truman. but he wasn't a conservative
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taft republican. he was not someone is taft republicans were interested in overturning aspects of the new deal and the incipient welfare state when he runs for president in 1952. he was more moderate than that. and that offended offended some conservatives on that point. he is a resolute anti-communist at a time when again depending on the left is more sympathetic, more willing to work for the soviet union. and he was a man himself, man himself, he was somebody who always goes off the air that he is the smartest person in the room. if you do not know it you are going to find out very soon. the decisions he may i made from the best possible, from the radius judgment and therefore really should not and cannot be questioned. this is something that rubbed
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other people with similar large-scale egos the wrong way. it led to friction and conflict. both with american presidents, two in particular, fdr and truman. but also it led to conflicts with people within his own service. and his own service. and in the other branches of the u.s. military in that half-century plus career. >> host: when did you decide you wanted to write a big book audit? >> guest: the idea of a big book on macarthur was planted in my head by an editor at random house originally. i had actually thought about macarthur has a great follow-up to some of the other biographical work that i had done. i had done the joe mccarthy book for example. the war in the pacific
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particularly the southwest pacific intrigued me when i was working on my book on gandhi and churchill. it was one of those moments when someone flashes a sign that you and suddenly everything converges and you realize this is something i would not only like to do but something that could be really different from the kinds of books that have been written about macarthur in the past and the way in which to rethink and reevaluate who this person what, what his real significance was, what what his virtues really were that made him one of the most adored and agitated figures in american history but also what were his flaws and what were the things that made him in many ways unpleasant and even hated it by millions of people. >> host: here's some video from the 1952 republican national convention where he spoke. the reason we show this is not necessarily because he was at the convention, but so people who have never seen him get a chance to see what he looks like. the video video is not very sharp but let's watch it and ask about it. >> i speak with a sense of pride that all of my long life i have
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been a member of the republican party. [applause]. as before me was my father. a supporter of abraham lincoln. [applause]. i have an abiding faith that this party if it remains true to its a great traditions can provide the country with the leadership which as in the days of lincoln will bring us back to peace and tranquility. >> host: there was a 1952 cut he died in 1962. where was. where was he in his life at this point? >> guest: that was an interesting clipper couple of reasons. it's hard to believe that man was 72 years old. he looks great. everybody who knew macarthur
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were always stunned at the degree to which even at times of the enormous stress like during the korean war and then leading the southwest pacific during world war ii, people were stunned by the fact that he always seemed to be very healthy and very strong. he was talked about how tall macarthur was. he was under 6 feet. it was just that he stood so tall and erect that he had this bearing about him that made people at a couple of inches to his actual height. the other thing i will remark about that is that is not macarthur at his best. that is a speech of a man who at that point is deeply disappointed. to really get a sense of where macarthur is in terms of his rhetorical power you have to back to his speech to the joint session of congress right after he returned from korea. in which the house arose as a body over 50 times to applaud
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lines in the speech. and of course the ones that finishes with the famous old soldiers never die, they only fade away. a soldier who is done his duty as he sought. that is probably macarthur at his best. this is is an interesting clip for this reason. it is a disappointed macarthur. macarthur had hoped that that speech at the joint session of congress would be propelling him to get in the white house and getting the republican nomination. in fact he really got almost nowhere. he was swamped by the taft and eisenhower forces. eisenhower's the man is the former chief of staff who back in the days in the philippines, the person he looked down on as a junior officer -type protége. he. he ends up with the nomination instead. >> host: did he support him? spee2 he does. he comes he comes out of paper that. up until the convention he took
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his ten delegates that he had when that convention set. he was originally taft supporter. he was a little upset with how eisenhower handled the campaign and treated him. after the election they become more reconciled. eisenhower reaches out to truman and asked his advice on how to end the korean war which looks like it is on the point of becoming one of those endless wars that we have gotten used to but which was a new experience for americans. he was a disappointed man. he was a tired man. the rhetoric sounds on that clip sort of old-fashioned, old stage. what was interesting is that's not how we usually see macarthur. macarthur is someone who early on understood the importance of trademark look as a way to project leadership. >> host: like the cover of the book.
