tv MSNBC Live MSNBC November 24, 2013 11:00am-12:01pm PST
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hours after 150sealing the deal with iran. but it's only temporary. what's next? we're live in london and at the white house. it will make our partners in the region safer. it will make our ally israel safer. >> it's not the a historic agreement. it's a historic mistake. it will not make the world a safer place. >> it's creating deep decisions. we'll cut through the rhetoric. also ahead, the longest war. today afghan leaders say they want american troops to stay but president karzai is not so sure. richard engel is on the ground to tell us why. and big brother/big business. the new trend in health care that has employers paying attention to more than the bottom line. they're also watching your waistline. does it go too far?
and giving directly. no organizations, no charity groups. what if we gave directly to the poor. there is a group doing it. and it's today's big idea. lots to get to, but we start with that ground breaking deal hammered out in geneva last night. iran will get initial relief from some sanctions. essentially billions of dollars in oil money that had been frozen in exchange, iran agrees to halt what is called high grade uranium enrichment. iran will not stop all uranium enrichment. and it cannot install centrifuges, those devices used to enrich uranium. again, this is all a temporary deal designed to provide a six month window to reach more comprehensive agreement. let's go live to london where john kerry arrived earlier today. first of all, what has been the reaction to this deal from
around the world? >> we're seeing mixed reactions coming in from different countries, most allies. the country that participated in the deal, western powers including other world powers, are announcement. but countries close to the u.s. have had mixed reactions. officially the united arab emirates has welcomed this will, but senior gulf diplomats have expressed skepticism. saudi arabia, as well. according to some reports suggest that they are not too particularly fond of the agreement and remain very doubtful that iran is going to be aed by by it. but perhaps the sharpest criticism is coming from israel. they say today that this makes the world a more dangerous place and certainly not holding back any of their punches, even expressing israel has the right to defend itself and perhaps going alone in some type of military option accordinged according to some senior israeli
officials. >> second kerry headed to london soon after the deal. what is he doing there? >> he's meeting with uk officials here, certainly they held a short statement, short press conference a while ago in which they reiterated their commitment to that agreement saying it was a group effort. and really taking credit for all of the work that has been done through the p 5 plus 1 negotiations. u.s. secretary of estate also will be meeting with the libyan prime minister here in london, that will be also very important meeting to follow in the next couple hours. a lot of problems in libya that matter to u.s. national security interests, as well. so certainly very busy diplomatic afternoon for the u.s. secretary of state and other foreign ministers here. >> all right. we will come back to you you a little later in the broadcast. is this the deal we've been waiting for? nbc news chief foreign affairs
correspondent andrea mitchell now. >> the white house hopes this initial agreement could be the first step toward a land mark accord that would change the global landscape not only on the nuclear front, but eventually throughout the region. by returning iran to the first time since the 1979 revolution to the community of nations. but that is still a very big if temperature already there are disagreements over what was agreed to. iran's president and russia's foreign minister both said today that the accord ratifies iran's right to especially rich uranium. the white house says it did not. the truth is that the final deal left that ambiguous deliberately. while this at first appeared to come together very quickly, only two months after that first phone call between president obama and iran's president, in fact the white house now confirms that top u.s. officials have been talking secretly to iran for at least a year in the persian gulf country of oman without the other members being present. while most of the world is embracing the breakthrough, israel and saudi arabia argue
iran cannot be trusted to hide critical part of its nuclear program from u.n. especially spect inspectors. they say it was the crippling sanctions that got iran to the bargaining table and this is the worst time to ease sanctions. democrats and republicans are threatening to add more sanctions which the president would be forced to veto. back to you. >> israel's reaction to the enter rum deal as you you just heard was quick and clear. this is more of what netanyahu had to say. >> twhawhat was concluded in xw kn geneva is not a historic agreement, it's a historic mistake. it's not made the world a safer place. like the agreement with north korea in 2005, this agreement
has made the world a much more dangerous place. >> chief spokesman for israeli prime minister netanyahu, first of all, why sdoes your boss thik this agreement is so bad? >> because it gives the iranians legitimacy for the very first time to continue enriching uhe rain yul. they were enriching up until now. but it was against the u.n. security council resolutions, it was considered illegitimate. they now have legitimacy to continue to enrich. this agreement gives a precedent which is very dangerous. >> the ability to especially ri enrich as i understand it at least is low grade uranium and it is not supposed to be the uranium that is high grade enou
nuclear weapon can be created. >> that's what people say, but it's important to remember that the iranians have greatly can expanded the capability and quality of their procedures. they have happy more centrifuges, 100 times more than what they had about ten years ago. and they hahave also upgraeded their quality. it's extremely dangerous. what you've done now is you have legitimized iran as a nuclear threshold country and they can cross that threshold and have a nuclear bomb at a time of their choosing in the future. that's not a good situation. >> how practical would it be for israel to act unilaterally against iran's nuclear facilities now? >> we don't want to go there. we u.s. would prefer a diplomatic solution that peacefully gs hundred tadismant program. that's what we would desire.
