tv Q A CSPAN November 8, 2009 8:00pm-9:00pm EST
breaking news tonight, live. the florida panhandle. a newborn baby girl sleeping in the same bedroom with her parents, vanishes without a trace. halloween. the story becoming more distorted by the minute. bombshell, tonight in the last hours, cops blast into the home of the baby-sitter. and to their shock, discover a tiny baby shannon. just 11 pounds, trapped, hidden and locked inside a wooden chest. no bottle. no pillow. no stuffed toy. but miracle tonight is
7-month-old baby shannon, alive! behind bars, the baby-sitter whose own little stepson went missing without a trace 22 years ago. he's never been found. oh, yeah. and in the cell next to baby-sitter, mommy. that's right, mommy, who wanted to get rid of her own infant girl, little baby shannon. >> we are the proud papas of a little girl. this is shannon lee dedrick. >> relatives of baby shannon learned that not only had she been found but that she's alive. >> we do not usually get to the happy endings that we had happen here today. >> reporter: shannon was found in a box under the bed of susan baker, her step-aunt.
>> the only thing in that box was a blanket and a box of baking soda to cover the odor because she had fouled her diaper, soiled it. >> if you want to see a bunch of grown men cry, tonight we rushed her to the hospital and we all were calling home for a while to let them know we found this baby safe. >> at an emotional news conference today the washington county sheriff talked about finding little shannon alive. >> this box that had a lid on it and also had a had clasp on it. she was in the box -- excuse me. she was in the box for almost 12 hours in a closed box. >> and breaking news tonight, live, ohio. cops raid the home of a convicted sex offender accused
of yet another sex attack. inside his three-story cleveland home, seasoned detectives stunned. women's bodies hidden throughout. bodies on every floor of the home, even stuffed in the crawl spaces. breaking tonight, the body count rises as the excavation goes on, in addition to the 11 dead women found, so far, in the three-story home of former marine anthony sowell. police now suspect another 14 missing women may have died at his hands. in the last hours, real-life "csi," firefighter, homicide detectives, cadaver dogs -- all back at sowell's home, as they begin to literally tear down the walls. in the search for dead women. and also breaking tonight, two more lady victims identified. 31-year-old tishana culver and
telacia fortson, mother of three. positively identified. tonight, relatives of two lady victims with us live. their mother, their daughter, bodies, hidden in this house of horrors for the last year. and in another bizarre twist, we confirm just weeks after sowell's release from the pen, he lists himself on a sex website seeking, quote, a submissive. is this one the ways the former marine trolled for victims? tonight, unsuspected neighbors in shock over an alleged serial killer living amongst them. >> the body count increases in the house of horrors in cleveland. >> 11 victims. there were six inside the house
and five recovered from the yard. >> they describe it, after the fact, as a smell of death. of rotting flesh of dead bodies. >> we received a phone call from a resident that said, councilman, there's a foul odor that's coming from across the street. and it smells like a dead person. not dead meat, not dead animal, dead person. >> you could smell the stench a block away. >> literally going to rip this home apart. they're going to tear down the walls. they're going on check every inch. they will make sure that nothing else is inside of this house. that there's no more evidence and for sure there are no more bodies. >> the bodies buried in the ground decompose eight times slower than a body left in air. so we had two in the third floor out in the air, we had two bodies under dirt, and we had five buried in the yard. so they're all decomposing at different rates. >> they're going to dig a little deeper because of her skull and
we need to find where the rest of the bodies are. >> good evening, i'm nancy grace. i want to thank you for being with us. live, the florida panhandle. a newborn baby girl sleeping in the same bedroom with her parents, vanishes without a trace. halloween. the story becoming more distorted by the minute. bombshell tonight. in the last hours, cops blast into the home of the babysitter and to their shock, discover a tiny baby shannon, just 11 pounds, trapped, hidden and locked inside a wooden chest, no bottle, no pillow, no stuffed toy. but the miracle tonight is, there is a god. 7-month-old baby shannon alive. >> shannon dedrick was found in a 2x3 foot cedar chest underneath a bed.