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>> guest: the corncob pipe, which by the way he did not smoke. he actually preferred cigarettes and cigars. but because there is a trademark corncob pipe which he personally designed because he knew that was the image. that was macarthur. you see the corm cop pipe. the hat, the cap with the scrambled eggs on top and the ego, which he designed himself. he had a habit-in new york when he lost the hatter were out he would have an exact copy sent to him. the letter jacket, the air force jacket that he would work. the ray-ban sunglasses. all of these things are what it is that made douglas macarthur in icon. all of them very consciously worked on in his thinking about himself as a leader because he saw these as ways in which to communicate that sense of leadership, that sense of confidence, which inspired his troops from really the first
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world war all the way to the darkest days in korea. >> host: in this clip he mentions his father, arthur macarthur and he point out in the book how the two of them are both in the military. can you give us, do they both got a medal a medal of honor. how did that happen? spee2 the metal of honor that arthur macarthur earned was for his actions during chattanooga, leading the charge up lookout mountain. you have to remember he is 16 years old when he goes off to war. he becomes agitated the 24th wisconsin. when you look at pictures of him you had a feeling that you are looking at someone who is just out for halloween as a union soldier. some kid. but that is him. that is the real arthur macarthur. he is a civil war hero. war hero. he is severely wounded several times and at the end of the war he becomes lieutenant colonel
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commands his regiment, 24th wisconsin. he is not old enough to vote but he is old enough to command the union army regiment. after the war he had a choice of careers. he could have. he could have gone into politics, could've gone into this this, he was a wisconsin hero. instead what he what he did was to remain in the army. as i described in the book, there is a series john ford movie -- out of films like fort apache and she worry yellow ribbon where he goes and brings his wife and his sons are all born there. his career is in many ways a pathway to douglas macarthur's. one of the things i wanted to do in the book was make it clear for the first time just how much the linkage between macarthur, the sun and macarthur the father, how strong that link really was. most of them talk about the mother and we will talk about
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her in a minute. she is a very powerful figure in macarthur's life up up until her death in 1935. but arthur macarthur is the person who teaches him about the art of war. who teaches him about the honor of service in the u.s. military and u.s. military, and also the one who opens his eyes to america's possibilities as a great power in asia and becoming the light of democracy and freedom in asia as the european colonial powers and empires fall apart. arthur macarthur was the general betray us of the philippine interaction. he is one who figures out a way to defeat the philippine interaction at the end of the spanish-american war. and by rules of -- who he he
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begins the process of reconstruction of military governor there. and then there's a whole series of reforms that bring the philippines, won the spanish colony into the war to give it a rule of independent law cords and sanitation he even writes the textbook on philippine history he's a master -- when i play done in the book he goes to japan to administer the activation of postwar japan. everyone is amazed at his ability to pull the society together and to make these important radical changes in some ways and to juggle all of
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the forces in all of the different pressure groups within japan and washington and the other allies whose social effortless skill. part of it as i explained in the book is he learned it from his father. his father's experience in the philippine. >> reminds will go there, did you say in the book that he finish first at west point? >> guest: he is probably the finest record of a student at west point as anybody since robert e lee. a record that in many ways still stands unchallenged to this day. >> can you tell us i know fdr's mother given money when he went to harvard, why did did douglas mcarthur's mother moved to west point? >> guest: she moved there to do two things, to help supervise his studies, she, she lived in a rooming house outside of the grounds of west point, there they are, that is young douglas there on the right, his mother mary pinky hardy, pinky macarthur as she was known. she looks fermentable in that picture and she was.