ultimately if this becomes into a military conflict, israel is on the front line and it's us that will be facing casualties. having said that, i'm not sure that today's agreement really brings about a peaceful dismantling of iran's nuclear program. one of the problems is that iran is now having the pressure lifted as your reporter said, they're getting billions in sanctions relief. and i would ask why will the iranians further down the road make those heavy difficult decisions of actually gs mantling their secentrifuges an reactors if they already got sanctions relief today. my prime minister said it, this deal has not served the purpose of bringing about the dismantling of iran's nuclear military program. >> what kind of deal would israel support, what kind of deal would israel like to see in place instead? >> we'd like to see a deal
whereby we actually see the centrifuges iran have dws mantled, we'd like to see a deal where the material is removed from iran. we'd like to seat dismantling of the heavy water reactor that can produce plutonium. we'd like to see those things happen and only then when the iranians actually do comply with what are ultimately not israeli demands, these are conditions placed by the u.n. security council, only then would we like to see sanctions relief. at the moment, you don't have that. you're relieving the sanctions for cosmetic changes on the iran yap side and we're concerned that you'll never get the iranians without pressure to actually do the heavy lifting that's required. >> you say that the sanctions are being relieved. are they being relieved or are they just being eased again for six months to verify? >> well, there is a give between us and the administration.
it's true they're only given a couple billion dollars in sanctions relief. but our assessment is and we position we're right that it's like having a small hole in your tire. a small hole in the sanctions ultimately in the end like your tire, you'll get a complete flat. there are countries out there in the international community that at the present ti didn't want sanctions in the first place and they're just waiting for -- to have trade with iran, to buy iranian oil. the minute there are cracks in the sanctions regime, we are very concerned that that sanction regime will start to implode and implode very quickly and it will be very difficult if not impossible to bring the sanctions back to where they were. >> mark, always good. always appreciate your insight. thank you. topping the headlines this sunday, afghanistan's grand council has endorsed a security deal that would allow u.s. troops to operate in that
country beyond next year. but afghanistan's president says he will not sign that deal at least not up he gets more conditions met by the united states. we'll have a report from afghanistan a little later in the hour. also back here a you prepare for thanksgiving travel, be on the lookout for slick roads. extreme weather is creating dangerous icy roads across much of this country.extreme weather dangerous icy roads across much of this country. and first visit from old man winter, winter storm could mean a drirks wy, windy and cold thanksgiving. we'll get a look at the forecast coming up. that new delay to the security deal between the united states and afghanistan, president karzai is tdefying afghan leaders. what is behind his move? and look who is watch something big brother in the workplace. keeping an eye on your scale. is it all going too far? the american dream is of a better future,
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the deal to halt iran's nuclear program was more than a year in the works with the man in the middle, secretary of state john kerry. a columnist for reuters has covered the mideast extensively and traveled quite a bit with kerry this year to write his latest piece for the atlantic. john kerry will not be denied, a look at the secretary's tenure so far. always good to see you. let's start with the deal in general. what do you make of this deal reached in geneva? >> i think basically it's good deal. it's analogous to when kerry got
the israelis and palestinians to sit down to negotiations. this sets the table for the final breakthrough, but this is not a breakthrough. it's a good step forward. i think there will be more negotiation. it does improve the atmosphere, but does that solve the tensions that exist with iran. >> when the secretary announced the agreement, he was careful to mention concerns for u.s. allies that might not be too keen on the idea. this is what he said. >> this step, first step, leads to what is our ultimate goal which is a comprehensive agreement that will make the world safer. it will make our partners in the region safer. it will make our ally israel safer. >> but israelis were vocal in
their opposition. netanyahu tweeting this is not historic agreement, it's a historic mistake, lifting the pressure. this first step might be the last step #bad deal. you just heard from mark, as well. i'm sure the dissent was anticipated. how can the obama administration deal with israel's objections to this deal specifically? >> they have to sort of show off their infections -- they're supposed to be literally dwael inspections where for the first time in years we'll see what's happening inside the nuclear facilities. but i think kerry is exaggerating the positive here and netanyahu is exaggerating the negative. this is not a ground breaking deal. it's a step forward. and with kerry and this is something i wrote about in the story, he is very eager to do these deals. and there is a bad side to that. maybe this is a bad deal and he's too eager. he's also willing to take risks.
