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tv   American Perspectives  CSPAN  November 7, 2009 11:00pm-2:00am EST

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right now on "showbiz tonight." rihanna's tearful tell-all. rihanna opens up on camera for the very first time about being brutally beaten by chris brown. the painfully candid emotional tell-all seen today on good morning america. >> tonight, whyry anna got back together with chris, then finally walked away. was it wrong for her to speak out just as she's promoting a new album. the tyra banks weight controversy. tyra's remarkable revelations about her big weight loss.
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wait, isn't this the same tyra telling women accept the way you look and be proud of your body. >> kiss my fat ass! >> tonight the hot debate. is tyra being a hib cat. jessica simpson's outrage over her sister being fired at mel rose place. jessica, could it be ashley is a bad actress? tv's first provocative news show starts right now. hello, i'm a.j. hammer broadcasting tonight and every night from new york city. >> hello, everyone. i'm brooke anderson coming to you with the hollywood version. rihanna's tearful tell-all. >> i want you to forget everything since she was beaten by chris bowden and what heiss
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been going through. what we're going to show you will startle you. we've now since her first interview since that terrible night. rihanna holding nothing back and her pain and raw emotions and embarrassment and powerful lessons she hopes every woman can learn from her beating. >> don't react off of love. f love. >> blunt and powerful words from rihanna in her first tv interview since she was brutally beaten by her then boyfriend chris brown. rihanna tells diane sawyer she wants victims of domestic violence to do what she herself did not do, get out. >> come out of the situation and look at it third person, because love is so blind. >> "showbiz tonight" can tell you, it's a shocking interview, where an emotional rihanna
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finally talks about what it was like to be caught in a painful cycle of domestic violence. >> she feels like she owes it to her fans to finally speak out and break her silence. >> hovistic details after chris brown left her battered and bruised last february. there was more shock soon after when we all learned this super famous couple was actually back together again. >> they reunited and she received a lot of flack about that. >> even though brown's image was destroyed after the attack, rihanna started to suffer as well when she went back to him. >> people worried she going back to her attacker would send a signal to other women that this is okay. this is something that you should put up with. >> there are a lot of women who experienced what i did. but not in the public. >> rihanna tells diane sawyer the ordeal she went through was a million times worse because it was so public and she was
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embarrassed. >> why be ashamed? >> because that -- i didn't want people to think that's the kind of person -- that i fell in love with that person. that's embarrassing. that's embarrassing that that's the type of person that i fell in love prosecute. so far in love. so unconditional that i went back. >> but rihanna tells diane sawyer why she ended things with brown once and for all. >> when i realized that my selfish decision for love could result into some young girl getting killed, i couldn't be held responsible for telling them go back. chris -- even if chris never hit me again, who is to say that
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their boyfriend won't? who is to say they won't kill these girls. >> going back to chris brown is not an option to rihanna. as part of his sentence, brown has been ordered not to have any contact with rihanna for five years. now, rihanna's career is back on track. she has collaborated with jay-z and her new album releases this month. with her new tv interview on abc and her new cover story in "glamour" magazine, it's clear speaking out to her is another big priority to rihanna. >> this happened to me and it can happen to anybody. >> one thing that's really important to rihanna now is being a spokesman for other women. that's part of coming out and breaking her silence and showing the world what happened to her. >> now that rihanna is breaking her silence, will women embrois
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her as a role model. >> now, carlos diaz, a correspondent for "extra." >> this was a powerful interview with ron ark, how do you think she did? >> i think she did amazing. i've interviewed her several times. when people were calling for her to speak out for domestic violence, i said she's a kid. even who though she's confident on stage, when you talk to her she's very much like a kid. she came in on her own in this interview, even correcting diane sawyer when it takes how many times they go back after domestic abuse, rihanna says actually it's more like eight or nine than seven. she came across amazingly strong and confident. >> you're right. she is only 21 years old. we have to keep that in mind. tameka, what's your take? >> you know, i was very
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impressed with rihanna. everyone wanted her to speak out nine months ago when it happened, however, she wasn't ready. i don't think chris is ready to. but she's taken time, listened to supporters, jay-z and beyonce, people in her inner circle and she's handling it brilliantly. chris brown might want to take a note out of her page. each time he comes out it seems to early to sort of conceptualize what he wants to say on this matter. >> maybe he should look at this and say this is what i should do, give it a little more time. be genuine about how i feel, too. i have to tell you when i was watching her interview this morning with diane sawyer on good morning america, i was startled about her confession about why she left chris brown for good. watch what she said. >> when i realized that my selfish decision for love could
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result into some young girl getting killed, i couldn't be held responsible for telling them go back, even if chris never hit me again, who is to say their boyfriend won't. >> there has been so much speculation about why it did take rihanna so long to open up about the night she was attacked. when you hear rihanna now, carlos, it seems to me she really struggled with how her actions would affect other women in abusive relationships. it seems to me she was almost tormented by it. >> in honesty, people here and a lot of different places saying, oh, she's having a new album coming out, that's why she's speaking out. but like tanik, a said she considered her role. if she had thrown that out
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flippantly, matter of factually she didn't want anyone hurt as a result of what happened with her and chris brown, but when you see her say that, you can almost see the emotions, going through each of the emotions as each word comes out of her mouth. >> she's given this serious, serious thought. she always made a surprising revelation on good morning america. she said she felt ashamed by what happened. watch what she told diane sawyer. >> i didn't want people to think that's the kind of person -- that i fell in love with that person. that's embarrassing. that's embarrassing that that's the type of person that i fell in love with. so far in love. so unconditional that i went back. >> tanika. quickly, are you surprised she was embarrassed? she was the victim here. >> no, i'm not surprised. she said also in the interview if the only piece of her life that was left private and now
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exposed to the world, overnight she became britney spears, i'm very proud of her. i've been interviewing her since she was a young girl who didn't know how to do an interview to now sounding so eloquent, so conscious about what she was saying. i think she did a smashing job. >> tanika, carlos, good to see you. >> tyra banks has a brand-new controversy over her weight. you remember how she told everyone to kiss her fat ass because women should accept their bodies. now she's showing off her dramatic new weight loss. if tyra showing off a little hypocrisy here? also, could it be try? is mariah pregnant? a brand-new interview with mariah. also this. >> somebody is drunk down strahanton road. >> she should know. >> okay. are you behind them? >> no, i am them. >> you am them. that's unbelievable.
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you heard right. a woman calls 911 on a drunk driver. she am them. it's showbiz caught on tape. showbiz this weekend on hln.
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all right. did you see this? a forklift accident at a booze warehouse in moscow. watch this. the driver lost control of the forklift and, bam, slammed under all that booze. vodka and cognac, $150,000. please, don't worry, the driver was okay. >> he was very lucky. welcome back to "showbiz
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tonight." i'm brooke anderson in hollywood with a.j. hammer in new york. help me, i'm drunk. this is unbelievable. a woman called police to report a drunk driver, herself. it's not the first time something like this has happened. here is cnn's jean moos for "showbiz tonight." >> reporter: mary stray did not stray from doing the right thing, turning in a drunk driver. >> 911. >> somebody's really drunk. >> she should know. >> okay. are you behind them? >> caller: no, i am them. >> you am them? >> yes, i am them. >> okay. you want to call and report you're driving drunk? >> yes. >> the wisconsin woman later called police she had had seven or eight brandy and cokes. >> are you still driving right now? >> yes. >> do you want to stop driving before you get into an accident? >> yes, i will stop. >> she did with a blood alcohol level twice the limit. this isn't the first time
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someone driving drunk called 911. it happened just last year in washington state. >> 9/11. >> i just don't 'n' if i'm safe to be driving. >> why wouldn't you be safe? >> i'm pretty drunk. >> in fact, he felt so bad he spoke to a kcq reporter without reveealing his identity. >> killing someone else isn't something i want to do. i started feeling bad for being on the road. >> remember the michigan police officer who called 911 who confiscating pot from suspects. >> i think we're dying. >> how much did you have? >> i don't know. we made brownies and i think we're dead. i really d'oh. >> he didn't die but resigned. >> i don't usually drink and drive. >> his motorized recliner you up
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for bid on ebay, complete with radio, cup holder, the famous recliner anderson crashed into a parked car last year while driving drunk. other people have motorized their recliners. but lacking the cache of infamy, they don't get the price. the minnesota police are auctioning it off. tmz records lazy boy insists they drop the name from the auction. when it comes to drunken driving it's not us versus them. >> you am them? >> yes. i am them. >> here is an idea, but call me crazy. if you're drunk, don't call the police, just don't drive. that was cnn's jean moos for "showbiz tonight." tonight the mother of the baby who narrowly escaped death being run over a train.