understand, under the bed, the box shoved in the back and a lot of material in front of it. to see if anyone was looking. >> she's missing for five days and she's so tiny, we just expected the worst. >> they learned that shannon was alive as she was brought into the room by the sheriff and gave the baby an emotional welcome back. >> cops say they found baby shannon dedrick lying in a 2x3 foot cedar box. shoved under a bed. stashed there for over 12 hours. the baby-sitter/aunt is charged in this. she has a violent criminal past. and now we're hearing and just hours ago cops charged files against baby shannon's mom, the one who reported her missing halloween day. >> just hours ago investigators weren't even sure if baby shannon was still alive. now she's found alive and well, reunited with her family. >> i was immediately taken to the northwest florida community hospital here in chipley where she was examined by the local
doctor. shannon is currently located at the hospital and we understand that she's in good condition. >> straight out to will glover, joining us from the panama city, "news herald." will, what happened? what cops to storm the home of the baby-sitter? >> well, apparently, nancy, this morning a story about an e-mail that ms. baker had sent to governor charlie crist detailing allegations of abuse. that had piqued the interest of law enforcement. they were able to perhaps prod them along. they decided to go out to ms. baker's house out in rural washington county. >> right. >> about 8:30 last night, they went and received consent to search the house. at the back of the bed and
pushed back behind things and no one could see them was a 2x3 cedar chest inside when they opened the latch they found alive and well baby shannon. >> you know it's a miracle. and it's my understanding, to you clark goldband, the baby is not just a cardboard box under a bed. this child was in a wooden chest. take a look at this. locked down. it's like a cedar chest. and nothing to eat. nothing -- of course she can't eat. only seven months. no bottle, no toy, nothing. in fact, they had put baking soda in the box because the baby would poop and the baby had been in this box for many, many hours locked inside a box, clark goldband? >> 10 to 12 hours, nancy, is what law enforcement is saying. and you are right, that is a thick two-foot by three-foot chest and you have to wonder exactly how much air that child had been getting, although law enforcement did say in a press conference the child did receive
some form of oxygen. >> joining me right now is a very special guest, kandis boyer. this is baby shannon's grandmother. ms. boyer, thank you for being with us. >> thank you. >> where is the baby tonight? >> well, she is safely in the arms of a wonderful couple in a medical house. she is in the custody of the state of florida. and she's just in wonderful health. she has a clean bill of health. and she's beautiful. i spent three hours with her today. >> and i understand you have quite a drive to get to your little grandchild. how far did you go to get to her today? >> yes. today, well, it took us about 14 hours to get here. 875 miles. >> 700 miles. grandmother -- >> 800. >> 800 miles. nearly 900 miles.
she's driven to get to this baby. ms. boyer, whose mother are you, the mother or the daddy's? >> chrystina mercer is my daughter. >> she is behind bars tonight. why in the world would she want to give the baby to the baby-sitter? >> well, as confused as tina is, i -- i -- i have to tell you, she has emphatically stated that she did not and would not ever harm her child. and in my whole heart believe that she was manipulated into this situation. >> what about it, marc klaas? what do you think, mommy manipulated? >> well, i -- it's against every maternal extinct i've ever heard of to give up your child and then report it missing. this is one the craziest stories i've ever heard in my life. >> well, all i know is this, marc klaas, this baby is alive. but it has been locked for 12
hours in a wooden chest. no bottle. no toy. nothing. police find the baby. today washington county sheriff, congratulations! we are taking your calls live. with us, baby shannon's maternal grandmother. mommy behind bars with the baby-sitter who has a record of her own. >> she was in the box for almost 12 hours in a closed box. shannon was immediately taken to the northwest florida community hospital here in chipley where she was examined by the local doctor. shannon is currently located at the hospital and we understand that she's in good condition.