kerry has given up his greem d f becoming president so he's willing to take risks. >> you wrote kerry told me in october if you can make peace, can get the iranian threat of a nuclear weapon put to bed appropriately, you've got a hugely changed dynamic in a region that is in turmoil. what would a new dynamic between this country and between iran, what would that new dynamic mean for the mideast in general? >> well, iran, if it could woo open up to the world and become part of the global community, could be a tremendous economic power itself. it's 80 million people, huge reserves. and bringing iran into the fold, reducing the tensions between shia iran and sunni countries
would help calm things down. those tensions are what is fueling the war in syria. so kerry is right. you but again, he doesn't have a landmark israeli palestinian deal or a landmark deal with iran. good steps forward. he's trying. but not there yet. >> you look at what he did with russia with regards to syria. you've traveled with him expensively. he's only ten months into his term. based on what you learned about him, how does this deal fit -- how does iran fit into his macro vision for his missions as secretary of state? >> i think most importantly it boosts his credibility in the obama white house. it makes obama grateful kerry will go out and do the endless negotiations and take these political risks. this was a good news story for the administration. and i think most of the white house and in general the very skeptical of kerry's visions of ways to stabilize the middle
east diplomacy. >> why so? >> they think it's a loser. hillary clinton was much more cautious as secretary of state. she did not want to risk her reputation as being enter lock could you ter. kerry is putting himself smack dab in the middle of the most difficult disputes we have. so again, i think this helps kerry. i think it will give him more credibility, but he's not there yet. >> david, a fascinating piece. friend of the show. always good to see you. thank you for your insight. >> thank you. a week after a tornado ripped through washington, illinois, the washington panthers high school football team's quest for a state championship is bringing that community together. at least eight of the players on the team lost their homes. their opponents even raised more than $50,000 for the team. the panthers didn't win the game, but the game did allow folks to take their mind off tragedy. >> what changes today is we're
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of the leading ordinary brand. use less with bounty select-a-size. president obama hails a historic deal to curb rarp's nuclear program, but at what political costs. live at the white house next. also inside the negotiation as. what does it take to strike a landmark agreement? i'll talk to the u.s. dwip low ma dip low mad who led the talks. you're watching msnbc. hi honey, did you get the toaster cozy?
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u.s. politicians. many of whom oppose the terms. lindsay graham tweeting unless if requires dismantle willing centrifuges, we haven't gained anything. and amazing what the white house will do to distract attention from bham care. luke russert is on the north lawn of the white house. how much of the reaction from the hill was anticipated by the white house? >> reporter: a lot of it. republicans have characterized president obama as being weak on issues that pertain to israeli national security specifically iran. that was a center point of the mitt romney 2012 presidential campaign. so it's not unexpected that they launched some attacks against this plan. but they vary in scope and scale. you saw john corinne saying it
was a distraction. take a listen to mike rogers known for being a more moderate republican. >> we have just rewarded very bad and dangerous behavior. bipartisan opposition in congress, very strong bipartisan opposition to the deal, our arab league partners don't like the deal. israel doesn't like the deal. and we may have just encouraged more violence in the future than we have stopped. >> reporter: you heard there him saying there is bipartisan opposition to the deal and that's certainly accurate. this morning a real big ally of president obama chuck schumer, senator from new york, said he was disappointed with the deal because he believed that iran should not be allowed to continue to be able to enrich uranium in light of sanctions being drawn back. he would hope that sanctions would be upped more before something like that could occur. and it will be interesting to see moving forward whether or not there will be new sanctions before there is a deal that kerry struck.
