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tv   On the Record With Greta Van Susteren  FOX News  June 23, 2014 11:00pm-12:01am PDT

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we've got to stand up against it. >> appreciate it. that is all the time we have left this evening. record "hannity" the series each week night at 10:00 eastern and start your day with "fox and friends" 5:to 9:00. this is a fs alert. right now the irs under intense spotlight in a rare late night hearing investigating lois lerner's vanishing emails and you are looking live at the house oversight hearing starting any moment now on the still growing irs scandal. and tonight, irs commissioner john does kinnen is in the hot seat. we will continue monitoring the hearing and take you live as news warrants. right now fox news correspondent mike emanuel has more from the hill. >> we are expecting him to expecting tough questions about the disappearing email. we know that darrell issa has already questioned whether he has been telling the truth when he has come up here to capitol hill.
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we saw a lot of fireworks on friday before the house ways and means committee. we expect even more tonight in front of the house oversight committee, we do expect koskinen to come out. looking into what happened to lois lerner's emay that the treasury inspector general, the independent body is also investigating. if you don't take does kinnen's word for it. he will tell lawmakers there is somebody else investigating, somebody else who can can get to the bottom of the computer crash and whatever happened to lois lerner's enile outside agencies and outside organizations. but we do expect a lot of tough stuff and this is also the committee where tempers have flared between republicans and democrats. so that will be something to watch for as lawmakers try to get to the bottom of this email situation more than two years of emails for the woman at the center of this investigation go missing and a lot of lawmakers are saying that doesn't feel like coincidence but they will ask mr. koskinen for a
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lot of answers, greta. >> there is a lot of bad blood, add least appears to be between elijah cummings and darryl issa. i expect there will be fireworks on that tonight as we dip. in let me ask you this. on june 13th. that's when the irs notified capitol hill that the emails were missing. in february, if my memory serves me correct, the commissioner testified that it would take two years to get those emails. when did he learn? is that going to be a question? when did he learn that they were actually missing? before february or after february? >> he said he learned after february, if my memory serves. i believe he said he learned in march, maybe april and then told the treasury department, also told the white house in april and so that was one of the points that made the house ways and means committee furious on friday. okay, you told the white house in april, why didn't you tell the committees investigating this back in april you waited two months. and dumped it late on a friday afternoon, greta. >> and when was this hearing
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today arranged? because this is unusual. this is a late night hearing and, of course, we are expecting that it's going to be a rather rough and tumble hearing tonight. when was this first scheduled? >> there has been a little jockeying for position. scheduled to before the house ways and means committee tomorrow morning. the house committee subpoenaed him and said we want to see you on monday night. the ways and means committee moved to friday morning. so they're still here monday night and they're hoping to do part two of a hearing tomorrow morning. that's in question at this point. >> all right. mike. we are standing by for this hearing. and we are going to be dipping into it when it gets started and the fireworks which we anticipate if they're anything like the other hearings we have watched. thank you, pike. >> thank you for having me. >> i know viewers, i know what you are thinking i am too. is it really possible for emails to vanish without a trace? if somebody deliberately got rid of them. would there be any evidence of tampering left behind? david kennedy joins us. nice to see you, david. >> good to see you again,
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how are are you doing? >> good. >> two ways to get rid of emails. one is to erase them and 00 other is for your hard drive to crash. tell me what the difference. >> so, when you actually go in and erase a hard drive. there are certain applications like few other ones where it it erases sectors in your hard drive completely erases it for good. no way to recover it. no forensics expert can recover it it versus a hard drive crash which would be something mechanical. the hard drive spindle going wrong. crashes where you would have to rebuild the hard drive. in those cases can you recover the data and get all of the information out of it. if you are intentionally able to erase it you would not be able to recover the data. >> obviously can i take a hammer to my hard drive and crash it is there any other way for me to deliberately crash my hard drive. >> if you take a hammer to the hard drive you can actually rebuilt that hard drive and probably fix it again, depending on how bad you smash it when the actual hard drive smashes, recovering the data is actually really easy. this is why it is so
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alarming right now with the lois lerner emails and the six other individuals. if you have a hard drive crash to send it to a repair shop to recoup the hardware failures that happen on the hard drive itself would be relatively easy to do. otherwise if you had software that destroyed the evidence or destroyed everything on the hard drive you would have something that would erase sector bisek tore of the hard drive itself it would make it uncoferl at that point. >> i had external hard drive and dumped a lot of pictures on it. all of a sudden they couldn't recover the pictures. i sent it to the manufacturers they spent three months. instead they sent me replacement hard drive minus the pictures. they said it crashed and unrecoverable is that different. >> not necessarily. in that case they may not have been able to recover it. companies specialize in recovery of data. most organizations that have hard drive failures can send them to these places clean rooms and reassemble the hard drive and fix all the issues out there. most cases can you recover a very similar case, yes.