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who can forget this. in melbourne, australia, the mother goes into a panic as the stroller carrying her six-month-old son rolls off the platform and into an oncoming train. the mother almost jumped in front of the train herself. amazingly the baby survived without a scratch. on the "today" show, matt lauer asked the mom about that unimaginable moment when the stroller rolled onto the track purchase there was a moment i thought i should jump. there was a second i thought i should have a look at him, have a look, how is he. that time, i just -- i was blank. i was complete shock. >> obviously emotional just talking about it. the baby is doing fine. truly a miraculous and such a happy ending to that story, brooke. >> certainly is. showbiz on call phone lines going nuts over the idea jon and kate gosselin might get
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together. >> i for one don't see this happening. i think it's gotten too ugly between the two of them. >> our callers agree with you. here is a call. she definitely thinks it's time for jon to move on. >> i wanted to say jon gosselin may be acting like an idiot, but he was treated like dog poop for so long on the show by kate. i watched her just degrade him and give him the most condescending looks and talking to him down in front of the children, i hope he goes for someone better. >> we heard from carden in oklahoma who says they should say sorry. >> of course they should forgive each other, the only option left. doesn't mean they should couple their marriage again. two different personalities. it's like stake and ketchup up, kate is the steak here.
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>> showbiz online phone lines up 24-7. give us a ring, 1-888-sbt-buzz. >> so jon gosselin certainly has engaged in some eye raising behavior since his split with kate. he's definitely not the only famous guy who has had some issues. tonight we've got a showbiz special report you do not want to miss. hollywood's most toxic bachelors. also breaking mariah baby news. are mariah and her husband expecting a little bundle of joy? larry king got right to the point? >> right now? let me take a swig of scotch and let you know. >> i'm thinking that's not scotch. could it be true? is mariah having a baby. while jessica is furious with mel rose place for firing
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ashley. could she have gotten canned because she's a bad actress? this is "showbiz tonight" on hln.
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something nasty to say about me or other women built like me, i have one thing to say to you, kiss my fat ass. >> now, on "showbiz tonight" this week, the new tyra bank weight controversy. first tyra tells women to embrace their curves. now she's promoting her big weight loss. tonight, is tyra being a hypocrite? >> i'll apologize to her for openly having relationships in the public eye. that was a huge mistake. >> they are good looking. they seem oh, so nice.
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oh, no, they are big-time heartbreakers. tonight a showbiz special report, the most toxic bachelors in hollywood. plus shows breaking in the news ticker, tv's most provocative news show continues right now. welcome back to "showbiz tonight" this weekend. it's 30 minutes past the hour. i'm a.j. hammer broadcasting tonight and every night from new york city. i'm brooke anderson coming to you tonight from hollywood tonight. a special report, has jon gosselin split from kate and wild antics made him a toxic bachelor. tonight naming the most toxic bachelors in hollywood. i'm talking about love them and leave them bachelors in hollywood that seem to have a different woman on their arm every week. we're thinking jon gosselin is pretty highoon that list.
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this week he launched a major image rehab. jon claims he wants to make amends with kate and renounce his playboy image. seriously, should we trust him or should women run the other way. he's one of the many men "showbiz tonight" is naming the top toxic bachelors in hollywood. careful, ladies. they may look hand some in sweet but these men are toxic. tonight "showbiz tonight" is rating the most toxic bachelors in hollywood. so who is the most toxic bachelor of them all? we start with a classic hollywood bachelor, musician john mayer. >> he has one of the most successful reputation in hollywood as a lady's man. >> it seems john mayer's second career after fabulous must cig is heartbreaker. from jennifer love hewitt to jessica simpson to jennifer aniston. he's a major wooer.
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>> the big thing when he talked about jennifer and their relationship with tmz, talked about the breakup. >> she's the smartest, most sophisticated woman i've ever met. i ended the relationship to be alone. i don't want to waste somebody's time if it's not right. >> gabbing about a breakup, bad mover. john mayer's toxic bachelor rating, a mighty three broken hearts out of five. john, if you want to improve your record, keep your mouth shut. come to think of it, so should another hollywood bachelor, the one and only levi johnston. he's the father of sarah palin's grandson, the ex-fiance for bristol palin. a hunk of burning love, that is until he opens his mouth. >> most teenagers are sexually active. >> levi johnston, i like to call him the toxic bachelor that will
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do anything for money. >> besides a scores of shirtless interviews, pictures with his son on gq and now selling pistachio nuts. >> now levi johnston does it with protection. >> now the biggest bombshell by reportedly dropping trou and posing for play girl. >> is anyone going to tell him it's not a website for heterosexual women. >> how does he size up on the meter. >> levi johnston because he's so toxic, i'm giving him four toxic hearts. >> if you want to talk toxic, you've got to talk bobby brown. his ex-wife whitney houston revealed bombshell after bombshell of his outrageous behavior while they were married. >> he spit on me. he actually spit on me. >> now that he's divorced, ladies, he's eligible. >> so bobby really began to look like a pretty terrible husband.
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however, he at least took the high road. he spoke to the media himself and didn't lash out on whitney. to his credit he at least didn't make it worse. >> how does bobby brown rate on the "showbiz tonight" toxic bachelor scale? >> since he hasn't been that big of a bachelor this year, he's probably getting two bachelor hearts. >> and now for the biggest toxic bachelor of them all. relatively new to single life, this man has been wreaking havoc one lady at a time. so who is this masked man? >> the most toxic bachelor of 2009 has to be jon gosselin, mainly because he was going out and galavanting with pretty much anything with [ bleep ]. >> aside from his soul mate, 22-year-old hailey glassman, who now claims jon is emotionally abusive, jon has also been connected to his babysitter. some questionable types in vegas
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and former star magazine reporter kate major. she told "showbiz tonight" in an exclusive interview that jon is a major player. >> we held hands and kissed in the car. >> on the first night? >> yeah. >> you kissed on the first night? >> unfortunately yes. >> jon has got to do something to fix his tarnished reputation and fast. until that day happens jon gosselin is officially named the most toxic bachelor of them all. jon, you get five broken hearts out of five. congrats. so did we get it right? is jon gosselin the most toxic bachelor of all time? our "showbiz tonight" facebook fans have been duking it out online. senior editor for "star" magazine. and kim, "in tough weekly." let's get to it. "showbiz tonight" is naming jon gosselin the most toxic bachelor
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but he's teaming up with and claiming he's going to clean up. are you buying it or once a toxic bachelor always a toxic bachelor? >> i'm so not buying this. he's obviously on his best behavior because he's got something called finalizing a divorce coming up. he's got a custody battle. he's trying to be very good lately. he's even releasing statements saying he misses part of kate. he made a mistake. he's an adult now. the thing is, once a bachelor, always a bachelor. jon is always going to have his flings. they are going to be a little quieter. he broke hailey glassman's heart. he told her to her face over and over he didn't have these flings on the side. he's the toxic bachelor. >> he loves the playboy
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lifestyle. we got pretty on target votes for toxic bachelor. holly writes on the facebook wall, jude law. he is always cheating on his woman. he is cute though. lol! he was caught cheating on his wife with the nanny. his very brief girlfriend has given birth to a child. how does jude stack up against the other toxic bachelor. >> of course i would be very worried about dating him. he doesn't seem to be able to be faithful to the women he's with. he is good looking. he's a good actor. up there with john mayer. same thing. you know what you're getting with john mayer, he's a player. but he looks like a lot of fun. so you walk into it knowing what you're getting. >> you have to be very careful. >> john mayer, if listening, you can call me. >> you will be prepared. >> sherry m. writes on the "showbiz tonight" facebook wall. chris brown, he's oozing toxins.
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amen, i agree with you. after admitting to beating up rihanna, i think it's safe to say chris brown is a toxic bachelor. what do you say? >> you know what's annoying about him. rihanna releases information about her album, excited, chris brown comes out, stamps on her parade, starts promoting his album. this is a guy who issued this faux apology and is just trying to rebuild his public image. and it just really isn't working. >> you know, i agree with you. time will tell with that one. interestingly, many people wrote on our "showbiz tonight" facebook wall that george clooney should be on the toxic. >> mary j. isn't having any of it. george clooney, not toxic, jon gosselin toxic. >> george clooney, a little bit
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of a player. jon gosselin, if you dated him, you'd never know who was showing up your door, jon gosselin with octomom, spiritual advisors, you never know. >> he does seem like a womanizer. thank you both. good to see you ladies. >> remember when tyra banks did that whole kiss my fat ass thing and got clammed for her weight at the time. i thought it was a terrific message for women everywhere, embrace your bodies. tonight tyra is showing off her new big weight loss. i've got to ask, are these mixed messages bad? is tyra being a hip cat. mariah carey, baby news. leave it to larry king to get to the point. >> are you with child? >> right now? i'm going to have a swig of my scotch and let you know. >> to be honest, i don't think that's scotch in the mug there. could it be? is mariah having a baby?
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this is showbiz tonight weekend on hln.