harry reid had to hold off bipartisan group of senators from wanting to put more severe sanctions through the united states senate. on the house side, speaker john boehner is very skeptical, he wants a full briefing by the administration. eric cantor the only jewish republican in the conference arrest ardent supporter, says it is a bad deal because it allows iran to continue moving forward with enriching their uranium in light of less severe sanctions. so taking some heat obviously the president is. a lot of democrats, also, in support of this saying if shows a smarter foreign policy. and they draw within the context of a historic agreement. this is the first time in over 30 years you've had this level of communications between iran and the united states. >> luke russert from 1600 pennsylvania for us on a sunday afternoon. thank you, sir. >> just a tad chilly. >> you you lost your scarf. thanks, luke. back in the mid-90s, north
korea made a deal with the united states that would involve freezing and dismantling parts of its nuclear program. however over the course of the following decade, it become obvious that the north core roon and he nuclear program was alive and well. after news of the deal broke, chairman of the house armed services committee released this statement saying, quote, the president sees wisdom in placing trust however limited in a regime that has repeatedly violated international norms and put america's security at risk. apparently america has not learned either lesson from 1994 when authority korea fooled the world. i'm skeptical that this agreement will he saepnd differ. chris hill was tasked with negotiating with north core re, a currently the dean of the university of denver. thanks for being with me.
take a listen. >> unless we understand that the people who send the protesters out to chant death to america last month in the streets, unless we understand, you know that they are capable of cheating and have in place the ability to really ratchet up, we're going to find ourselves exactly where we found ourselves with north korea. >> ambassador, you were there. what is the difference between the deal with iran and the deal with north korea? >> well, first of all, i very much support what the administration has done this iran, but i want to emphasize that what it does is buy some time and it needs to be judged in the fullness of time that is what happens at the six month period. but let me just say that the north korean deal was structured very differently. in essence they were the most sanctioned country in the world, continue to be the most sanctioned country in the world.
and what we agreed to do with them in 2005 was, first of all, get them on the record that they must dismantle all of their nuclear programs and secondly, we asked them to do some things in return for which we did some things. and when they stopped doing those things, we stopped doing our thing. so we did it on a step by step basis. very different agreement. i must say iran is far more complex in the sense that there are internal dynamics in iran that we certainly haven't detected in north korea that is between those forces in iran that would lying to be part of a world versus those forces that have no interest. in north korea, they didn't want to join the world. so the deal is structured differently, but i still believe that is the way forward and i think it offers more hope than continuing sanctions. and about could i maif i could
point. those who argue that there should be more sanctions, these are people who would never themselves accept sanctions as a means to make them change their mind or do something different. so why do they think the iranians will be more amenable to giving in to sanctions than they themselves would be. >> some major u.s. allies as i'm sure you're aware have been quite kept skskeptical of the d. according to the "new york times," quote, the saudis have been equally blistering hinting that if the united states cannot roll back the iranian program, it may be time for saudi arabia to move to plan b. nuclear weapons of its own. how concerned should we be that this deal could actually encourage other countries like saudi arabia to develop their own nuclear programs? we need to be very concerned about this. this deal, this kind of interim
deed with iran comes a midst sort of unprecedented political break dunn in washington. but also unprecedented area wide or region wide issue within the middle east pitting sunnis against shia. being seen by the saudis and other sunni countries as the root of this kind of shia resurgence within the region including within iraq. so this is a very broad issue, really tough to make sure everybody is happy. i think clearly secretary kerry has really worked very hard to make the israelis understand, but he has his work cut out for him in israel and of course once he gets back to that what will surely be a very warm greeting for him in washington. >> i want to follow up on
something you said what could be the additional motivations behind the deal. how much of this is about bringing a country, a large country, 85 million people, how much of this is about bringing them back into the global marketplace? >> i think that is a very big part of the story. and while we all were very interested in sort of cliffhanger negotiations that went into the we che hours of t morning, i think we saw some sle excellent reporting done about the long standing secret negotiations with iran that have been taking place between personnel in the state department and the w40us and hi and iranians. so clearly we're trying to say we're prepared to have a more normal relationship with you, we're prepared to move forward, but in so doing, we need to have everything on the table including the fact that iran quite apart from the nuclear