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>> let me ask, i think i may have asked this so i understand. cause portions of your hard drive to become unresponsive. so when you go to power your computer on it would actually have issues that would be uncorvel to the it people to do. it would be possible. applications out there that would do that for you. >> do you leave fingerprints when you do that in the sense that you can tell someone deliberately crashed a hard drive or is that indistinguishable from a faulty hard drive? >> it depends on the sophistication of the person doing it. in most cases you can actually identify if somebody was deliberately trying to tamper with the hard drive to crash it or remove evidence. for example, if i were to use one of these cleaner applications you would intentionally a forensic examiner like myself could actually go back and look at the type of information that's on there and see that it was actually erased intentionally. same thing if you had a hard
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drive crash. see the last time it was booted up and see if it was intentionally crashed or not. >> what's your question you would like to ask tonight if you were at this hearing? >> well, i mean i think chairman darrell issa had a list of 15 different questions that he was asking. i think those questions are actually spot on. they really get to the core of a lot of issues that are happening out there. but one really alarming question i think right now that we're not asking is how many other people were affected by the email crashes. the people that were subpoenaed, out of the six they tried going after, all six of them had all the information taken out and weren't able to recover the emails. how many other people experienced this and if you start sampling, you know, the organization of the irs and it showed that it was only, you know, this select group of people. we have something really concerning on our hands right now that we really need to look into that would be potentially disastrous. >> even though a failed hard drive or a crashed hard drive, personal meaning personal to your computer, why would somebody else's computer, you know, down it the line in the next office have the same problem? >> well, i mean, that's the thing that's alarming about, this greta.
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if you look at it was lois lerner and six other individuals that were impacted by this as well. so if you have those people that are impacted as well, that's a really alarming statistic, in most cases that doesn't happen, especially in a 90,000 person organization. there is something we really need to get to the bottom of right now and we're not getting the answers that i think we need to actually investigate it. >> on a 1 to 10 scale and the 10 being the most suspicious. six people including lois lerner had a crashed hard drive what's your level that's bizarre. >> probably about will and a half to 9 at this point in time. things can happen. computer crashes can happen and if the it organization was in complete disarray and they didn't know how to recover data. about 8 and a half or 9 on on the suspicious radar for sure. >> could my computer hard drive crash and cause bret baier in the next office his computer hardware, his computer hard drive to crash? >> no, not at all. they are completely independent systems. in fact, what is so alarming about this in most cases is that they have another, you know, what's called an
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exchange server that is supposed to be backed up and data is on there so if your computer crashes, you still have your emails and everything you would have normally h the fact that they lost the exchange servers, the back up tapes and actual hard drives themselves and six other people impacted guy is 9 ong for sure. >> how do you lose all the emails on the exchange server. if my computer breaks or crashes. how does the exchange server lose all those emails? >> that's the thing, it doesn't. what has to happen is that they weren't actually backing up things appropriately. that's the first thing that you test in an environment, especially information technology, you make sure that the backup is working and make sure you can recover the data. if it's not working, you make steps to make sure it doesn't happen again. in today's technology and even in 2009 to 2011, this is a proven practice, this is a proven technology. this is something that everybody knows to do in every single it organization. it's really alarming it happened here if that's the case it doesn't impact each other. a computer crash has no impact whatsoever on the