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when i started this book i was very much led by other previous biographers of mcarthur to sort of think of her as this domineering woman, almost a lady macbeth type and pushing and propelling her son forward and her career. what i came to realize, the more i learn about their relationship and how it was built, i realize this is the second thing she did at west point. she provided strong, emotional support and guidance for him with a really tough decisions he had to make. macarthur throughout his life conveyed an image of a man who is totally certain of himself, completely in command, someone who is a sure of every decision he makes and choices he makes and from that point on that's one of the characteristics everybody knew about him. underneath underneath was a very insecure, somebody who needed support, filled with
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self-doubts, mary macarthur, his mom provided that support. he find it later on with his second wife, jean macarthur but her role i came to realize more and more was really much more constructive and i do not think he could've had that kind of career he did or achieve that kind of heights of success in her career in the army if she had not been there to support him and provide help and guidance. >> host: i hate to do this to you. >> guest: go ahead. >> host: short, quick, points from the different points of his life that go into and you'll see what did he do that was significant world war i? >> guest: he did two things, one was what earned him a medal of honor, nobody had any doubts about it was his incredible bravery and action, leading
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troops of the 42nd division, rainbow division as it was called and commanding a combat gate in that division. he wins seven silver stars in world war i. >> host: what does that mean? spee2 the silver star means for exceptional bravery under fire. his a staff officer. he goes and leads his troops from the front. he says i have to go and see what is happening for myself, what our guys are going up against and what the trainers and what the enemy position looks like. so he goes into action on a regular basis. seven silver stars and nominate for a medal of honor but in the end they say no, and his it goes without question, however if he had been -- i think were going
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to skip the metal of honor this time around but i want to stress this but if he and the general staff help to's structure the forces that went over, he helped build the 42nd division as one of the first units go over there and to organize which divisions from the u.s. army, it was not really ready for this large-scale conventional warfare in europe, he was really the mastermind, the whole campaign that leads so is he is a huge influential figure, as a young major brigadier general. what year did he go to europe and fight? spee2 in the fall of 1917. the main action that he and the 42nd division saw 1918. >> host: was he married then? >> guest: know he was still single. he would've been in his 30s, and he had to be a brigadier general in his 30s go to world
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war two, what is the major accomplishment. >> guest: from my standpoint he manages to turn what looks like a massive defeat in the philippine into a springboard victory. the philippines comes in same time as pearl harbor. the same time with the b-17 force that macarthur and anybody else in the army air force thought were going to protect those islands, he is completely outcast in terms of equipment and quality of soldiers, where he can rely upon in the campaign, and yet in the read treat of the baton he manages to fight the japanese to a standing, to a standstill. he is pulled out from there by orders from franklin roosevelt, contrary to this macarthur did
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not arrange to leave the philippines and the fortress where he was held up with a handful of his staff. he intended to fight to the death. he assumed that would be his fate in the philippines. but for various reasons he's ordered to go to australia to help organize the war effort. >> host: let me ask about the geography roles. the philippines are located near >> guest: closer to japan. they are in a sense as macarthur understood there may be a springboard for a successful invasion of japan with the course of the war reversed it. >> host: who on the philippines in those days? >> guest: is still american protectorate. and corregidor was in manila bay, it overlooks the harbor, it had been built originally by the spanish and then reported by by the americans as a way to control a block, naval forces
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from the sea. but japanese did did not bother with it, they came overland. and what about baton, that sticks sticks out as an oversight's phone. just to the west of manila bay. that's where the army finally had to make it stand against the japanese. >> host: i know this is quick, the next step would be when he was in charge of japan after the war, for, for five years, what did he do there? >> guest: and his campaign is in the southwest specific area which had very scant supplies and turned it into major victory he took over that right after he had left corregidor. and three blood years of fighting in new guinea and then up to liberate the philippines. >> host: wears new guinea?