issue is very much the world's leading sponsored terrorist groups especially in the middle east. so i can assure you you that was on the table in what must have been very interesting bilateral discussions that have taken place for months and months. >> chris hill, thank you so much, sir. appreciate it. an assembly of afghan he will dwers approved a security deal that would allow u.s. forces to operate in that country beyond 2014. but president karzai is saying essentially not so fast. he's insisting on signing an agreement potentially leaving the deal up in the area. richard enfwel hgel has the lat. >> reporter: this has implications for the future stability of afghanistan. today about 2500 met for a
traditional inju tradition traditional jirga and they decided to vote for the deal. it sets for the framework for thousands of american troops to remain in this country for potentially years to come staying on bases just like this one, including this one in fact, training afghan security forces and pumping billions of dollars directly into the government budget. it funds the army and providing training and satellite technology and drone imagery, things the afghan forces they say to continue fighting the taliban and al qaeda. the tribal elders said they want this deal. the united states has said that it would accept this deal even though it would mean billions of
dollars keeping troops in the country for years to come. then president karzai at the end of the meeting, the of a began president, said, no, he doesn't want to sign it, not yet. first he wants the united states to bring peace to afghanistan. reaction was what do you think the u.s. has been trying to do here for the last 12 years with deployment after deployment, with 140,000 u.s. and nato troops at its peak, that number at about 48,000 now. more than 2,000 american troops who have died in this country. the reaction was what do you think all of them came here if not to try and bring peace. karzai said that in addition to bringing peace before he signs, he also wants the united states to stop combat operations and to stop controversial so-called night raids. people were wondering what he is aiming for.
this seems to be a negotiating tactic, that's what several analysts and politicians have told us. the question is what is he negotiating for. does he want more money, is he looking for more thought, is he trying to gosh yacht more favorable terms to the deal. several analysts have told us it's about political power. karzai is supposed to step down in april when the next elections are held. and he is hoping that one of his associates, an ally, will come to power and apparently he's looking for some sort of assurances that his allies will come to power, therefore will be able to protect him and make him relevant or make him remain relevant after he's supposed to step down in april. but these are big questions here that dra right at the heart of what the united states did here, will the the future of this country be a success, and will america's war in afghanistan have been considered a success. >> our chief foreign
correspondent richard engel on the ground for us there in afghanistan. time now flashback to this day in 1963 when lee harvey oswald, the man who shot and killed president john f. kennedy, was himself fatally shot in the garage of the dallas police station. the gunman was later identified as dallas night club owner jack ruby who claimed he shot oswald because he was angry about the assassination. on the same day in washington, d.c., thousands lined up outside the u.s. capitol to view the casket that has been placed in the rotunda.
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poverty globally. michael fay runs it and is former research analyst for the momentum project. good to see you. many have thought the best way to help people in need, period, was to use a middle man essentially. you say not so much. why give directly? >> i've been in this sector for abo about 15 years. studied what intervention is best and i've learned one thing, that the poor know a lot more about what they need than i did. i would never give my savings to a western african farmer, why should they give theirs to me. >> how does your website work? >> so we've built what is a technology management platform. you go organization you toe nature. the money goes dreblgtsirectly extreme poor. they get it in their phone and spend it on what they want. >> in their cell phone. >> cell phone. i can sit on my living room
floor and send the money. >> how do you find these folks? >> we have lots of folks in kenya and uganda, finding the village, individuals who are poorest, and using remote sensing technology to make sure they are who they are. >> how much money have we give so far? >> 25,000 people have gotten $5 million, $6 million. >> and what have you found that these people are spending that money on? >> we found something very consistent. it's a big impact. it's sustained. and it depends on the person. income has gone up 40%. hunger has dropped by about 40%, as well, and mental stress has improved. >> there is a recent study, as well, in this country that came out that sort of supports this notion. >> that's right. this was a third party evaluation of our program and we found all of these effects to be there. income, hunger, health, education. >> this is one of the signs that hangs throughout new york city subways if you travel the
subway, i'm sure you've seen this sign. give the homeless the kind of change they can really use and it's a sign encouraging people not to give directly essentially. knowing that eat mindset of this country, how can we apply your model in america? >> it's a great question. the truth is whatever you think the causes of poverty in the u.s. are, your poor in africa means you were born in western kenya and we have the evidence that this works. i don't know the solution for the u.s.. but i do know it for africa. >> and what is the next step for give directly? >> so there is a $100 billion market of cash happening now. a lot of it is leaking. 75% it is appearinpae disappear. >> what do you mean disappearing? >> imagine putting cash bells in an envelope an sending it on-to-a poor person. it doesn't get there. we're fixing that problem.an sea poor person. it doesn't get there. we're fixing that problem. >> and what is the web site?