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servers themselves. >> david, thank you. >> thanks, greta, good to see you. >> this is a fox news alert. oversight committee chair darrell issa issued a subpoena to a lawyer in the white house council's office. the subpoena calling for lawyer jennifer owe conner to testify at tomorrow's irs hearing. right now our political panel joins us. the "wall street journal" jason, "the washington examiner" susan ferrechio and national journal's ron foreign yea. jason, big news that the white house doesn't like this and they don't want their white house council to show up tomorrow. she used to work at the irs. >> the problem that the white house has is no one believes their narrative. computer experts that say it's highly unlikely. common accepts the coincidence that these emails from these individuals would go missing at this very time just doesn't make a lot of sense they are not from the fire breathing ring of the g.o.p. camp asking for special
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prosecutor. paul ryan losing his cool. this doesn't make sense from so many angles. >> you have to be clairvoyant though as i understand it this crash occurred prior to the investigation. or am i wrong on that? because, 'it that's right, you would have to be clairvoyant that trouble is coming. >> that's when they say it occurred. don't forget we just started asking for the emails after things became suspicious to republicans in the house and in the senate. so, who knows when they actually disappeared or what happened. that's why i think a special prosecutor here is, you know, there is a reason why republicans are asking for this. because there are so many unanswered questions. they are not getting those answers from either the white house. i doubt we're going to see this trophy testify. >> for prosecutor to move this further along. >> you are not going to get that ron with president obama calling it a phony scandal. secretary of state hillary clinton said it was a real scandal to us the other night. president obama said it's a phony scandal and attorney
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general eric holder who would appoint the special prosecutor isn't exactly going to do it? >> they are going to have to change their tune if they want to main taint public's trust. a year ago tomorrow i called for a special prosecutor. not because i was convinced there was wrongdoing but because when you are talking about the irs. potentially. doing this kind of thing, you have got to take it seriously i didn't trust the trust the white house to do an investigation without coverage up. needs to be done by independent prosecutor to ho can tell us once and for all there was an abuse of power through the irs. >> he obviously expecting sparks tonight because congressman ranking member elijah cummings and chairman darrell issa aren't exactly chummy at these hearings and now chairman issa sent is the subpoena over to the white house. >> i'm curious what you think about that being a lawyer. what are the chances that an attorney can testify without breaching confidentiality. >> depends what she is being called for. called in the role as a lawyer.
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i don't think she would be forced to testify. i know she was in legal counsel's office with the irs. i don't know what their -- i hope we are going to learn more tonight. >> that was my, not being a lawyer, that was my thinking which is why i'm kind of surprised that they would start with going to an attorney. why not go with somebody else. >> panel, stay with us. we are continuing to monitor this irs hearing. we will take it to you live as it gets started. straight ahead, two republican lawmakers are just back from inside a mexican prison. they talked to our marine who has been languishing in prison since march 31st. what does the congressman see inside the prison walls? they are both here to tell you next. plus, the growing threat from isis. new warning. it's grim. the insurgency is spreading beyond iraq and even to the united states. you heard right. the united states. the latest is coming up. time to take care of business with century link's global broadband network and cloud infrastructure. we constantly evolve to meet your needs every day of the week.