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women whose names you know, women whose names you don't. women who have been picked on. women whose husbands put them down. women at work or those in school, i have one thing to say to you, kiss my fat ass. >> you remember that, when tyra banks slammed the tabloids for difficultiesing her weight in 2007. tyra send a message to women everywhere to celebrate their clothes. is tyra being a hypocrite after dropping a whopping 30 pounds. i'm a.j. hammer with brooke anderson in new york. tonight, tyra's brand-new weight shocker. tyra banks is revealing all about how she dropped the
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pounds. hold on just a second. is she talking out of both sides of her mouth? we've got a debate. showbiz learned kirstie alley is taking her weight loss bagts to reality tv. i've got to ask, after exposing her weight loss before is she setting herself up for failure. jessica's tirade on "melrose place." she called the show crap after her sister was fired. right now midwin charles, an attorney, with midwin charles & associates in new york, let's start out with tyra's weight revelations. showbiz learned on tyra's show wednesday she's going to reveal her secrets to dropping a whopping 30 pounds. i want to show you what tyra has to say about how she felt pressured by media attention to do this. >> i felt exposed. i wasn't trying to proclaim to
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the world i got fit and healthy and in shape because i felt kind of conflicted, especially after the kiss my fat ass thing -- it's still fat, by the way. >> i don't know about fat. but right there you have tyra admitting people might see her as talking out of both sides of her mouth. midwin, is she? >> i don't. i think her question was women need to feel comfortable with the skin they are in. if she didn't and needed to lose 30 pounds, so be it. i don't think it's a big deal. >> we covered the tyra banks controversy two years ago or the weight controversy where she was being called out for her weight. she sent a great message. people back then were saying way to go, tyra. tyra says she still embraces her curves yet she lost all this weight. do you think, brooke, she can have it both ways or do you
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think a lot-of- people will call her a hypocrite? >> i think people will call her a hypocrite, no matter what she does, a.j., but i don't think she's sending mixed message personally. she says it's not about being skinny. look at her. she's not he mastiated now. she's still curvy. she looks great. it's sending a message about good health. we all need to strive to be as fit and as strong as possible. that's good for long-term health, bodies and minds. when i say that tyra is sending a great message, i really don't think i'm alone here. rachel, are you with me on this one? >> i'm with you, midwin. she never signed up to be the poster child for plus sized women. when she said kiss my you know what a few years ago she was standing up for women of all shapes and sizes that don't want to be judged. she's a great inspiration everywhere. >> let us move to another breaking story. a & e says kirstie alley is
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planning on doing a reality show, her journey with weight loss. she parodied her weight on "fat actest." lost weight for jenny craig. put on a bikini to go on oprah, that gained 80 pounds back. i've been among those rooting for kirstie all along. midwin, it does seem to me kirstie is setting herself up for failure and she said it was a miserable experience before. >> it was a miserable experience. i applaud kirstie for doing this. it's so difficult to share your inner battles with the world. remember, oprah did this, too, lost it, gained it, came back, ran the marathon, put weight on. it's just what people go through. if she wants to share that with people, i think that's a really good thing. >> we all want kirstie to be her healthiest. what do you think, is doing it on television the way to go for it? >> she might be setting herself up for failure but i can't wait
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to watch. now a & e, intervention, hoarders, mind freak, the bounty hunter. >> somehow it will be funny with kirstie alley. another story. jessica simpson blasting "melrose place" for firing her sister ashley, writing her out of the show. take a look at what jessica tweeted. cw catching up on mp. who writes this crap. isd bad scripts to work with. this, thank god my sister is amazing and you got some press. i know jessica is doing the big sister thing protecting ashley. but midwin, the buzz is elsewhere that ashley was fired because she's a terrible actress. i'm not saying that but i've seen that buzz. do you think midwin is making herself look a little silly by coming out like this? >> i think so, too. i wonder what else jessica has going on with her career or lack thereof, subject to debate and argument. but it's entirely possible that her sister was just not the best
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actress for "melrose place" and why she was fired. she needs to tweet about something else. >> what do you think real quickly, do you think it's a mistake to come out for her sister. >> i think jessica is jumping up and down, for once gets to stic up for her. >> and she just has a little sisterly love op the outside, but maybe feeling differently inside. you said it, not me. rachel, midwin, thanks, guys. tonight, big mariah carey baby news from cnn's "larry king live." if you can say one thing about larry, he gets right to the point. >> larry: are you with child? >> right now? i'll have a swig of my scotch and let you know. >> larry: take a swig and i'll wait. >> i don't think that's really scotch in that mug. but could it be true? is mariah carey having a baby? this is "showbiz tonight" this weekend on hln. they said it would never last.
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it's the longest-lasting plugins ever. get freshness that won't fade away for 60 days. ahhh! with plugins lasting impressions. and yes, it's glade. s.c. johnson, a family company. tonight on "the joy behar show," sex, sex, sex, can too much of a good thing be a bad thing? when it comes to an addiction, yes. dr. drew pinsky will be joining me along with two sex addicts. after we're done talking, we'll all take a shower and cuddle. then there was an election last night and republicans are delirious about some big state house victories. but are they celebrating too soon? sex and politics, ooh, i feel just like a member of congress. also, nicolas cage, hollywood star and shopaholic? he says he's gone broke. did his over-the-top lifestyle land him in the poor house? this, and more, tonight.
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-- captions by vitac -- here's a question. does being a sex addict make a man a bad husband? if he's getting his fix from another woman, i'd say yeah. baseball analyst steve phillips and actor david duchovny are two self-admitted sex addicts, but they are not alone. between 3% and 6% of the american population say they are sex addicts, too. ironically they're the same people to whom four out of five dentists recommend sugarless gum. go figure. here to discuss sexual addiction is dr. drew pinsky, this generation's dr. ruth, except he's not 4'11" -- 4'8", really. and he's also the star of the
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h1's sex with dr. drew. and duncan roy. and "playboy" playmate. thank you so much for joining us. let's start -- hi, nicole. you're out there somewhere. but we know you're there. >> thanks. >> by the way, i saw your tape with colin farrell. yeah, it's fabulous. i netflixed it. >> i can't see you watching that, but that's cool. i guess. >> i have my secrets. so steve phillips, you know, this guy, espn, he has sex with a 22-year-old. he gets caught and goes to sex rehab. is he really a sex addict or is he just a horny guy? >> we obviously don't know him. i do know he had met the criteria for a program that treats sexual addicts. people get glib about this, because they say it's an excuse.