shannon detrick was found in a 2 x 3 cedar chest underneath a bed. this box had a lid on it and also had a hasp on it. >> shannon was found in a box under the bed of susan baker, her step-aunt. they believe she had been in that box since around 8:00 wednesday morning. >> susan baker, the baby-sitter, also sending an e-mail to the governor of florida charlie christ, pleading with him just a few weeks ago to save the child. >> the family's joyous right
now. >> my life will be a lot better now that i know that she's safe. >> we rushed her to the hospital and we all called it home for a -- to our wives to let them know that we found this baby safe. >> i've got in my hand here the letter that this so-called baby-sitter sent to the governor complaining about these parents. this has clearly been in the works for some time. but how do you convince the birth mother to give up her 7-month-old baby girl? take a look at this e-mail to the governor. "the baby's being abused. i have seen the dad pick her up and shake her because she cries. others in the home have also shaken the baby. she accuses the parents smoking heavily and doing dope, dealing their food stamps for drugs, all around the baby." joining me right now, special guest, dr. robert cartwright, out of atlanta. pediatrician.
dr. cartwright, if a little baby, this -- i mean they told me when i brought the twins home, not to even have somebody that smoked around them because it could induce s.i.d.s., sudden infant death syndrome. and here they are smoking pot, according to this source, and heavily smoking cigarettes around the baby, that we know of, much less shaking the baby? >> absolutely. this is something that really is outrageous and we really encourage parents never to smoke around their children. certainly that applies to certain regular cigarettes but smoking marijuana is even that much worse. are there certainly plenty more chemicals and toxins that are in marijuana smoke as compared to cigarette smoke. neither is good. we certainly know that cigarette smoke is a risk factor for sudden infant death syndrome as you have mentioned. it's a risk for other infections. ear infections. nasal issues. asthma, other lung diseases. >> and you know, dr. cartwright, the list goes on and i will not even mention the fact that the baby is locked inside this cedar
chest. you know back out to you, will glover with the panama city "news herald." a lot of e-mails and phoners are calling in that this looks more like a coffin. what about that, will glover? >> i would agree. it's very small. it's more like a -- almost like a larger jewelry box, if you ask me. and she tucked it back there and apparently would put the baby there every time the cops would inquire about anything. >> this is just sick. we are talking your calls. out to diane in florida. hi, diane. >> caller: hi, nancy. i love your show and your twins are beautiful. >> thank you. >> caller: my question is, exactly how was baby shannon breathing in that locked box? >> good question. what about it, will glover? how was the baby breathing? >> there apparently were some holes that were poked into the wooden box that would allow the baby to breathe and of course now the baby was also found under a bed, back against the wall, with stuff covering the
surrounding ,you know, surrounding this chest. >> this is a miracle. this is a miracle. look at this baby. rosy, keep it on a full screen. look at the baby. she's absolutely gorgeous. when i think of what could have happened to this child -- and out to you, pat brown. it sounds like they poked holes in the box like it's a fifth grader's science experiment with a bug or a rat and you poke holes so it can breathe. >> well, exactly. this baby-sitter wasn't concerned about the baby. this is an object to her. whether it lives or dies, doesn't matter as long as she gets to play her game, get attention and do what she wants. >> bethany marshall, remember the baby-sitter's little 6-year-old stepson's body has never been found. >> i think this baby-sitter had a preoccupation with getting the baby away from the mother in order to have the mother's attention all to herself. i've treated women like this in my practice. and they're envious of babies. they resent them and they want to get rid of them.
we're going to take you straight back to baby shannon's discovery. but out to michael borg with breaking news. what can you tell me about the latest at the killeen, texas shooting, michael? >> we now know that major malik hasan, who shot and killed 11 people on ft. hood here in texas this afternoon, before he was killed, was actually going to be deployed later this month. he was set to be deployed out to iraq and this was going to be his first deployment. it talks a lot about his mindset.