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here. >> a u.s. marine jailed in mexico for almost three months for making a wrong turn and having guns. he could lawfully possess in the united states. now, over the weekend, two republican lawmakers going to the mexican prison to visit sergeant andrew tahmooressi. how is the marine doing and what did the members of congress -- representative matt sammon and royce joins us. chairman royce of the house foreign relations committee this is your first visit to the prison. what do you think. >> first of all, i think he was in very good spirits. i shared with him i met with robert buchanan who served with him, another marine from my area who said he was one of the bravest and most dedicated marines he had served with. i think there is a tremendous amount of focus in this country now. i had talked to the vice president last week about this case. i shared with him what i had communicated both to the ambassador and to the foreign secretary in mexico. we are trying to get this
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case fast tracked and i think at this point now that he has a new attorney, it will come up soon. and i think he has got good legal grounds for all of us that have traveled that road and know that you're funneled in to the border there and you cannot easily turn around. >> what did vice president biden say he? knew about it. did he say the president knew about it. >> no, he did not. unfortunately the president did not bring this up in his conversation with the president of mexico. however, we continue to push on the government of mexico. >> did the vice president know about it. >> yes, he knew about the case. >> concerned about it? >> he was concerned. myself and, of course, my colleague, we brought this case up. and pushed him hard to get involved. >> congressman salmon, this is your second trip down to that froifn see him. difference between -- first how much time between the two trips? >> two weeks. >> any difference? >> i think he is in a little bit better spirits right now. his attorney, that he has right now, is probably the
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best attorney that he could possibly have for this. i think that things will be exat the dated. back on what you were talking about president obama, over the last month, president obama has gone to great pains to talk about the fact that as the president of the united states, under his requirements as commander and chief, he will will leave no soldier behind. he has also gone to great pains to say that his responsibility is to look out for every american abroad. i'm challenging him and i'm asking him to do the right thing, have you done that for another soldier, this soldier nobody has any questions about his commitment to this country. he is an american hero. and he needs to be out. and i'm asking the president to call the president of mexico and on humanitarian terms. this is a young man, an "hardball" man with post-traumatic stress disorder and he needs to be out. >> you know congressman, chairman royce says he wants it fast tracked. that's what i have been saying all along fast tracked. i understand the diplomatic pressures we can't step all
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over some other country and tell them what to do. i understand that what i don't understand is anyone looking at thinksca. we have driven now we have all driven it the whole idea is to get it fast tracked and i don't think that's beyond, you know, i think the president of the united states can call mexico and say just look at the case. >> right. >> look at it, fast track it. >> as you can see, greta. from the chairman of the house foreign affairs committee, to many other members across the aisle as well, we have all tried to make the case as forcefully as we possibly can and as compassionately as we possibly can the president, if he would actually take the time and invest some of his sweat equity to get this done, i believe it would put over the hump. >> mr. chairman, did vice president say that there pick up the phone and fast track this? >> no. he did indicate to matt sammon and myself that he understood our concern and they were aware of the case. now, matt and i had been
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working to try to get him moved from will he mesa prison to takota. as you know it was particularly. >> horrible. andrew communicated to him that this was a much better spot for him to be in in the takati facility. at the same time, i think what's incumbent here upon the administration is to recognize that they too can be involved in communicating to the government of mexico the importance of this as matt has complained. we have an administration that traded five, you know, people who had been tangentially al qaeda and transferred them to qatar which frankly does not have a good track record in terms of cracking dn on terrorism. we did that with respect to a service member for are this marine wounded in combat as robert buchanan
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shared with me. as his combat in arms told me was one of the bravest marines he had served with i think this should pick up the phone. >> if we had a mexican marine in our prison that was a miscarriage of justice and they called up and said would you please thank you for going down there and so much. >> thank you, greta. >> developing now disturbing new sign that the isis insurgency could be spreading beyond iraq. that as secretary of state john kerry iraq. latest from baghdad is next. kid: hey dad, who was that man? dad: he's our broker. he helps look after all our money. kid: do you pay him? dad: of course. kid: how much? dad: i don't know exactly. kid: what if you're not happy? does he have to pay you back? dad: nope. kid: why not? dad: it doesn't work that way. kid: why not? vo: are you asking enough questions about the way your wealth is managed? wealth management at charles schwab.