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>> guest: it is the large island, second-largest island in australia just sits north of australia and it was a jumping on place for the japanese to dominate the whole area. >> host: how many were under his control? spee2 in the early days perhaps 5000. in the end he commands probably the largest military the united states has ever assembled for the philippines. then he was to be replaced in charge of the crew command for the final onslaughts for operation downfall. that does not happen because we drop atomic bombs. >> host: he didn't know that we're dropping the bomb. >> he reads about it and the stars and stripes. the army
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newspaper. he was aware the bomb had been developed. he had been given that information. that it was going to be used and when it was going to be used, all of this was kept secret. >> host: what he have used it? >> guest: i think not. he felt that the bomb had this tremendous potential to completely undermine and to moralize the japanese. he was more in favor of using the demonstration as opposed to the actual dropping. and for the rest of his life, macarthur looked upon nuclear weapons as being something that should really mark the end of warfare and was part of his whole campaign towards unilateral -- and did he have children? what it is mother live at that point? >> guest: as i explain of the book, is the first biography that had access to the oral history that his wife did in the late 1990s before she died. this is it jean macarthur. the second way. they met on a voyage out voyage out to the philippines. he went to assumed command of
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basically the philippine military mission the united states had set up to build a self-defense force, basically an army that could be used to defend the army. his mother was with him, very ill at the time. i do not think it is coincidental that after his mother died, he was buried in the philippines. not so coincidental then that his friendship with jean faircloth was her name, a girl from tennessee, not far from where his father had fought during the civil war at the battle stones river. my great-grandfather fought there is a matter fact. it is not incidental that their friendship blossomed into a romance before she returned to the united states i had a secret agreement to marry the next time he was in the states. >> host: what did he divorced his first wife? >> guest: the divorce comes
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about 1927, 1928. >> host: i1928. >> host: i had it down as 1927 from your book. why did they get divorced? >> guest: he was unhappy marriage. he fell hopelessly in love with her when he was at west point. he is the heir to very large wall street portion, he was very vivacious, she was delightful, she is very sexy. and of course she was enormously wealthy as well. i think she was just a resistible to someone like macarthur. it was only i think after the marriage they began to realize that he had picked the wrong person. she was not going to be this kind of strong, emotional support that he really needed. that is mother who disapproved
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very much of the marriage was able to provide and who jean was finally able to step up and provide. while at the same time providing that same kind of vivacious, outgoing, sexy personality that made her the perfect companion for him as wife, mother, and is confident. >> host: why did you have access to the oral histories of his wife? >> guest: it's now at the macarthur memorial archives in norfolk virginia where i spent a good deal of time working on this book. it just had not been available. the other other biographies that came up for that was done. she promised to douglas that she would not do an oral history. and her son also had made that same promise to her. do not do that. our lives together a private. the public record about myself douglas would tell her, is public. but our lives together is private. just before she died i think i think she realized it was important perhaps to ignore
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that promise and to carry forward with it. we are are all very glad you did. it's fascinating. >> host: he died and 64, she lived to be. >> guest: i think she dies in 2002, you two, you might want to check on that. >> host: how long did they live at the waldorf facility? >> guest: till his death in 1964. i'm not entirely clear as to how long she continue to live at the waldorf historian by herself. but her son, arthur mcarthur -- the waldorf historian apartment was a place that really was for him, not just a refuge but also all watchtower where he could keep track of current events and have distinguished visitors including american presidents. it was a place together the mementos from his years in japan. everything else, viz. pre-earlier life had wanted all been destroyed during the recapture of manila during world
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war ii. everything had gone up in smoke with a hotel manila. he is a man who had to rebuild his life, rebuild the mementos, mementos, the favorite things around him and his family, several times. those are remarkable things about him that i would want the biography. this was somebody who is not down and beaten down so many times in his career when it could've been written off as being someone who is at the end of this career in the end of his youth. yet he always comes back. it's a store an airstrike. . .
