tv Andrea Mitchell Reports MSNBC January 5, 2017 9:00am-10:01am PST
proposed national security adviser, someone who traffics in these fake news stories and retweets them and shares them, who betrays a sense of either gullibility or malice that would kind of be -- these are stories that most fourth graders would find incredible. that a national security adviser would fine them believable enough to share them causes me great concern. second, go back to joe doesn'tford. he talked about russia as a potentialed a ver seas satisfactory because they have capacity and intent. with respect to our cyber i think we have capacity, but i think what we've shown is we haven't yet developed an intent about how, when, why, whether we are going to use the capacity we have. so if we're going to shore up our cyber defense -- one word, do you think what we need to show shore up is our capacity or do we need to shore up our
intent? >> well that's -- as we look at foreign adversaries, that is always the issue is capabilities and intent. and certainly in the case of the ri russians they do pose an existential threat to the united states. and i agree with chairman doneford on that. it's not place in the intelligence community the do an assess men of our intent. that's someone else's place, not mine. >> senator sheen? >> thank you mr. chairman and senator reed for holding this hearing. thank you all very much for testifying this morning and for your service to the country. dr. robert kagan testified before this committee last december with respect to russia. and at that time there was less information known to the public about what had happened in their
interference in the elections. but one of the things he pointed out was that russia is -- >> right now on a special edition of andrea mitell reports as we continue liv coverage of the armed services hearings on capitol hill, intel wars spy chiefs brief the president-elect at trump tower today the top intelligence officials are pushing back against trump's doubts about who was behind that hack. the top democrat in today's hearings revealing russia wanted the u.s. to know what putin was doing. >> russia's involvement in these intrusions do not appear to be in any doubt. putin may have wanted us to know what he had done seeking only a level of plausible deniability to support an official rejection of culpability. >> spy games as donald trump's team knocks down reports of a wholesale plan for a system-wide revamp of the nation's top spy agencies.
new questions about a personal beef for some of the incoming team's attacks against the spy masters. >> do you think some of this is personal between mike flynn and clapper who fired him. >> i have no idea. i don't mind reforming the cia. i don't want to duck the cia. as to the intelligence briefing this coming friday. keep an open mind. ask hard questions. you can be skeptical. i'm 1,000% convinced. i never met anybody who doubted russia did this. >> good day i'm andrea mitchell on capitol hill where the senate arm services committee are talking about russian cyber hacking and hacking possible from china and iran. they are concluding that russia was behind the cyber war during the presidential election. democrats have come to the defense of the intelligence
community after the criticism of donald trump. >> who is the ben factor of someone who is about to become commands dmer chief trashing the intelligence community? >> i think there is a line between healthy skepticism, which policy makers to include policy maker number one should always have for intelligence, but i think there is a difference between skepticism and disparagement. >> joining me now, msnbc political correspondent casey hunter, and nbc white house correspondent kristen welker. casey, this is fought with big implications going forward. donald trump is going to get the same briefing pretty much that president obama got this morning on the russian hacking. he has been disparaging it, criticizing it all along. trying to back a little bit from that today. and you were able to catch up
with the speaker of the house, paul ryan. >> a distinction andrea from what you heard in that hearing and were just talking about where republican senators led by john mccain building a case to argue that the intelligence community is right on this. but the question here for president-elect trump has always been what does this say about his victory? does it dent it in any way? does it call it into question? he has been very sensitive about that. i think speaker ryan, it seems has picked up an those concerns. i asked him what he thought earlier today. do you have full faith in the united states intelligence community? >> well they don't always get everything right. we've seen that clearly, but i do have faith that our men and women in our intelligence are doing an incredible job. >> do you have any doubts about their assessment in the intents of russia meddling in the united states -- >> russia clearly tried to meddle in our political system. no two ways about it. he won the election fair and
square, clearly and convincingly. okay. now, having said that, do we ever condone any foreign actor, any outside interference from trying to mess with our elections? >> of course not. >> so the question now of course, how does president-elect trump react on friday after that briefing? i think from talking to source up here on capitol hill, there is a very real chance that if he comes out and again says he doubts those assessments that republicans could come out pretty strongly against him and it could impact how they handle his cabinet nominees. >> in fact, general clappe who is leaving after 53 years. he served every president as he described it today since john f. kennedy and described himself as apolitical. he enlisted in the marines in 1961, flew combat missions over vietnam. but he is basically defending the intelligence agency saying they are not political and their conclusion on october 7th, they did not say that russia had