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this is a fox news alert. isis militants gaining increased control in iraq. seizing key towns and border crossings and today u.s. secretary of state john kerry making a quick trick to baghdad middle east correspondent matt bradley in baghdad. >> thank you for joining us,
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can you give me your description of the situation in baghdad now and, for instance, in the last 24 hours? >> situation in baghdad is relatively peaceful. it's very calm. there is a lot of tense moments and tight security. but, really in the greater -- the areas outside of baghdad, to the north and to the west, we have seen isis taking over huge tracks of land, all along the tigris river up to mosul and along the euphrates river and syrian borders. basically the entire province of ambar which is right next to baghdad is 90% taken over by islamist militants. >> is the thinking then that isis is still on the move, this they haven't gone as far as they intend to but they are on the move. >> that's the thinking that isis is not really proceeding into baghdad right now, which is a very secure capital city, a very large city. they are actually -- they seem to be firming up their territories further west the. right now they are taking up border posts along the
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jordanian border and along the syrian border and they are really consolidating their territory and strengthening it adding depth to the areas where they already have people. in syria and other places where they can move personnel and move equipment to strengthen their positions north and west of baghdad and closer to some the she a pilgrimage cities that they might be planning to attack in the next week or two. >> what's the impact of secretary of state john kerry's visit there? >> well, secretary of state kerry basically got what he wanted which was to get prime minister maliki to agree to it an accelerated time line forming a new go. that's important, because a lot of swirling political forces right now in iraq are trying to basically oust prime minister maliki who has been in power for the last 8 years. no prime minister maliki just came from an electoral victory and his collision just one a plurality in a vote on april 30th, it's looking like a lot of politicians who are in power right now would like to see maliki replaced with a candidate who is able to
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attract more of a consensus from across iraq's very, very difficult, very fractured political scene. >> is the thinking that maliki is definitely on the way out or can he hold on to his power? >> that's not clear, maliki has the strength of voters. as i said he had a plurality in the last election, the political -- the politicians here in baghdad, they want him out, even those among his shiite majority want to see maliki replaced with someone who can attract -- can attract support from the kurds, from the sunnis, someone who can really bring the country together because, right now, iraq is facing a crisis that's probably worse in terms of security than anything this country has ever seen since the united states invaded more than 11 years ago. >> do you feel any influence of iran in baghdad? i know that there was -- that maliki had a visit last week from someone from iran. but do you feel any of the influence from iran? >> that's right. the head of iranian intelligence was here in
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baghdad speaking with officials. trying to shore up the security situation, trying to get the iraqis to really improve the security, to bring the military back in shape. but, here in baghdad, there is no obvious presence of iranian troops or iranian personnel from. my understanding, that's a different story further south. in some of these shiite majority cities, of qatar or -- there is supposedly quite a large presence of some iranian troops, some of the revolutionary guard soldiers who have taken it upon themselves to guard the shiite shines shrines that are precious to the shiite majority here and iran. they are really taking it upon themselves to make sure that nothing happens to these shrines because, if something does, if they are attacked or if they are destroyed, we can really see a spiraling sectarian civil war along the lines of what happened in 2006 and 2007. that nearly ruptured this whole country and tore it apart and killed hundreds of thousands of people. if that happens again,
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without the presence of u.s. troops, this country will really never be the same again. >> what happens if prime minister maliki wins again, if he is still the prime minister? >> well, it's not quite clear that having maliki in power will necessarily make all that much of a difference, but here's the thing. prime minister maliki has been in power for 8 years. over the last, say, four years, the security situation in iraq has deteriorated substantially. he has leaned upon his shiite majority and engaged in a lot of sectarian rhetoric that's alienated the sunni minority, and caused huge divisions between the sunnis and the shiites. he has alsos alienated the kurds to the north and caused huge problems intractable problems that are really going to take years in order to correct. so, if maliki stays in power, people are worried that this lack of consensus, that these people problems and difficulties are just going to persist. now, is there a politician in iraq who can really fix these problems? it's not quite clear.