although we don't know exactly what triggered this tragic shooting at ft. hood. we do know, sort of, what was going on in his mind when he pulled two handguns and started firing wildly into this crowd which is here at this readiness facility here at ft. hood. >> i was told they were m-16s, is that true? >> no, it's handguns. the m-16s is what the infantrymen would use. sipts he's major, he's a army officer, they were two handguns. >> so they were not m-16s. >> michael, how many dead? >> a total of 12 dead, including major hasan. that death toll is probably going to rise later this evening. there were two of the people who were wounded who are in very critical condition. one woman who was apparently shot in the face. >> oh. >> reports that she might have already passed. we're trying to confirm that, but nancy, expect the death toll to rise tonight. >> and let me ask you this, did hasan have a family he was leaving behind, if he were to deploy to iraq? >> that's not clear yet. i know he's from virginia. he comes from -- apparently he comes from a family that's an islamic family. they did not approve of him
joining the army. i do not believe he had a family that he's left behind. but you know that's all going to come out as the investigation continues into this. >> with us michael board, woai newsradio. and michael board, very quickly, at first the media was told that there were three shooters, but it's my understanding there's only one, hasan. >> that's what it looks like. there is still one person who is being questioned, but several people that were questioned earlier today have already been released. it looks like major hasan was the only shooter. >> okay, everybody, we're taking your calls live. i want to go back to baby shannon's discovery. we'll bring you the latest regarding the mass shooting at ft. hood, that's killeen, texas, as it comes in. as you know, 31 shot, 12 known dead. many of them in critical condition. the hospital tonight. i want to go back right now to the maternal grandmother of baby shannon. she's with us tonight. kandis boyer, but first unleash the lawyers. mickey sherman, veteran criminal defense attorney, author of "how
you can defend those people?" and renowned attorney out of new york, richard herman. let's see sherman and herman up on the big screen. there they are. all right, herman, i don't know what you're -- thanks. i don't know what you're smiling about, but i would like to know how you can weave the story of mommy was manipulated. she didn't know what was happening. >> well, first, let me thank marc klaas for doing an incredible job discovering, helping in the discovery, five days after the report of missing. that's phenomenal. thank god there's a healthy baby here. this is -- >> herman, please answer the question. >> this is apaunt who has had this baby on many occasions in the past. the baby's slept there. >> put herman on the screen. not a locked wooden chest. >> nothing more than a family member taking a child for a period of time. they got it wrong. baker is a hero? >> really.
let me ask you this, sherman. where does the 911 call from mommy fit in. >> i'm not so sure she's a hero. these are wacky people, simple as that. >> that's your defense? you are going to stand in front of a jury and say, they're wacky? >> all prosecuted based upon the result. thank god that nobody got killed or nobody's dying here. >> you know what -- >> okay. >> -- b.s. and i am holding my tongue, all right? don't start trying to tell me there's not a prosecution because the baby happened to live. you know what, that is thanks to god. this is definitely a miracle. but huh-uh. no, no, no, no, no. they can be forgiven while they are behind bars. but what i want to figure out and the grandmother is with me. kandis boyer has driven nearly 900 miles to get to her baby granddaughter. ms. boyer, you just told me that your daughter, baby shannon's mother, has said, "so many different things." like, what? what she saying? >> caller: for one, that she
didn't know where her child was. for two that she did not harm her child. and the stories were always different. she's very confused. very confused. and you know, but we're going to stand behind my daughter. i love my daughter deeply and we're behind her 100%, no matter what she has to go through. >> right. well, she is very, very lucky to have you for a mother, ms. boyer. but i don't see how those stories are different. what does she say in one story that was different from another story? >> well, for instance, she took the baby out for a walk at one time, went for a walk, came back, didn't have the baby. another story, 30 seconds later would be i went for a walk at this time and came back and put the baby to bed, woke up, she was gone. just so many different stories that -- it's unbelievable how confused my daughter is.
>> go ahead, mrs. boyer. >> but she has always -- she's always had this confusion, mentally confusion problem. she's always -- she's been to numerous counseling over the years. she needs help and she's going to get the help she needs now. >> ms. boyer, is the man on the birth certificate actually the biological father? because we've been told he's not. >> i do not know that. i do not know that at all. >> back to you clark goldband. now those are different stories. what was the story they told police when they made that 911 call? >> well, the mom told law enforcement simply that she went to sleep around 3:00 a.m. woke up around 11:00 a.m. shannon was gone. even though she was sleeping in the same room just feet away. >> okay, pat brown, you're the criminal profiler. mommy manipulated?