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>> speed and with a cloud hanging over it the way was treating the chinese and a country whose reputation is is in tatters and manages to rebuild its economy, restore a sense of pride and give it a new democratic constitution as the same we have today to bring japan integrated into the family of industrialized democracy
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of which we are a part in europe. it is an amazing achievement he had a lot of great ideas that came from members of his staff also important instructions that came from washington about what to do. but in the and the ability to orchestrate the reconstruction of the entire country of 80 million people , to do that from 1946 from the outbreak of war in korea with the conflict unfolding that is an amazing achievement i believe if he did not have his father's example before him how to deal with the high country to build that confidence, but you have to give him credit for the way in which he could do this in the face of intense
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opposition. >> what else did you find. >> there was a lot of material dealing with macarthur's career we haven't talked about that yet former soviet with the animal bank have been interwoven with discussions but this is a biography that has taken full account of the degree to which allied intelligence played such a vital rule of macarthur's excesses of the degree to which the first japanese naval code then the army code to provide him with the means by which to outsmart his japanese opponents on
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the battlefield and conduct those polled moves his first comprehensive biographers did that know about any of this with the degree at the be another biographer talks about but now we can see overall impact with the new perspective not just as macarthur as military commander but understanding the art of good intelligence >> guest: right now we live in washington d.c. i and the senior fellow at the hudson institute. this is number eight of my books. cspan2: was that your number
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one bestseller. >> guest: yes it sold well over half of million copies worldwide at this point. bob is above i am enormously proud and it is good to start on the direction. cspan2: writing a book like this when did you start? >> guest: that is probably about right for the manuscript version with the adjustments. cspan2: have you got to the next book? >> guest: i will be doing with harpercollins the history of the british navy
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to build the local system is on woodrow wilson london and the year that shook the world 1917 because those two momentous decisions going into world war was then london toppled the provisional government and to install be revolutionary government and how naiad ricocheted and shaped and world history that is the next book. it will be shorter. cspan2: moving to the next war it is what people have already seen but meeting general macarthur you can
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explain why that happened. >> i have discussed dead many times with the military advisers and i believe all of my heart the course we're following is the best we may it evident that macarthur did not agree with the policy. therefore we have considered it insane -- essentials so there is nobody confusion. >> is the deepest personal regret i find myself compelled to take this action general macarthur's of the greatest military commanders but the cause of world peace is much more important than any individual. cspan2: what happened? >> guest: this is a moment when you realize they clashed of personality is a
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collision of defense or social and economic forces the fact is that neither douglas macarthur had a strong dislike of truman and truman had a dislike of the u.s. forces to 25th 1950. but macarthur robbins believed the way to end this conflict to painfully push back from chinese intervention as that pushes back that the second time around after that first liberation beacon talk about
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those landing 51 until but that is the highlight of his military career that shattered the ability to liberate not just p'yongyang that the chinese with a massive gold back down to push the chinese back but macarthur's plan is you will end in this war for the victory to cheat - - to beat those forces perhaps the use of nuclear weapons as a means been through which the chinese cannot resupply their army the risk
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of a substitute for victory the tremendous racial and disagreed. to return the u.n. forces to free south korea from communist domination to allow the chinese to remain in place at the boundary line before. cspan2: macarthur was outspoken why he felt his hands tied by the administration with the decisive defeat of course, he has done all his career but for truman, this was a moment that he had to decide if he could continue
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and have someone embrace that stalemate strategy and to keep its mouth shut at the same time. cspan2: did macarthur answer directly to the president credit. >> this is what i explained the biography:his moves but the joint chiefs and enjoyed as actions that they have taken from a military point of view reproaching the strategy that was taken by from a political standpoint that the push forward might do to things to force the european allies to drop out
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to be continuing beyond that 38 parallel but it also may trigger a response from stolen tuesday that chinese ally may launch offensive in europe for to be on the borders of germany. cspan2: how many american troops are in the 38 parallel? >> 400,000. cspan2: i mean now. >> guest: from that point of view there is not a peace treaty informally there is an armistice proposal macarthur dismissed the idea is that believed he could be dismissed he believes dahlin would not intervene and
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would not risk a fall all war and macarthur was right and we found that through the soviet archives. fastball and got the entire operation was botched from the beginning me from the north korean dictator that if north korea invited - - invaded with chinese help then they would intervene from knapweed:baseball when -- t10 said decision or call. . is it necessary to remove macarthur obvious i guess probably it was was it the right policy? history may have a different judgment for the long-term. it is dotted by necessary blunders but the acceptance
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of that stalemate may fit into that. cspan2: became home now we are through the first and second world war and we saw him address the republican national convention and that comes together in one chapter is choline - - call the saving fdr and the way to mix clean this - - explained best. andy is talking to fdr's will make his assessment was morgan wants to despite the most dangerous man in america. he revealed his true thinking to one of his brain trust i have known him for
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years he said you never heard him talk the more pretentious style in never doubts are argues suggest for what he thinks this final. >> maybe a little bit of background to this is that the point that douglas macarthur is chief of staff. pages on enter a debacle a public-relations disaster bet they would oust world war veterans with those
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bullet would daunt - - and government notices they were promised an end they set up tent city end refused to go when ordered it was voted down by congress and the police wanting to control the crowds and macarthur showed upper to supervise the operation. and it was ugly a big propaganda campaign launched by the communist supporters with this fascist killer innocent men and women.