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>> and developing now, the threat from isis now getting the attention of the fbi. >> the isis, a horrific terrorist group that is even worse than al qaeda has basically taken charge. >> is the isis an immediate threat to u.s. homeland security? >> well, i believe it can be. >> one of the reasons why isis has been emboldened is because we have been arming their allies. >> there will be plots to kill americans. >> so is the united states at risk and at risk now? fox news chief intelligence catherine herridge joins us. >> thank you, greta. u.s. r. officials tell fox news that as many as 100 fighters have gone to injury i can't to fight on behalf of jihadist groups and the return l. return to the united states. speaking to reporters today, the fbi director james comey says that there is no higher priority for the bureau than to track u.s. citizens who have gone to syria then returned to this country.
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all of this coming at a time where alleged homegrown plot has been broken up in texas. two men here alleged by federal authorities that they were part of a recruitment ring to try and take american followers to syria to fight on behalf of jihadist groups. one specifically is alleged was part of this pipeline to syria itself. this is all coming as we are seeing this resurgence and this new push by islamist militants in syria and also iraq and the ran corporation has released a new study showing the number of al qaeda anil united -- affiliated groups has jumped from 31 groups in 2010 to about 49 in 2013. so this is a significant shift. u.s. intelligence officials say that they are expecting a surge of fighters from syria to return to the united states once the civil war settles down and things play out in iraq. but the bottom line is that we're already hearing from the british prime minister that he believes that there
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are plots being launched by sis sis to attack his country and what happens overseas often then comes to the united states, greta. >> we have 30 seconds. is isis a cousin, an off chute or what in relation to al qaeda? >> what i would describe it as part of the same movement same set of ideological principle 's. they want to establish this calafate or islamic state with strict adherence to islamic laws. can you kind of slice and dies dice it and but they are all same goal. >> former secretary of state hillary clinton does it again. first she says that she and her husband left the white house dead broke. now you have to hear what she said that's ahead. plus we are keeping eye on oversight hearing that's happening right now. lawmakers getting ready to grill the irs chief on lois lerner's disappearing emails. we will take you back live
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former secretary of state hillary clinton making a bad situation worse? in an interview published yesterday secretary clinton separating herself and her husband from other wealthy people saying we pay ordinary income tax like a lot of other people who are truly well off. that coming on the heals -- heels of this. >> came out of the white house not only dead-broke but in debt. >> the clintons won't give it up. hillary just won't give up this idea that her family is poor and average and middle class. this is the greatest thing. >> the rich thing does not work for her. >> the clintons are filthy rich. >> this is tone deafness on the steroids. >> they are hell bent on you and me thinking that they don't have any money. >> we came out of the white house not only dead broke but in debt. >> our panel is back. the "wall street journal's" jason. the "wall street journal" susan ferrechio and ron foreign yea. your thoughts?