influenced the election or had managed or had succeeded. they just said there was this attempt. >> reporter: right, this attempt. and we have learned they are going to include a motivation in their new report set to come out -- or be made public next week. i do think that this is really the sticking point that you point to. and even the republicans who have been very hawkish on russia, they are not calling into question the outcome of the election in any way. that's not what senators mccain and graham are out there doing but it's what donald trump has been the most sensitive to. and he has said and it seems as if this has find of fallen by the wayside but he was out there saying he had additional informion that he was going to reveal at a lighter date. he wouldn't say where that information was coming from. but again furtheralli into question the spell jens fortunat assess mmtsz. >> there is a lot that's personal behind all of this. general clapper did fire mike
flynn the kin coming national security adviser. he first promoted him to be the head of intelligence and then fired him. that is one of the issues that many people believe is coloring the hostility that has gone on for weeks now from donald trump against these intelligence agency chiefs. >> that's right, andrea, and a lot of people think that that is the backdrop to that "wall street journal" record saying that donald trump is planning to revamp the dai and the cia. and today you have the trump team pushing back very firmly against this report. they are in a little bit of damage control saying that's not true. i can tell you based on my reporting there are conversations going on behind the scenes about taking a hard look at how these agencies are interacting, is there a way to streamline them, is there a way to make them more effective?
at the same time as a part of that damage control, you have officials within trump tower to make the case that more broadly donald trump supports intelligence agencies. that flies in the ways against this war of words that would have he seen donald trump waging himself. sbrl interestingly today the president-elect came out with a tweet essentially defending himself on the issue of julian assange. that's inflamed these tensions between donald trump and the intelligence community. president-elect tweeting the dishonest media like saying i am in agreement with julian assange. wrong. i simply state what he states. it is for the people to make up their own minds as to the truth. the media lies to make it look like i am intense intelligence when in fact i am a big fan. bott line, this is really an unprecedented rift we are seeing between an incoming commander in
chief and the nation's intelligence agencies with now just 15 days to go before the inauguration. >> as you can see, as matters reed and mccain, mccain the chairman and reed the top democrat have recessed this hearing -- they are going to have closed sessions later today, also intelligence briefings for some of the members behind closed doors on some of what could not be disclosed publicly. john mccain raised that question about the tweet yesterday from donald trump about julian assange which was a real waving the red cape in front of the bull in terms of any expesuppor of the spy agency. take a look at this. >> i believe that he is one who is responsible for publishing names of individuals that work for us that put their lives in direct danger. is that correct? >> yes, he has. >> and do you think that there
is any credibility we should attach to this individual, given his record of -- >> not in my view. >> not in your view. >> that about julian assange, the founder of wikileaks. john mccain at the stake out camera right outside the hearing. >> down play the role of russia in the elections when -- does it concern you that he continues to down play the role of russia in the elections we will? we'll see how he accepts the report from the intelligence community tomorrow. >> you were making the claim that julian assange is not a credible source. why did you decide to do that? >> as i said in the beginning, assange's name has been raised as some kind of a credible
source o information. and the fact is that he's one of the worst individuals because he put the life was men and women who are serving this nation in jeopardy because by revealing their identifies of who they were. this is really a person who has put the lives of americans in danger. he cannot be trusted for anything. >> should the american people be skeptical of the intelligence community as donald trump seems to be promoting a healthy skepticism. >> people and congress should always have a healthy skepticism. that's why we have hearings. but we start out with the assumption that the information they are giving us is correct. >> is there a risk with promoting that kind of skepticism? >> no. this is why we have hearings, to air out and ventilate the information that we need. that's what the role of congress
is. >> senator mccain -- >> strategy would be like to see the new administration to pick up in the cyber domain? >> i would like them first of all to direct -- to come up with what we haven't had, that's a policy. right now there is no policy. there is no strategy. there is no response to the attacks. >> a moment where you seemed to suggest that the hacking of the election didn't affect the outcome of the election itself. the director pushed back and suggested weon't know that. where do you stand? >> well, i was saying we don't know, so we can't assume anything. for someone to assume that it affected the outcome of the election is not correct. >> senator -- >> hang on, will you, please. >> does that raise the prospect that donald trump's election was legitimate, sir? >> no. because it would have to be proven that it did affect the
outcome of the election. they have not proven that. >> senator mccain, have you determined why the president-elect doesn't share the same ccerns about russia as many republicans like yourself on capitol hill? >> no. i don't know. i haven't talked to him. how should i know? >> does it worry you though in any way? >> you know, i do my job and hopeful hopefully that all the correct information will coming out. i do my job and we have hearings. >> his team has suggested this entire situation has become politic sized? >> i think that's manifestation of the bipartisan push to this issue which has characterized the work of the armed services committee. >> do you think it's important to keep the role of the director of national intelligence. >> keep the role?