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if he hadn't been caught, substitute cocaine instead of sex. it's the same thing. the family brings people to treatment, the doctors bring people to treatment. it's rare people stand up and say i need to get my cocaine addiction treated today. the sex addiction is the exact same way. >> somebody has to say -- >> something has to happen. >> something gets caught or something like that. >> there have to be sufficient consequences to motivate you to change this thing. >> he's accused of taking the easy way out to going into rehab, as i heard you on "the view" saying that the other day. the easy way out of that situation is to leave your wife and end up in a hotel room with coke and hookers. that's the easy way out for a sex addict. not just to stand up and say, you know what, i'm putting my hands up. i need help. >> i don't remember saying that was the easy way out. you get me mixed up with whoopi goldberg. >> easy to mix that up. >> what about letterman? what do you think about that case? >> i don't know what that's all about. the one that sort of stands out as an easy one in the history of
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the record book is bill clinton. somebody who really had horrible consequences from what seems to be an addictive process. >> do you think he's addicted to sex or doesn't have self-control? what's the difference? >> doctor, go ahead. >> go ahead, nicole, ring in. >> well, the thing is, and i spoke to dr. drew about this recently, because i was struggling with the fact that i had so many questions after i was on the show. and i explained to him that, you know, being a sex addict and being someone who's, you know, addicted to love, where being -- being a love addict and having that fear of abandonment, and that underlying fear of intimacy, i was asking him, how do you deem yourself recovered from that. whereas i think it's a lot more treatable to be recovered from being a sex addict, where, you know, like in duncan's case, being online eight, nine hours a day, just watching porn, i would
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imagine at some point that can be recovered. >> not to mention the carpal tunnel syndrome. but is there a difference between a female addict and a male addict? because the way she describes it, it sounds more like women who love too much. >> women tend to statistically come to sex addiction through love addictions. they have these elaborate fantasies. we've all been teenagers, and outgrow them as part of our developmental lives. some of them get stuck in them. romeo and juliet were love addicts, and say that's a reason romance should be sort of defended. the outcome wasn't so good. if one of my patients ended up like that, i wouldn't be so happy about it. >> in romeo and juliet, the families disagreed. >> let's finish the point. the fantasy is what becomes paramount. when there's a real relationship, they can't tolerate and they act out sexually. >> and it's hard to -- >> hold on, nicole. >> the myth about sex addiction
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is it's about sex. it's about filling the same void that alcohol or drugs or -- you know -- >> there's an emptinesemptiness. >> sex addiction is about intrigue, flirtation. and pornography. >> how much is danger involved in all of it, too? >> well, for me, a lot. a lot of danger. i was completely obsessed with dangerous sexual encounters. stray guys. the last time i relapsed was in a token's square park with a gun at my head. >> it's more about the thrill of the danger of getting caught? >> for me it's about replicating the trauma. >> let's talk about the trauma. i understand you had a trauma as a young child. which is very serious. >> we can laugh about it. >> no, i can't laugh about that. we'll move on to other things that are funny, but this is not. because you were basically raped bir your stepfather, am i right? >> from 2 to 13. >> 2 years old? that is not funny. >> the average age of sex abuse
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against kids is about 2 to 3 years old. that's the average age. people are abusing infants. that's what happens. >> it's unbelievable. we have sort of come through a wave of this that is spectacular. the consequences in adulthood are the replication of the traumas, through sexual acting out and compulsively treating traumas over and over again, by becoming a prostitute, a stripper, dangerous situations, whatever it might be. >> but do all sex addicts have child abuse in their past? >> not all. but it's very common. >> nicole, were you sexually abused as a child? >> i definitely grew up having my boundaries violated, definitely. so that was -- >> and neglect, nicole, too. >> neglect and abandonment. >> i was kicked out at 16 years old. so, you know, i've had to learn survival at such a young age. and before being, you know -- on top of that, having your boundaries violated, that
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confusion doesn't really help like i'm out there in the world in the streets by myself. it's like, okay, what do i do now. how do i handle all of this stuff. like what's right and what's wrong. where do i go find comfort. and what man and how do i trust that man. >> well said. >> she puts it succinctly. you talk about the addiction on your show. >> pornography is very debilitating. i'm talking about getting up in the morning, seven days a week, and sitting at my computer all day. >> okay. how much does the internet actually play in all of this? >> there's a huge problem with the tnt. do you want to do this? >> no, i want you to do this. >> you're the one who's on the internet. >> i'll sprinkle the highlights on the top. >> probably the internet in years gone by, before the internet came, you know, people would find images, and they
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would be the same kind of images, and they evolved sexually to see other more dangerous things, it would be very hard for them. now you're only three clicks away that would lapped you in prison. and that's a huge -- you know, we're talking about unmanageability. >> you have to remember, it's really changed the landscape. having this portal on everyone's desk is like having a crack pipe for a sex addict op their desk all the time. >> really? >> mm-hmm. >> let me ask nicole, how bad did your addiction get, nicole? i understand you were into masturbation a lot. >> right. >> isn't that from anxiety, all that masturbating? >> it's a way of managing it. >> you know what? i really try hard not to think about masturbating too much. i had a moment there where i really did -- could not get out of bed one day because i was just -- it was a constant thing. and that was an exhausting day. it was like, i didn't even want
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to eat food, because that was my food for the day. it was exhausting. and it was scary. because it consumed my entire day. and i try very hard to not have any triggers around, you know, around me, where i would feel like i need to masturbate today, because i'm fearful of not getting out of bed for the day. but i'm definitely a lot better -- i'm definitely better. i'm still human, don't get me wrong. i mean, we all have to clean the pipes once in a while. >> but masturbation like that is an addiction. she stopped eating. >> sure. >> can it cure your addiction to food? think about it that way. okay, everybody, stick around. always look on the bright side.
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you had childhood trauma, right? >> yeah. >> what happened? >> like certain family members, you know, just touching me inappropriately, and things that i know were wrong. but for me, it's like, i don't know how you talk about this stuff. >> i'm sure you were threatened by some of these people, too, right? you didn't deserve that, did you? >> that was a clip from the vh1 show sex rehab with dr. drew. dr. drew, okay, let me ask you, how do you treat sexual addiction? what do you do? >> it's different than other addictions in that it's so deeply embedded in people, and embedded in trauma as we talked about. the big difference for me is you leap very quickly into very
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heavy landscape. very deep issues come up very quickly and are done in an evocative fashion. lots of education in sex rehab. drug addition won't sit through the education that sex addicts sort of gobble up. it's interesting. when you have the appropriate candidate at the appropriate level of care, they really respond well to it. the sex rehab center have to have people who can tolerate the location and has to be willing to change with stuff that's subtle, and deeply embedded in who they are. >> so you can't have a.d.d. at the same time. >> it's difficult. but some people do, yeah. >> you've been working with chemical adicts. were you really surprised -- >> we put together this great team. i sort of inserted myself into the teams. their courage was spectacular. secondly, the way they leapt into the process was something new for me, with drug addicts who resist the process, or leap in to use it to go into drugs. >> sex addiction is harder you say. harder to cure. >> it's more painful.
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it takes longer. >> it was 13 years by the time i hit this wall. i've been sober from drugs and alcohol for 13 years. and then about eight months before i did the show, i really hit this wall in my sobriety, where i realized i transferred all of my addictions into sex and the internet and all the other stuff that i was doing. >> that's an interesting point to me. people give up one and go on to another addiction. >> addiction is the emotional disturbance in the deep recesses of the brain. >> now you gave up booze and drugs. >> yeah. >> and you've been rehabilitated as a sex addict, right, duncan? >> you remember, there's no cure for addiction. it's a progressive condition which can be arrested. so all i have to do on a daily basis is arrest my condition. i mean, that's really all i can do. >> nicole was saying sex addiction is so deeply
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emotional. it's so much of an emotional process. >> there's so much trauma. that's the difference between being a sex addict and dealing with the abandonment issues. you're dealing with a lot more emotions. >> it's very interesting how some addicts become very religious i notice. they become extremely -- george bush was an alcoholic. and then he became very, very religious and it was all about the lord. it's like another addiction in a certain way. >> addicts are prone to extremes. they really are. but religiousness, i don't see that that much. you would be surprised. i see it in that case, but i don't see that much of it. >> george bush would have been a better guy. >> now, on your show, you have eight good looking sex addicts living together. isn't that a recipe for disaster? >> well, maybe in the boudoir
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behar environment. but this is -- >> drug addicts, there are no drugs around. but people are there, good looking people. >> we really wanted it. >> you really wanted what? >> i really wanted sobriety, sexual sobriety. a lot of those people were desperate. like my friend jenny, all of those people had come to the end of the road. of course, there was flirtation. of course there were the immediate kind of, oh, that's cute, but the point is, but you wanted sobriety more than you wanted to get laid again. >> we had them dress a certain way. they were not allowed to touch each other. >> what about during the night? come on. >> it's impossible. >> we were in bed by 10:00. >> we have nursing staff on them. just the way we watch for drugs and alcoholics coming into the unit, we watch for sexual improprieties. we trusted them to tell us about the masturbation. >> once. >> nicole, did you confess about that? >> no, i didn't. >> she made it. >> i made it through.
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>> she made it through? well, good for you. good for you. >> thanks. >> they're all gorgeous people. are there any ugly sex addicts that you treat? i mean, are all of them so gorgeous? >> i don't cast these shows. i try to get involved -- for me, if i come upon somebody and they need treatment, i don't say, wait for the cameras to heat up in a couple of months. i treat them. >> there are more women than men. i had a question about that. more sex addicts are male, am i wrong? >> there's a lot of love addicts out there that are women, that are flirting with sexual addiction. >> women are love addicts. the men are sex addicts. >> i know, but you know what? it's funny. i wish there was almost a different name for love addict. because it does sound so like, oh, it's so sweet and trite. but i mean the -- it's such a deeper issue when you're dealing with abandonment and intimacy issues. i didn't know there was a difference between sex and love. i thought they were the same thing.
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until i got -- until i did the show. >> a lot of people make that mistake. you're not alone in that. >> that's true. but some people get in trouble right there. listen, we live in a time in this country where we have destroyed intimacy. we just have. the substitute for that are arousing activities and extreme sports and power control. that is not intimacy. we've lost track of that. our families have been disrupted for a long time. so we don't have good models for intimacy. and sex becomes the surrogate or fantasy becomes the surrogate, and that's what nicole is talking about. >> in my relationships, that's what i dealt with. i lived most of my relationships that way. >> are both of you ab sti nat now? >> people get very confused about the sex addiction, is that you have to define your own bottom line. for me, i'm not allowed to masturbate compulsively, i'm not allowed to look at internet porn, look at hookup sites, i'm
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not allowed to -- but actually, i am allowed to have sex with consenting adults. because i wasn't. >> the danger thing, you don't feel that anymore? >> that's absolutely my bottom line behavior. that's where this thing is absolutely the worst thing. >> more when we come back. don't go away. y8
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these days, nicolas cage is in serious financial trouble, thanks to what some people are calling a crippling consumer addiction. and kirstie alley will star in a reality show chronic willing her attempts with weight loss. back to discuss these cases is dr. drew, and reality star jill zaren, of the "real housewives of new york city." and ashleigh banfield from true tv. welcome, everybody. let's talk about kirstie alley and what she said on oprah yesterday.