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>> she is rusty. she hasn't run for office since 2008 and it shows. these are unforced errors. if you are a democrat, you are a little worried because hillary is all you have got right now. the bench is not deep. and so i think this doesn't concern people. >> one of the most effectsive against romney politically whether you buy it or not was if he was rich. now you have got the situation if hillary clinton is their candidate. she can't make that argument because she seems to have a continue ear about wealth. >> take as weapon away from her. i actually don't think money is the problem here. this wasn't really about whether she is wealthy or not. if she she runs a a wealthy democrat. i don't think democrat or independent voters care. i think they would still vote for her if they liked her. the problem is likability and being genuine. it's the same problem that i observed back in 2008 when she was running for president. she had difficulty connecting with the voters and being genuine and sounding like she could really, you know, just talk from the heart and talk truthfully. and here you have her saying that she didn't have any money when we know, in fact,
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that they did. it's kind of repeating itself again. i think it's a symptom of a larger problem with her as a candidate. >> ron? >> mitt romney's problem wasn't that he was wealthy. it was that he was defensive and not comfortable in his own skin. he didn't connect with people. hillary has the same problem. it's not the money. it's that she is defensive about the money. all she has to say is yeah, i made a lot of money. isn't this a great country? i want to make sure all of you have a chance to make a lot of money. or she can do what her husband has been doing since he left office. i realized start left office we got to do something about the tax code. >> the mock of the democratic party is being rich is a crime and the republican party is afraid admit that some of them have money. >> i think it's a double standard. i think if she runs and she is wealthy, wealth is not going to be an issue anymore. because it's a democratic candidate. i think it became an issue when it was a wealthy republican. it became easy wedge issue. >> i think romney could have very easily handled the issue. if he had said, yeah, i have made a lot of money and i'm going to help the rest of the country make a lot of money.
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>> i heard him say that repeatedly. he would accidently reference the multiple cadillacs in the garage and the democrats were all over that. >> one reason this matters is because hillary clinton is supposed to be the bridge to getting these working class whites in pennsylvania. people she did well with when she ran last time. comments like this do not help her with those voters. >> that's probably true. >> yeah. but it's not her being wealthy that's hurting her with those voters. it's not being genuine about her wealth and not comfortable in her skin that she is authentic. she shouldn't be excusing herself or being wealthy. >> determination to make everybody else. >> we really didn't make -- it's disingenuous. i think that's the biggest problem. voters hate that. >> yes. that's the problem. >> panel, stand by. right now congressional investigators getting yesterday to drilt irs chief. how did emails vanish into thin air. the latest from that live hearing on the hill is next. [ male announcer ] identity theft ...
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this is a fox news alert. right now irs commissioner john koskinen giving his statement to the house oversight committee. lawmakers getting ready to grill the irs chief over missing lois lerner emails. let's listen in. >> search terms developed investigating committees and identified the possibility of an issue because the date distribution of the email was uneven. there t. it was not clear whether lerner emails were overlooked, missing, or had other technical issues involved. irs information technology professionals identified documents that indicated ms. lerner had experienced a computer failure in 2011. in mid march, 2014, the irs focused on redacting materials for the nontax
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writers and processing the rest of mrs. lerner's emails for production. as we reviewed additional emails, the irs review team learned additional facts regarding ms. lerner's computer crash in mid 2011, which occurred long before these congressional investigations opened or when the review began. during this review, we learned that as noted in 2011, the irs information technology division had tried using multiple processes at ms. lerner's request. to recover the information stored on her computer's hard drive. a series of emails available after all of ms. lerner's email was loaded this spring recounts the sequence of events in 2011. front line mcmanager and it reported on july 20th, 2011, and i quote, i checked with the technician and he still has your drive. he wanted to exhaust all avenues to recover the data before sending it to the hard drive cemetery. unfortunately, after receiving assistance from several highly skilled technicians, including hp experts, he still cannot
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recover the data, unquote. ms. lerner was told by email on august 1st, 20011, as a last resort, we set your hard drive to ci, the irs criminal investigation division forensic lack lab to attempt data recovery, unquote. in an email already read on august 5st, 20011, ms. lerner was advised, quote: unfortunately the news is not good. the sectors on the hard drive were bad which made your data unrecoverable. i am very sorry. everybody involved tried their best unquote. the irs took multiple steps over the last months to assess the situation, insure that no emails had been overlooked or lost during this investigation. is producing as much email as they have for which ms. lerner was an author or recipient. as the search for production of lerner emails was concluding, i asked those to determine whether computer systems of the other 82 custodians had experienced any similar difficulties. after the irs public report