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>> and he probably is doomed from his reelection if the great depression didn't sink his chances the bonus army did. ever betty assume he would
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be. but that interested in cooperation after roosevelt became president and to everybody's surprise they become partners to rebuild the u.s. army. >> and to give an the background that macarthur confessed paralyzing not show began to creep over me that had and the feeling of discomfort he grew more reckless when we lose the next war speaking in a place usually be served as an american boy to lie in of
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lead to spit out his last curse i would the name to be roosevelt, not macarthur and then he said she must not talk that way to the president of united states. what is that all about blacks in dash about budget cuts the army was slashed but they had serious act to from day and appropriations macarthur erred chief of staff coming in with further cuts as it unfolds in the office secretary of war and then to fight it out over those applications. how crippled with the u.s. are vp if they would be
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dying needlessly. cspan2: is from general macarthur or fdr by expiry that comes from his own account but that is the way he described it many years later be denied these are the memoirs he writes just before his death for the first time exposing back the few weakness that sense of stout one dash self doubt in the moment of crises that would come to him. to realize that could end his career in this is a
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situation and to speak up to take as strong position that this is not from a position of strength but position of weakness he knows what he said was wrong bisbee should not have confronted the president and the scene on the steps yet the secretary of war says you just saved the u.s. army and wine is named isabel b. t7 the fact there is a major eisenhower to think he was an aide for an army officer and one of
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the things to bear in mind. and with that supreme commander and then after the campaign with command experience but just about the only officer who has seen military combat in world war one. and how they could speak with his libyan - - olympian but isabel from the philippines in the air lead thirties' very charming just
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the sort of thing to catch the attention of an army officer recently divorced macarthur's mistress he is invincible lead monogamous during his divorce any strike separate she is nicknamed dimples because she was the actress in the first philippine movie to show a kiss on fell. >> couple of decades younger a very close relationship may december or may november pdf and arranges to come into the united states wall the army chief mustaf over
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here on 16th street my wife and i first moved to washington dc remote for apartments i did not know at that time it was a historical landmark but it soon fell apart as he realized however attractive and alluring, she was much too young and inexperienced and shallow for him. and i am watching the clock his ex-wife gets in but what is that about?
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that is very vivacious but the nevilles and are very similar happy to spread that nasty gossip and of the sexual prowess or lack as the husband and the real issue at hand if there would be alive will when dash level suit that came out in the odd way it was reflected a very complicated story. into spring on him and he had written to her to exchange back-and-forth. cspan2: your range foray a settlement for those to be buried forever in the archives was able to get
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those letters. they are quite something be have to say douglas macarthur in the end those letters that they wrote to the first wife and the recording you have to say but not only was the great military commander also a master of erotic pros in ways that are striking. >> he got involved in did not like him with your this complex over which branch of the army is a good lesson
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that it is across the different divisions and had a fixation me to feel the money should be put into that. if and he knew about the affair spinet you don't hear stories like that same night just one last clip what he said the republican convention 1952. >> our people are desperate for which we revives hoping
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with the tax levied on every source of revenue as a cd astronomically rising public debt end of the average children and our children's children, and through that frugality no desire of the economic and fiscal stability or prospect of return to the idealism in collective tranquillity of our fathers. cspan2: isn't that something quacks. >> nabi

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