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>> i was doing cocaine. i was crazy as -- i was -- you know, i would come in, and i don't think anybody even knew what drugs were then. they're like, you're so crazy. and i'm going, oh, i'm high. and they're like, she's high. and they didn't believe it. the. >> when did you stop doing drugs? >> 1979. i did my share, and yours. i only did it for a couple of years. >> did she replace a drug addiction with a food addiction, dr. drew? >> it seems that way. it certainly can be the case. we discussed sexual addiction, how sometimes people can get sober from a chemical addiction and some of these behavioral addictions kick in. >> you see this a lot, ashleigh, don't you, in your work? >> i actually see it with my colleagues. jane velez-mitchell has written this amazing book about an addiction, we replace one with another. addictive personality is what we all have in some sense, some more than others, some different
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choices. but yeah, we all have a similar problem. >> is every addiction a bad definition? exercise they say is a great addiction. i'm sorry, i don't have that one. >> but exercise bulimia, very difficult to treat. >> it makes it sound like it's not a good thing. >> the addiction to the consequences have to be negative. >> say it again slowly. sxl continued behavior preoccupation despite the negative consequences in important areas of your life, work, school, finance, health, legal. >> it has to have a negative impact. >> negative impact in an important area of your life. >> weight addictions and food addictions is tricky. you have queen latifah saying i'm big and beautiful, and the little starlet saying i look gorgeous this way. women don't know if they're addicted or fat or too skinny or what. >> in my treatment center these days, when somebody has a bad enough addiction, they come to see me.
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there's childhood trauma. we tend to see sort of a multiplicity of cutting, eating disorders, addiction, and sexual compulsion. it all kind of goes together. eating is part of the syndrome of addiction and trauma today. >> it's frustrating, the number of celebrities out there, mostly women, go on television and go to magazines with how proud they are of their look, their larger than life look and the next year they're losing 75 pounds. i'm not sure what message it sends. >> and put it back on, not to get another reality show, but kirstie alley had a show on showtime. i enjoyed that show. she was acting out as sort of as herself and now she's back again. but she was an ak trels. i found that show entertaining. and now sort of real life, it's not entertaining for me anymore. >> she lost a lot of weight on the jenny craig diet. they paid me. that's how you lose weight these days. if you pay me, i'll lose weight.
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oprah, they should just pay her and she'll lose weight again. >> paying people motivates them to do it. >> you didn't pay me. i had to lose the weight. >> he's saying -- you're saying if you pay someone, they might give up the addiction? no. >> listen. look at celebrity rehab programs i do. most of these people were not interested in recovery. but they were interested in being on tv and being paid. and their lives were changed. we motivated them to get into treatment. >> what makes you think they'll not go back to their behavior at the end of the -- >> of course, they could. >> are they cured? >> no one's cured. but they're doing better than average. >> do you think people on reality shows, which you were on, are addicted to tv? addicted to the spotlight? >> it depends on how you got on. for me, they approached me. and i never thought i would be on television. >> you did a whole thesis about it, wrote a book about it. >> i know about your book. i think it depends on the person. for me, i've made a business out
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of this. i'm a spokesperson for kodak. i'm doing all these great -- i'm writing a book, i have all these things happening. is it -- am i guilty for wanting to be successful and turning this into something? i'm making money to support my shopping addiction. >> we'll talk about shopping addiction. another alleged hollywood addict, nicolas cage, he's suing his former money manager for sending him into debt. but now sources say he was addicted to spending. here's some of the stuff that cage owns. i'm just going to give you a list of this. a dozen homes around the world. a few dozen cars like this bugatti. only 710 of them were ever made. so that was a biggie. a gulf stream private jet which costs about $50 million. he also owns a couple islands in the bahamas. some meteorites. dinosaur skull. i would love a dinosaur skull. that would look stunning on my
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mantle. and a $9 million 18th century castle. now, he makes only about, according to what i've read, about $20 million a year. which could not support this. >> and taxes. >> and taxes. forget about it. >> that doesn't matter. scratch all that off the block. his big spending ticket. because if you go to a nice restaurant in new york city, you go there because you figure you can afford it. if all of a sudden you find out tomorrow that your manager has not told you that you don't have the money to go to nobu, you're in trouble. so your restaurant is his leer jet. it doesn't matter what he bought. the fact of the matter is, it's all p the paperwork. >> he spent more than he has. my manager doesn't tell me how much i can spend at nobu's. i know how much i can spend. i'm in touch with my money. >> why isn't he checking his -- when you get your bank statement, at least for me, i check every check to make sure that i signed it. i sign every check. and you know what -- >> she's a business woman.
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>> what is this about? >> this is grandiose, a grand scale. it makes me worry he's bipolar, manic, something going on here fueling this. there are some people who get very high on debting. actually not the buying, it's the debting. >> what turns them on about being in debt? >> very often it's people that have struggled early in life where their back was against the wall and they only feel alive when they're in that -- >> i once heard on oprah someplace that gamblers, compulsive gamblers could be bipolar. my father was a gambler. you would say to him, did you win? nah, i didn't win. they don't want to win. >> they prefer to lose. it's part -- >> you're trying to get the next win. that's the high. >> there are reported pieces going into the casino in diapers, because they become so disassociated. >> they don't allow that in atlantic city. >> people are coming off the buses in diapers there, what are
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you talking about? >> but the fact is, most gamblers like the thrill of losing. that's when they feel alive, like their back is against the wall. >> don't they feel alive when they're winning? >> there are some that like winning. but my experience -- >> my heart races when i'm winning. >> and these -- >> it's normal to get excited when you're winning at roulette? >> of course. that's why people do it. >> so i'm normal. >> if you're losing, you're really pissed off. this is the issue with cage, he's saying, i'm not like jill. i'm not smart enough to follow my own money. that's why i pay this guy a whole lot of money so he can follow it for me. the thing is, though, we need to find out in court if they have a agreement. do i have cart blanche to manage your money or do we check through each other on every transaction? >> why doesn't he sell his -- he's in a lot of trouble.
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>> sell one plane and -- >> he's putting those islands, those homes, everything on the market. >> everything is sellable. >> it seems to me, you know women on the upper east side who are shopping addicts. >> yes. >> you see them buying trendy bags and gucci bags and minolo shoes and everything. are those real addicts or can their husbands afford it? a lot of it is their husbands' money. >> that's true. but does it matter, though? >> it matters if people, when they have emotional disregulati disregulation, you referred to the emptiness. the shopping fills the emptiness, it becomes more of a compulsion and addiction. >> that is the pathology involved. there's like an emptiness inside. how can i fill it up. >> some people do it because they're lonely and their husbands don't come home and it fills that emptiness. >> it may be loneliness. but emptiness is a pathology. >> i get high buying a lipstick. you don't have to get a gucci
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bag to get this -- >> i have a problem with shoes. >> we all have a problem with shoes. >> somebody explain that to me. >> dr. drew's show airs on vh#. we'll be right back. thank you so much for being here today.
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what the republicans have been doing is an insult to america. they've been dragging their feet. these are foot dragging, knuckle dragging neanderthals who think they can dictate policy to america by being stubborn. >> you're the greatest. knuckle-dragging neanderthals, apparently voted in virginia and new jersey didn't agree. the governors elect in those states, both republicans.
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i'm joind by the man who threw those bombs, florida congressman allen grayson, congressman, thank you for joining me. i really do enjoy you, i must tell you. >> same here, i enjoy you, too. >> the governors' races were won by republicans in virginia and new jersey. obama stumped for both of them. what does this say about obama's influence these days? is it waning or is it okay? what do you think? >> well, look, there's lessons for both parties. for the democratic party, we have to activate our vote. the republicans activate their vote. but the democrats this year haven't done as good a job as the republicans in that regard. the voter turnout in virginia was down by half since last year. now, i don't think half of all voters in virginia just disappeared. what happened was that some of them felt motivated to vote and too many of the people on our side didn't feel motivated to vote. that's why there was such a sharp drop in both states. we have to motivate our base. >> it was interesting that the exit polls in virginia and new jersey, both of them said that
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they still like president obama. that their vote had nothing to do with him. do you agree with that? >> well, look, people elected obama, they elected me, they elected the democrats and put us in charge of the government, because they want change. and they need to see more of it. we need to deliver. we need to make sure that the people who voted for us with expectations in mind have those expectations satisfied. it's that simple. there's lessons for the republicans, too. you didn't talk about the election in new york. >> i'm about to ask you about that one. because that was one for the team. >> listen, i think we're witnessing a disintegration of a major american political party, something that happens only about once a century. the last time that two of those counties in the new york congressional district were represented by democrats was in 1850. 1850. so i think what we're seeing is that the tea-baggers are no longer obeying their corporate pay masters. >> it's interesting, because both limbaugh and palin both
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backed the republican up there, and it didn't work. i love that. does it mean the attack machine -- what is it about the right wing attack machine that they're full of bluster and they're out there all the time voicing their hatred, a lot of it, and it still doesn't translate into votes by and large? >> they're down to 20% of the american electorate. only 20% of americans identify as republicans now. even at 20%, it's falling apart. >> what does it say about the independent voters? >> the independent voters have a lot of say. they're the balance of power between the two parties. but i think at this point we're down to one 1/2 parties. the republicans can't seem to get it together. they have nothing to offer ordinary people. you ask what people want for health care, for education, for jobs, the republicans have no answers for any of them. they're the party of no. and no doesn't cut it anymore. >> thank you very much for joining us. i hope that you're going to keep speaking out and saying those wonderful things that you say. we like them. >> thank you, joy.