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was delivered on june 13 to congress and the treasury, inspector general for tax administration, it was determined last week that several additional custodians may have experienced hard drive failures during the search period. it's not unusual for computers anywhere to fail. especially at the irs in light of the aged equipment irs employees often have to use, in light of the continual cuts in the budget these past four years. since january 1 of this year, for example, over 2,000 irs employees have suffered hard drive crashes. it's important to remember that a hard drive failure does not automatically mean that all or even any emails have been lost or cannot be reconstituted. we are still assessing what effect, if anything, computer failures had on the emails of any of the custodians, although some custodians apparently lost no emails at all. the question is, what emails outside the agency, prior to april 11, 2011, are not in the 24,000 lois lerner
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emails sent to other irs employees during that period? last week, i understand the white house and the department of treasury stated they were providing all of their lois lerner emails which should help fill those gaps and answer that question. the treasury inspector general for tax administration has already begun an investigation of this matter and his report will provide an independent review of the situation concerning ms. lerner's computer crash three years ago. we are committed to working cooperatively and transparently with this committee and the six other investigations going on and we will continue to provide you with updates. this concludes my testimony. i would be happy to take your questions. >> thank you. >> commissioner, do you remember the name ralio sillio. >> did you ever hear the name gregory roseman? >> no. >> well kasillio is now on trial for murdering his
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wife. before that this committee discovered that he had wrongfully received $500 million in contracts, it contracts from the irs. and gregory roseman took the fifth. he was one of your employees who gave -- who helped get him that contract. when you go home tomorrow or the next day you might want to see congressman woman duckworth asking how his ankle that he hurt at the prep school feels because, in fact, he claimed to be a disabled veteran, some 27 years later and his old college buddy a lifelong friend helped him get that contract. at that time and now, we rely on the ability to recover emails as part of the chain of discovery. tigda russell george. your ig relies on that. tomorrow we will hear from the head of the national archives, the are a can archivist. he relies on your organization to comply with
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federal law. the question i have for you is how can we expect you have servers that run microsoft exchange. it captures every email in and out. how can we sit here and expect to trust an organization in which the c drive, the local hard drive of lois lerner is supposed to be the only place that email existed? >> that is not the only place that email existed. there is email on her email system in the server that has been found and produced. any email that existed anywhere, even any hard copy of official records that existed anywhere has been or will be provided to this committee. >> right. so, in 2011. >> coming up, we are going to continue following this breaking news. lawmakers now grilling the irs commissioner. there is more next. a link taking you to the live hearing is going up on gretawire.com right now.
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breaking right now, theist commissioner testifying on the hill. can you watch it live all night long on gretawire.com. for now our panel is back. ron. >> pick your poison, america. you either have a government that is inexcusablably incompetent can't even find its own emails or corrupt. >> great joyce choice. >> i look for look for subpoenaing other emails from lois lerner there was someone on the other end of that email and those emails are still out there somewhere. >> started with the fesc. >> ron the administration comes across as looking incompetent. on top of the v.a. scages. on top of the obamacare rollout. it's no wonder why the president's polls are are going down. >> the president called it a phony scandal. >> not a smidgen of corruption that he knew. >> the public doesn't think it's a phony scandal. that's his biggest problem. >> does anybody like the irs. anyone saying boo who for the irs? >> i don't think so. >> you don't know anyone? no one is saying boo who for the irs. >> pretty rich when they ask us to save our records for seven years. >> hard drive graveyard. >> i don't have my records because i have aged equipment. anyway, panel, as always, thank you very much.
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and thank you for being with us. watch the hearing live all night on gretawire.com. stay on fox news, good night from washington. tonight on "red eye." >> coming up on "red eye," has belgium finally realized their dream of of duplicating the excitement of nascar some say they are stuck behind the modern racist worlds. is the president upset the united states has yet to produce an actor like gerard de pardue? >> if france can figure it out we can figure it out. and finally the world's best looking dogs strutting their stuff. who took home the title of the world's sexiest canine? stay tuned to find out. >> now let's welcome our

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