>> might have been manipulated, but i'm also seeing pathological lying. it's not a matter of confusion it's the problem, you try one story and you get that, that doesn't sound too good and you change your story. i knowledge that she went with the haleigh cummings story because it worked for them so she's thinking this will work to me. >> to bethany marshall. psychoanalyst. author of "deal breakers." joining us out of l.a. i'm not buying it. >> no. >> this grandmother is standing behind her daughter and i appreciate that but i do not believe what the girl is saying because she's told so many different stories and the story she told police is completely -- a completely third edition. now we're hearing she wanted to get rid of the baby so she gave the baby away. >> i think this baby's mother has a long history of acting confused to her own mother in order to avoid responsibility for what she's really done. and in this case what she did, she gave her own baby away. she had no maternal extinct as marc klaas said towards her own child. i think she allowed herself to
be manipulated by the other woman who resented the intrusion. >> what, i have to take issue with that. >> yes. >> you don't allow yourself to be manipulated. if you're allowing yourself to be manipulated, you're not manipulated. you're going along with a scheme. and bottom line, this baby nearly died, stuffed into what looks to be a wooden coffin hidden up underneath a bed, draped with material, covered up so police can't find it. this was not a matter of giving the child away to be adopted or else they would have not lied to police and put the baby in what looks to be a coffin. out to the lines. celiste in texas. >> caller: hi, nancy. >> what's your question, dear? >> caller: i watch your show all of the time and i appreciate what you do and god bless the men who found that baby but one of the questions that's been answered about the baby's abuse, but you look in that baby's eyes and you can tell that it's not a happy baby. a happy baby has happy eyes and this baby does not have happy eyes.
>> good question. dr. cartwright, you've looked at the baby via film. how does the baby look to you, quickly? >> well, it certainly looks somewhat healthy but i would counter the argument that this child is really healthy. the child looks malnourished. the child has a large head compared to the rest the child which would indicate a lack of nutrition. and i would agree with the caller. i think that the child's eyes don't look that great. >> we'll be right back with dr. cartwright taking your calls. but tonight, our family album. here are photos of the twins. lucy and john david. this is immediately after their birth. and i do not believe that they would be turning 2 this week if not without your prayers. and in connecticut, here's vicky and 2-year-old daughter eva dressed as a tiger for halloween. texas friends. high school teacher shelly and teen daughters margaret and macy. cheerleaders. a beautiful wedding photo of georgia friends chris and robin.
we have recovered 11 victims. we have recovered 10 bodies and one spashl skeleton from imperial avenue address. one autopsy is still being completed at this time. but they are all african-american women. seven died of ligature strangulation and one died of manual strangulation. two, the decomposition of the
body precludes accuracy sometimes and we're diagnosing that as homicidal violence in two cases and the last case, the autopsy is ongoing. it does not appear to have a ligature or what would be a case of manual strangulation or homicidal violence. so that's 11 victims. there were six inside the house and five recovered from the yard. >> straight out to dan hagerty. i understand that police now think that 14 more missing women may be dead at the hands of former marine sowell. >> well, right now we know from his house in cleveland, it's 11 bodies. it's 10 bodies and one skull.
police are back at the house tonight and they will be back there tomorrow and the next day. the fire department is with them. they are look pretty much for anything that we can find, a long road for them, especially now that they are going to be -- a third victim has been identified, a 31-year-old who lived on the same street where anthony sowell lived. she was never reported missing at all. we just got back from her family's home. they still live on this street. this was 45 minutes ago. we talked to her four kids. she has four children. she's been missing for a year. they thought she was with her boyfriend down in akron. never reported her missing. in fact, the police notified them. we know this was a dna identification. >> and to stacy, our producer on the story, what else can you tell us? >> let me tell you about the other victim they have identified today, nancy. her name is 31-year-old in june of this year. she is from east cleveland and to make a positive i.d. from
her, cops had to take dna from one of her small children. >> so she leaves small children behind. speaking of the victims. 11 lady victims that we know of so far. the excavation, tearing down, literally tearing down the walls, set to start looking for more dead ladies. there's the possibility tonight that 14 more women may be dead. and at the hands of former marine anthony sowell. that would raise the tally to 25 dead women. with me right now, very special guests, joining us at their family home, barbara carmichael, the mother of victim. also with her, donna carmichael,
her daughter. also joining us, deborah williams, the aunt of talacia fortson, her body identified today. first, to barbara carmichael, the mother of murder victim tonya carmichael. and as they are speaking, rosy, i would like you to show those beautiful photos we have of tonya carmichael. look at that smile. look at her. to her mother, barbara c carmicha carmichael. thank you for being with us. when did you learn your daughter was one of the victims allegedly of anthony sowell? >> tuesday. and thank you for having us. it's tuesday afternoon. >> wednesday. >> was it wednesday? >> uh-huh. >> the days are melting together here lately. wednesday afternoon. >> you know, ms. carmichael, i know how that feels when the
days all -- time just seems to stop and everything just seems to blend together. >> right. exactly. >> tell me about your little girl. would you please tell me about her? what was she like growing up? >> she's always been a beautiful person to me, of course. very lively, very active, very fun-loving, outgoing and friendly. i used to tell her, don't be so friendly to people that you don't know but this was the way that she was. growing up i had to kind of watch it, keep tight reigns on her like you do with most children, but she grew up to be a lovely adult. she had three children who he was carrying for by herself. >> really? she brought them up on her own?