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thank you very much. >> okay. thank you very much, congressman. i want to turn to randi rhodes. >> hi, joy. congratulations. >> thank you. let's start with these races. what did you make of all of this? >> one of them i thought was a real changed election. the other one i thought -- >> which one? >> i thought new jersey, you know, goldman sachs, corzine. i think they had had it with the whole wall street bailout, the whole -- >> you can't blame people for being aggravated by that. >> i don't blame them. i really don't blame them. he ran a dirty campaign, quite frankly. i don't think corzine needed to go there with the fat joke. that's what he was presenting. >> do you think that has something to do with the reason corzine lost? >> it's what everybody ended up talking about, instead of bringing jobs to new jersey or lower property taxes. everybody was saying, john corzine, who's not -- >> i think it's because they didn't like corzine. >> i was going to say, he's not the most -- you wouldn't want to
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have dinner with john corzine. i don't think so. >> have you had dinner with him? >> no. >> but you said that the governor races yesterday were a vote for obama. now, we lost both of them. >> what i said is it's a change election. i really think virginia was voting for change. i think virginia made a huge mistake, because it's going to be women are chattel. they're still fighting the civil war in virginia and making progress. virginia is one of the best managed states in the united states. because they had 12 years of democratic governors. they had tim cain, a phenomenal governor. and they had -- who's leaving now, mark warner. they had mark warner. so their finances in virginia are really, really solid. the thing that was on the ballot was the transportation issue. there's a lot of traffic in northern virginia mostly. and so they were very upset
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about transportation. this guy bob mcdonald that won, bob mcdonald, i mean, bob mcdonald liked when you and me were chattel. he liked when we couldn't own things and couldn't vote. that's what bob mcdonnell was. >> those were the days. >> you know, but he ran as a moderate. that's the thing that nobody wants to talk about. bob mcdonnell decided to put all the social issues aside and run with bob loves jobs. or bob for jobs. he ran as a complete moderate. never talked about social issues. which is what these conservatives are harping on, and they're going to lose. >> do you think that all of this kind of like tea partying that's going on, and the palins, limbaughs, are they harming the republican party? >> i think that's the one race they inserted themselves in a big way. >> 23rd district. >> new york. >> the best. >> that was an interesting thing. >> that was a talk radio race. they needed to win one.
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beck and rush and sean and mark levin, who believe it or not is in the bunker in his bedroom somewhere planning all this all the time with his landmark legal foundation, and his, you know, his screaming and and he's iming sean hannity every day telling him what to say so they picked this new york 23rd race and decided to back the conservative there. was a republican and a conservative. so they backed the conservative. this guy, huffman, no one knew him an accountant, a cpa. >> why didn't they back the republican? >> because they wanted to show that the republican party is is is is no longer their party. they are running away from bush. they can't get anybody elected for dogcatcher. david brooks is a conservative, well, he is a republican. you have to differentiate. he said you can't get anybody
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elected to dogcatcher with 600, 700 radio stations. >> i wonder if that is true. sit tight. we'll be back in a minute.
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breaking news tonight. live, ohio, cops raid the home of a convicted sex offender accused of yet another sex attack. inside his three-story cleveland home, seasoned detectives stunned, women's bodies hidden throughout, bodies on every floor of the home, even stuffed in crawl spaces. bombshell tonight, in the last 24 hours, the body count rises. now, 11 dead women in the
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three-story home of former marine, anthony sowell. and the excavation goes on. so far, only one positive i.d. made. reported missing one year ago, a mother of two girls and one boy, tonia carmichael. i.d.'d through dental records. also i.d.'d in the last 24 hours. tonight, her daughter with us. her mother's body hidden in this house of horrors for the last year. just hours ago, sowell, in full shackle, in court. and yet another bizarre twist, we confirm just weeks after sowell's release from the pen, he lists himself on a sex website seeking "a submissive." is this one of the ways the former marine trolled for victims? tonight, unsuspecting neighbors in shock over an alleged serial
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killer living amongst them. >> we have recovered 11 victims. we have recovered ten bodies and one partial skeleton from the imperial avenue address. they're all african-american women. seven died of ligature strangulation, one died of manual strangulation, and two the decomposition of the body precludes accuracy. we're diagnosing that as homicidal violence in two cases. and the last case, the autopsy is ongoing. does not appear to have a ligature and will undoubtedly be a case of manual strangulation or homicidal violence. >> it is now mounting to nearly a dozen dead women. are there more? put money on it. >> there were some in the attic. that's where they were first discovered. two bodies so badly decomposed, we're told, that they couldn't even determine the sex right away. they also found bodies in a crawl space below some stairs.
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they found a skull inside of a bucket in the basement. they also found bodies buried outside behind the home. >> would you prefer to have the grand jury for further proceedings, is that correct? >> seems like every time they go into this house, they find something more. they're going to tear through this place wall to wall and make sure there's nothing left to be found. and breaking news tonight, live, the florida panhandle, a close-knit community reeling after a newborn baby girl sleeping in the same bedroom as her parents vanishes without a trace. halloween. the story now becoming more distorted. as we go to air, is there a break in the case? police, as we speak, combing a gray van for evidence. but tonight, we want to know who took baby shannon.
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shocking revelations in the search for missing 7-month-old baby girl shannon dedrick. just two months prior to shannon going missing, the family babysitter alleges a pattern of abuse and begs the state for help. but that babysitter also faced allegations of abuse herself. >> something is not fitting together with the story. this is a 7-month-old baby girl. she cannot walk. it's my understanding she cannot crawl yet. >> another huge gap in this story is the fact that the parents have not made any personal appeals. i really believe that this story is going to be solved, or this case will be solved close to home, rather than far away from home. >> the department of children and families releasing information on two investigations. into shannon's parents, chrystina lynne mercer and james dedrick. >> i think they're alleging foul play. i think they seem to be pointing fingers directly at the parents. >> one investigation into drug use around the child.
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the second investigation over allegations members of the home shook baby shannon. both investigations result in no criminal charges. >> it is disturbing. i think there's some serious questions about these parents. and the fact that they would be asleep from 3:00 a.m. until 11:00 just does not make sense. >> parents forced to complete counseling and take drug tests, as the search continues for baby shannon. many are asking, did this have to happen in the first place? >> good evening. i'm nancy grace. i want to thank you for being with us. breaking news tonight, live, ohio. cops raid the home of a convicted sex offender accused of yet another sex attack. inside his three-story cleveland home, seasoned detectives stunned. women's bodies hidden throughout. bodies on every floor of the home, even stuffed in the crawl spaces. bombshell tonight, as the excavation goes on in and around
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the home, a former marine, anthony sowell, the body count of murdered women rises. >> 11 victims. there were six inside the house, and five recovered from the yard. seven ligature strangulations, one manual strangulation, two that are going to be homicidal violence, and then one autopsy is going on. >> breaking news. we now have 11 bodies recovered at the home of anthony sowell. he was in court today. >> given the nature and the gruesomeness of the allegations that have been placed against you, the court believes that you be held without bond. >> i have to believe they'll go back to the house and dig a little deeper, because of the skull, and we need to find where the rest of the body's at. >> the bodies buried in the ground, decomposed eight times slower than a body left in air. so we had two in the third floor out in the air. we had two bodies under dirt.
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and we had five buried in the yard. so they're all decomposing at different rates. they have the features for months to years for how long they've been down. >> we'll go bit by bit, piece by piece through the house. make sure we didn't miss anything. >> leaving no stone unturned? >> yes. >> ripping things apart? >> yep. >> the excavation goes on. the police now set to tear down the walls to look in the walls starting in the morning. for those of you just joining us, cleveland suburbs, the body count rises inside a three-story house of horrors. a former marine, anthony sowell, lives there. in the last 24 hours, the body count goes up to 11 murdered women. out to dan haggerty, standing there out in front of the home. he's joining us from wews.