>> give directly.org. >> michael fay, thank you. folks, do you have a big idea that is making a difference? you can tell us about it by e-mailing us, big idea.msnbc at nbc uni.com. [ male announcer ] you hear that? that's the sound of car insurance companies these days. here a cheap, there a cheap. everywhere a cheap... you get it. so what if instead of just a cheap choice, you could make a smart choice? like esurance for example. they were born online and built to save people money from the beginning. that's what they've always done. not just something they...cheep about. that's insurance for the modern world. esurance. now backed by allstate. click or call. now backed by allstate. my dna...s me. every piece is important... this part... makes my eyes blue... i might have an increased risk of heart disease... gallstones... hemochromatosis... i'll look into that. the more you know about your dna,
how much does your employer though about your lifestyle in what they do know could cost you money and some privacy, as well. conscious health addresses the obesi obesity epidemic and mark is an attorney. let me start with you. companies are taking an active role in setting health standards for employees. there was a recent report by a business consultant that found that the three most significant health challenges among the workforce are stress, obesity, lack of physical activity. no surprises there.
what are employers right now doing to address those challenges? >> one of the most controversial things employers are beginning to do as to-to-increase the incentives or rewards for individuals who change their lifestyle, stop smoking, lose weight, exercise more. >> why is that controversial? >> the two main problems are privacy and justice. when we saw penn state several months ago adopt a program that unless you filled out this very detailed health questionnaire they were going to charge you $100 extra per month, it was mostly objected to because of the very intense personal questions that were being asked that employees felt like this is no business of notice employer's, this is between me and my there.
the other issue is that these programs that assess fines for workers who don't comply with them, most heavily hits the poorest workers. so if you're charged 30% increase on your premiums which the new health care law will permit after the first of the year, that is a substantial amount for low paid workers. and they have no option but to agree to participate in these programs regardless of whether they're actually going work and regardless of the privacy violations. >> ted, your group found 16% of the companies that you surveyed requi required participation to qualify for full health care coverage. while many set weight related goals, they do not provide coverage for obesity treatment.
how fair is that? >> it's a fundamental issue of fairness because for folks who are really struggling with obesity, to expect them to change their weight status without having access to intensive treatment is just setting a goal that is out of reach for those people. and we found that something like 60%, 59% for be exact, of the employers that were setting these goals didn't provide coverage under their health plan for dietitians, for obesity physician or surgery or drugs. >> mark, how are companies justifying this kind of deep involvement in workers' personal health and habits? >> many companies believe it's a win/win situation. increase the health of you're workforce and also save money on our health insurance costs.
but i think that is really simplistic thinking. for one thing, the studies on whether there is adequate return on investment are very equivocal. and the second they think is there are sort of nonfinancial costs to this. the fairness costs that i mentioned, human resource cost. and i think we need to put an emphasis on more structural problems for these behavioral things. we need to concentrate on the environment, on a more comprehensive approach on these instead of putting the pressure on employers to solve the societal problems. >> it's a fascinating topic. we'll have on get you back. thank you so much for your time. a first step is reacheded to freeze iran's nuclear program, but now unique alliances are forming. we'll get the latest from london and also from the nbc reporter who has been in that region for
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sales go down, i'm not happy. merch comes back, i'm not happy. use ups. they make returns easy. unhappy customer becomes happy customer. then, repeat customer. easy returns, i'm happy. repeat customers, i'm happy. sales go up, i'm happy. i ordered another pair. i'm happy. (both) i'm happy. i'm happy. happy. happy. happy. happy. happy happy. i love logistics. we're not sitting here pretending that iran will suddenly turnover a new leaf. israel and the united states absolutely share the same goal here. none of this is based on trust. there is no agree that they can enrich. we won't just verify or trust and verify, we'll verify and verify and verify. >> defending the deal. good afternoon. you're watching msnbc. right now secretary of state john kerry is in london hours after reaching that potentially historic deal with iran. but it's