>> by herself. >> and she had, i believe, two girls and a boy, right? >> right. the oldest girl is 37. middle girl is 32. her son is 24. >> and with us tonight is donna carmichael. this is tonya's -- one of her daughters. donna, if you could, give me one of your most vivid memories of your mother in life? >> the most vivid thing was, wow, there's so many. it's hard to take one. but i'll just say, when she says, clean the dishes, clean the dishes. >> you know what? i'm just thinking about my little girl lucy and my little boy and how she must feel even though you're all grown up, looking down on you from heaven
and realizing you're going to have to go on without your mother. with me right now is deborah williams. she's the aunt of the victim. her body identified today. vict talashe. her body identified today, talesha fortson. thank you for being with us. when did you learn your niece is allegedly one of sowell's many, many victims? >> today i guess about 1:00, 1:30. it was very hard. but we got to keep going, and we got to constantly pray for other families, and you know, stay strong for the children. she has three small children. >> how old are her children? >> the oldest one is six. the other one is 4 1/2, and the other is 2 1/2.
they're going to make sure there is no more evidence and for sure no more bodies. >> the bodies buried in the ground decompose eight time slower than bodies left in the air. we had two on the third floor, two bodies on the dirt, and we had five buried in the yard. so they're all decomposing at different rates. >> back to the house to dig a little deeper. >> seven died of ligature
strangulation. one died of manual strangulation. two, the decomposition of the body precludes accuracy sometimes. in the last case, the autopsy is ongoing. >> straight out to bill galadner, bill, i imagine that many, if not all of those 14 women police are talking about will be connected to sowell. >> yes, that's true. and they're going to be connected by hopefully by dna evidence. there is also the possibility that they're going to be doing some forensic work on computers that may have obtained from his home. that will then be able to tie the victims to sowell, and this is primarily what they're going to be doing. and as a result of the dna evidence that they may be able to have and further evidence that comes out of this case, they may be able to build quite a case against this monster. >> you're right, bill. and to you, dr. cartwright, a
lot of these women are skeletoni skeletonized. we know that one of the bodies is nothing but a skull. so from just the skull, how can they ever make an identification? >> well, certainly if you can get ahold of dental records, that would help to identify the particular person. also there is still dna to be found, even in any tissue, really. so it may be something where they can still get some dna, even though it is just bone. >> i should have thought of that, dr. cartwright, the dental records. that's how they're already making identifications. i very quickly want to go back to barbara and danita carmichael. danita, what are cops telling you about this case, about sowell? >> that's just it, nancy. we have not spoken to any police officials from cleveland or warrensville at this time. >> oh really? you know what? >> yes, ma'am. >> we'll try and get in touch
with them for you, tonight. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> everyone, let's stop. let's stop and remember. army private first class richard langenberger killed in iraq, awarded the army commendation medal. known as l.b., loved outdoors hunting, making others smile. richard langenbrunner, american hero. happy birthday to one of our superstars, floor manager samantha. uh-oh, she is turning 23. you're getting on up there, samantha! happy birthday, dear. i'll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp eastern. until then, good night, friend.