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dan haggerty, 11 dead murdered women. so far, what are the cops' plans? what more is there to investigate? i understand they have yet to tear the walls down? >> they said they plan to dig a little deeper. that may be an underestimate. they're working on getting a warrant today to go in tomorrow morning with the fire department and they're literally going to rip this home apart. they're going to tear down the walls. they're going to check every inch. they're going to make sure nothing else is inside of this house, that there's no more evidence. and for sure, there are no more bodies. >> hold on. you mean they've got to get an additional warrant in order to tear the walls down? >> yeah, that's what we hear. we hear that they had to have a different type of search warrant to be able to go in there and actually start to demolish parts of the home, to tear down the walls. and to search inside the actual structure of the house. >> dan haggerty joining us outside the home with wews. dan haggerty, i understand that they can confirm eight of the women died by strangulation,
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seven of them by ligature. for instance, with a rope or a pair of stockings. one by manual strangulation. is it true that the ligatures were still around the necks of the dead women? >> right. it wasn't real hard for the coroner to figure that one out. that's how they knew that the suspect here, possibly anthony sowell, used either a cord or a rope to strangle his victims. they said when they found these decomposed bodies, the ones that they knew had been strangled in that way, still had that rope or that cord around their neck. >> to ken robinson, joining us from wtam, 1100 news radio, also joining us in front of sowell's home. ken robinson, what more can you tell me? are people still gathering out in front of the home? this is day three, wondering every time they bring a gurney out with a body on it, is that my mother, is that my sister, is that my daughter under that sheet?
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>> that's absolutely correct. people have been here since day one. waiting on the coroner, waiting in front of the house, looking, watching, wondering what's going to happen next. this series of crimes has rocked this neighborhood. there's a gamut of emotions flowing through the neighborhood right now from anguish. people wondering why police didn't find out something was going on here earlier. people wondering, are they safe now? some have lost confidence in the police. i had one gentleman tell me that he's thinking about starting his own patrol through the neighborhood because he's lost confidence in the police department. >> i want to go to a special guest joining us right now. everyone, we are taking your calls live. and with me right now is the daughter of the one woman who has been identified so far. the mother of three. she had two girls and one boy. with me is donnita carmichael, the daughter of tonia
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carmichael. miss carmichael, thank you for being with us. >> thank you for having me on. me and my family. >> we are showing some absolutely beautiful shots of your mom. we've got her at a barbecue, we've got her in front of a little gambling slot machine. there she is wearing a baseball cap. there she is dressed in a santa claus outfit. got a little hat on. there she is with her family. and i just cannot imagine leaving lucy, my little girl, and john david, my little boy, behind. to grow up in this world without a mother. tell me how you learned that your mother's body had been hidden in this home for a year.
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>> well, nancy, first of all, let me just thank you for putting this story out there. i was listening to the show as it got started, and i was hearing the response you had given it. it was not just like you were speaking from the family. you know, a lot of those things you touched on as far as what's still taking so long for the other families to find out the information that we tragically had to find out today is still unbelievable. a search warrant, are you kidding me? you know? it's devastating enough that this murderous person was able to stay out on the streets and do this heinous act that he's done for so long. without being detected. it's just very hard to believe. >> everyone, you are seeing -- >> but my grandmother is doing well. unfortunately the information she had to find out about her child is discomforting because she lost a child. i lost a mother, as well as my older sister and my younger
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brother. as you can see from the pictures, she had a beautiful smile. she was a beautiful person. she was a family-oriented person. she loved her family. she loved the holidays. she loved to horseback ride. she loved to make jokes to make her grandchildren smile. that's the legacy we're trying to make sure gets out there. the slot machines, she loved vegas, she loved going to the bahamas. those were the things, for the ones who really truly knew my mother.
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some looked very old. years, not months. but it's hard to tell. it's difficult.
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there's four or five different disposal situations with different characteristics. at a crawl space, open air in a room, cool basement, buried in earth, and so they're all going to decompose at different rates. and internally, body size and infection at the time of death can alter decomposition as well. >> and the excavation goes on in the cleveland home, a three-story home of former marine, anthony sowell. the body count has actually risen. it is now at 11. and we learned tonight that sowell may be linked to other crimes on women in california. isn't it correct, dan haggerty joining us from wews, that sowell was stationed with the marines, he was honorably discharged in both north carolina and california? what can you tell me about the possibility he's connected to crimes in california?
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>> i don't know about the possibility of him being connected to these crimes. all we know right now is he did enlist in the marines. this is in 1978. he was 18 years old. he was a marine for eight years. he did serve in north carolina and california. and we know that he is being investigated right now as possibly connected to unsolved rapes there in those states. but for now, especially in concord, california, doing investigations there to see if he's connected to any unsolved rapes there. but for now, that's all we know about that part of the investigation. >> stacey newman, our producer on the story, stacey, what more have we learned as we went to air tonight? >> just when you think it couldn't get any more bizarre tonight, nancy, we have uncovered that anthony sowell, he trolled a sex fetish website. was he using this to learn victims? we don't know. but what i can tell you is, just weeks after his release from prison, he put up a profile, wanting to dominate women using
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the sex fetish website. >> you are seeing the anthony sowell profile from a sex fetish website,, the one that stacey newman is describing right now. stacey, are you telling me that he did this just weeks after getting out of the pen on attempted rape? >> just weeks. and what we've also uncovered is, his last login was at least about three months ago. >> we are taking your calls live. to barbara in maryland. hi, barbara. >> caller: hi, nancy. >> hi, dear. what's your question? >> caller: i just want to say that i wish there were more people in the world like you, we would be so much better off. you and your twins are angels. >> thank you. >> caller: and my question was, why on earth wasn't anyone watching this monster when he was released from prison? >> to sergeant scott haines, sheriff's office, santa rosa county, florida. sergeant, i've never seen --
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well, actually i have seen a few cases like this. he got sentenced to 15 years. he did the full 15. that's my understanding. and that is extremely rare. they did not let this guy out. and he did all sorts of classes behind bars, like cage your rage. they made him go through that. they made him go through anger management. clearly they knew he had a severe problem. >> absolutely. somebody who does the full 15 years doesn't get paroled, or out on probation, and kept that entire time, they're a dangerous person. they're not going to be rehabilitated. and they had a responsible to follow this person closely. >> what about it, pat brown? >> absolutely. i mean, this guy probably committed lots of crimes before he was 30 when he went in, and we have seen he's committed lots of crimes when he came out. he is not rehabilitatable.
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six of them are described as african-american women, and at least five of them appear to have been strangled. they were all found in and around the house of 50-year-old anthony sowell. >> you could smell the dead bodies. >> there are a whole lot of people showing up in this neighborhood. dozens of missing women, and their families and their loved ones that have been showing up here, and trying to figure out if their loved ones are one of the bodies inside of this home. >> the likelihood that there are victims in other places, missing people who were never recovered, and no one knows their whereabouts, is extremely high.
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>> i guarantee it, they look at california, north carolina, where he was stationed with the marines, there are going to be women there who have never been found, never been accounted for. >> we've obtained a warrant to get the dna from the suspect. we're in the process of now entering it in the state database and also the national database, to see if we have any hits relative to any criminal activity relative to this particular suspect across our nation. >> this is exactly ten bodies in different stages of decomposition. how can you not smell that? how can you not investigate it a little bit better? >> it's no longer ten bodies. the body count rising in the last 24 hours to 11 bodies. and now an additional search warrant has to be obtained in order for the police to start tearing down the walls. don't think that is so far-fetched. if you recall, the recent yale medical student, annie le, she was murdered, her body hidden in a 24-inch space in the wall.
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before they could tear down this house of horrors, they've got to go back to court and get another search warrant. that is why the wall excavation did not happen today. there is a crowd of mourners and onlookers standing beyond that yellow crime scene tape tonight. wondering each time a body is pulled out on a gurney, is that my mother, my sister, my daughter who's gone missing? we are taking your calls live. out to deb in michigan. hi, deb. >> caller: hi, nancy. i wanted to thank you for fighting for those that don't have a voice. >> thank you. >> caller: my question is, the serial killer, are they going to be looking at his past addresses to see if there are bodies there? >> to dan hagerty joining us there in front of sowell's home, what do we know about that? i mean, i know that he got out of the pen on attempted rape conviction. 15 years in the pen on that. did he move straight here to
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this location, or was there a stopover in between? >> he moved here. he moved to this neighborhood, and this house, in cleveland. and he's lived here since, in 2005, right after being released from prison. like we've been saying, the coroner hasn't given us an exact date on when these women were killed. but they say it could be years, months, or weeks. some say that the killings could have started right after he moved here in 2005. >> back to you, stacey. what do you know about any link to california crimes? >> here's what we know. cops are also looking into coronado, california. this is right near san diego. of course, this is where sowell was stationed. they're looking into a 1979 rape case there. now, i can also tell you, there's reports that a woman in north carolina has come forward to say she believes she was raped by sowell sometime in the '70s. but of course, cops have not been able to verify that. they are still looking into that as well.
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>> i'm going to go to a special guest we have with us tonight dr. lillian glass, psychologist, joining us out of l.a., and pat brown, criminal profiler and author. also with us is the daughter of the only victim as of tonight that has been positively identified. lillian glass, pat brown, let's talk about it just very briefly before i go to the victim's daughter, donnita carmichael. first to you, lillian glass. i have three scenarios in mind. number one, he is acting out in rage and anger toward women. number two, after being convicted on rape and attempted rape and doing 15 years, he decided to kill all of his future victims so there would be no evidence, no eyewitnesses. and three, he has an insatiable desire to murder. those are my only three scenarios. do you have any other ideas, lillian glass? >> they're all correct and all absolutely right. because this is a man that is a
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misogynist. he hates women. he's methodical in how he kills them -- >> hold on, lillian. excuse me, rosie, i want to see the photos of tonia carmichael. she is a beautiful mother of three. she leaves behind two girls and a boy. her body hidden in sowell's home for the past year. decomposing, along with the bodies of ten other women, that we know of. go ahead, lillian. >> no, you're absolutely correct. when you're looking at the pain that this family has to endure now, my heart goes out to the daughter and to all of the relatives. because it's so difficult. >> to you, pat brown. theories on motive? not that the state needs motive. but you can't tell me this guy's
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crazy. don't even start singing that same tired song. he's trolling on the internet looking for victims as recently as nine weeks ago. he's not crazy. but what about motive? >> nancy, you'll never hear the crazy word from me when it comes to serial killers. serial killers are psychopaths and they want power and control. somewhere in their lives they lost it and want to get back at society, and particularly women. they like to put the blame somewhere. i would be curious to see what his behaviors were in the marines. a lot of times you get the honorable discharge because they want to get rid of you or accused of throwing you out for no reason. they'll give you an honorable discharge just to get you out of there. it will be interesting to see. he had to have committed crimes before that time. he did not just jump up at 30 years old and decide to start raping and murdering women. >> i think you may be right about that, pat brown.
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veterans all over this country are shocked that this guy is a former marine that served our country. i want to go to dr. kent harshbarger, medical examiner, forensic pathologist. of course, we know that many of these bodies still had the ligature around the neck. and that's a whole other psychological can of worms, all right? but before i go there, how can they tell with the other bodies, the mode of death? >> well, it's assumed from the scene, generally, if they can't first and 10 a cause of death because of decomposition you will assume it will be homicidal violence -- >> i was wondering about that. >> we say undetermined. it means we can't tell. but from the scenario, the circumstances around this death, there's no other explanation other than violence. >> dr. harshbarger, have you ever dealt with a forensic artist, a reconstructionist? i had to unfortunately as a
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prosecutor when bodies were so decomposed they could not be identified. so you could get a composite sketch of what you thought the victim looked like in life, so as to identify her. have you ever dealt with one of those artists? >> yes, i have. it's rare nowadays because of dna analysis and other technologies. but it is done. it's done by tissue thicknesses on the skull and then they make a clay model and then make renderings from that. it takes an artist, the hair color, eye color, the shape of the nose. the artist is creating the look of this person. >> it's very, very difficult. it's a highly, highly specialized field. to donnita carmichael, this is tonia carmichael's daughter. her mother's body has been positively identified as one of the 11 women in sowell's home. miss carmichael, i didn't hear during our last interchange how
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you discovered your mother was one of sowell's alleged victims. >> the police actually came to my grandmother's home, my mom's mother's home, and told us that there was a positive dna match. >> i'm just looking at these pictures of your mom, and she has the most beautiful smile. donnita, tell me something about her. what were her joys in life? what was she like? >> well, as you can see from the photographs, she had a gorgeous smile. thank you for the compliment on that. but she loved her family. she loved the holidays and vacations. she loved to cook and prepare meals, thanksgiving or christmas. she loved seafood. she loved trips to vegas.
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she just loved her family. >> she loved life. everyone, you are seeing shots of victim tonia carmichael. she is one of 11 that we know of, as the body count rises in that cleveland suburb. tonight, safety tips. women are easy targets. especially at night. how can you protect yourself? have a place to meet others if you become separated. never leave a drink unattended. it's so easy to slip something like ghb, the date rape drug, in a drink. designate a safe driver or use a taxi service, please. identify security guards. locate exits in case of emergency. and trust your instinct. if you don't feel safe for whatever reason, leave. for more information, go to
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41-year-old james arthur baker and his wife, susan, also 41, reported their 3-year-old son, paul, missing. a massive search for the boy turned up nothing. meanwhile, james and susan baker moved out of south carolina and into rural washington county, florida. authorities were suspicious. washington county sheriff's investigators began walking the baker property closely. south carolina authorities had received a tip the bakers had killed their son and dumped the body. >> law enforcement says they have a person of interest but still refuse to name them. where is 7-month-old baby shannon? >> straight out to allison walker with wmbb. allison, i understand as we go to air, police are searching a gray van in connection with little shannon's disappearance. who owns the van?
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>> the sheriff's office and the florida department of law enforcement are not saying who owns the van. we know they have it at the sheriff's office. they are looking for evidence in the van, searching it thoroughly. neighbors have said that shannon -- or that susan baker does drive a gray van, but we do not have that confirmed. we don't know that for sure. >> now, clark goldband, susan baker would be the babysitter? >> yes, nancy. she is the babysitter. she's been there about two months working with the family. susan baker, the babysitter, also sending an e-mail to the governor of florida, charlie crist, pleading with him just a few weeks ago, to save the child. saying the child is around an abusive household. the child has been shaken by her parents, and also shannon has also inhaled drugs, such as marijuana, and smoke from cigarettes. when instructed by staff at the hospital not to smoke around the child. >> wait a minute, clark
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goldband, this babysitter has problems of her own. >> she does, nancy. and they stem back to 1987 when the sitter reported her stepson missing. he was 3 years old, went down for a nap. she says when she returned, the child was gone. >> wait a minute, when she returned from where? >> from the home. it's not exactly clear where she went. she says allegedly when she came back from the house, the 3-year-old was gone. as investigators searched all-out for the 3-year-old boy, they examined her 6-year-old stepdaughter and that stepdaughter had welts and broken bones. so this sitter -- >> and she becomes a babysitter in the home where little shannon disappears. but still, to allison walker, that doesn't clear up the discrepancies. the parents' story, they say the baby's asleep in the room with them. they all sleep until 11:30 in the morning. you know, by that time, i've been up at least five hours. so they're sacked out at 11:30
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a.m. and then they find out the baby's missing? >> yes, that's true. >> so they place themselves with the missing child at the time she disappears, correct, allison walker? >> that's correct. >> with us tonight, fay wood, the godmother of the missing child, shannon. miss wood, thank you for being with us. miss wood, what can you tell me about the home in which this little girl lived? >> i met them, they lived right across the road from where we reside at. i've been in the house several times without telling them i was coming. they had no notice. i would just open up the door and i would go in. and the baby was always fine. they never abused that child. that baby was healthy. and where every said the baby weighed 11 pounds, the baby was not no big 30-pound baby or anything. but she weighed more than 11 pounds.
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she was a preemie when she was born. >> i know how that was. my daughter was born at two pounds. what can you tell me about possible marijuana and cigarette use around the baby? >> now, they did smoke cigarettes. but the marijuana use, no, ma'am. >> i hope that you're right about that. i mean, cigarettes are bad enough. they are a known contributor to sudden infant death syndrome. but marijuana is another animal altogether. miss wood, for the longest time, the parents' names were not even out there. they're not making any public pleas whatsoever. why did they want to keep their names secret? >> the only thing i could figure is they're doing what the sheriff of washington county was asking them to do. >> hmm. kirby clements, allen ripka, this is a conundrum. you've got the parents sacked out until 11:30 a.m. no baby sleeps until 11:30 a.m. it's -- no.
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all right? that's not a statistic, that's just what i know. now you've got this babysitter coming onto the scene. she's had a problem with a missing child way back home from where she came from. kirby, what about it? >> well, first of all, i think the babysitter is suspect number one. because apparently whenever little children are around her, they go missing. in this letter to the governor, who does that? she could call the sheriff. she could have called the family -- children and family services. she writes a letter to the governor. there's something wrong with that babysitter and something afoot with her. i think she's going to be your person. >> allen ripka, what about it? right now there are no named suspects. go ahead, ripka. >> there's no named suspects because they have no evidence against the babysitter or evidence against either one of the parents. >> well, you don't know that. >> if they did, they would certainly be a person of interest or potentially a suspect. >> no, allen. as a matter of fact, they may
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not want to name them yet. they may know exactly who they're looking at. but hoping they'll give them enough rope to hang themselves. i'm sure you've heard of that ploy before, allen ripka. >> well, if you're thinking they want to follow -- >> just to jump up and say they don't have any evidence, that's a bald-faced statement right there. >> if you think the police are thinking the parents or babysitter are going to lead them to the child, well, i hope that's the case. everyone on a happy note, as we go to break. today marks one of the most wonderful days of my life. on this date two years ago we were all in intensive care. today they turned 2. i truly believe your prayers were heard as they were lifted up. breaking news, prayer changes things. happy birthday, lucy and john david. this is this morning about 5:30 a.m. i made them cookies last night
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to go with their candle. in the other shot, those were some participator crowns that we made for them to wear today. 
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