>> the plekt has signalled that he -- >> no. they are not going to take out the director of national intelligence. they are talking about changing the composition of it and sufficient, but they are not talking about doing awa with the position. >> you said you don't think the outcome of the election was affected. >> i said i don't know, but i would not bheev that the outcome of the election was affected unless there is proof that there is. i will not assume that. and no one else should either. >> do you think that donald trump was helped by russia's hacking? >> i have no idea. but i have seen no information that he was helped. >> senator, do you believe that hillary clinton's campaign was hurt by what happened with russia's meddling in the election? >> as i said, itch no evidence -- i'll say it for the fifth time. >> i apologize. >> i have no evidence that the outcome of the election was affected by the hacking. but the fact that they were able to do what they did is a threat to national security. because they intended for it to
have an affect. and that's the situation and we have no policy and we have no strategy to respond to it. that should disturb all americans. >> do you believe what happened was an act of war? >> i think in the broadest context it is an act of war. but you respond differently to different acts of war. espionage is an act of war, but you don't go to war over it. you don't go into conflict. so it fits the definition of an act of war, but it doesn't mean that all of a sudden you start shooting. >> senator mccain, turkey has sent ground forces to syria to fight against -- who the united states-led coalition doesn't support. what do you think about it? -- >> until we've found out the true intent of russia on turkey
when they were spending time slaughtering opposition. isis retook palmyra. that -- >> senator cane just repeated what he said during the hearing that the russian hacking was in his view an act of view. this morning director clapper expanded on what he said previously saying there was more than just hacking that their use of their own tv twork rt, their use of social media, their use of fake news also was part of the propaganda effort to influence and election and to impact the u.s. also clapper talked about the effect on voters, which is something he said the intelligence community cannot assess. >> if they succeeded in changing the results of an election, which none of us believe they were, that would have to constitute an attack on the
united states of america because of the effects if they had succeeded. would you agree with that? >> first, we cannot say -- they did not change any vote tallies or anything of that sort. >> i'm just talking about -- yes. >> we have no way of gauging the impact that certainly intelligence community can't impact the gauge the impact it had on choices the electorate made. there is no way for us to gauge that. whether or not that constitutes an act of war, i think, is a very heavy policy call that i don't believe the intelligence community should make. >> connecticut democratic senator richard bloomenthal is a member of the committee attended the hearings and joins me now here. senator thank you very much. >> thank you andrea. >> what did you hear today? was it all reassuring about the spy agencies knowing how to deal, how to counter-act these kind of cyber attacks,
especially from russia? >> well, that really was the central question, can we trust and believe our intelligence community? what came across to me from mr. clapper, who is a dedicated, 53-year veteran of the intelligence gathering operations under both republican and democrats presidents is his belief, firmly, that there is overwhelming proof that the russians were behind this hacking. and one of the more powerful parts of this hearing was the expression of trust in the intelligence community from members of the committee. and as i said in the hearing, the fact that the president-elect is really doing a disservice to the united states by demeaning and disparaging. because it reduces the trust in that intelligence community and the ability of the united states to respond effectively, to take action that punishes and deters
this kind of hacking. >> donald trump was tweeting today it was the media's fault and the media somehow misinterpreted what he wrote yesterday on twitter about julian assange. that said, it was clear -- mccaskell brought it up at today's hearing. i want to play that. >> the notion that the soon-elected leader of this country would put julian assange on a pedestal compared to the men and women of the intelligence community and the military that is so dooply embedded in the intelligence community -- i think it should bring about a human cry no matter whether you are a republican or a democrat. there should be howls. and mark my word, if the roles were reversed there would be howls from the republican side of the aisle. thank you mr. chairman. >> thank you for that non-partisan comment. [ laughter ] >> but we know senator mccain's
wry comment there. but there was real concern even among many republicans including senator mccain that julian assange was somehow being praised on twitter by the president-elect. >> the president-elect can't take back what he said about julian assange or his disparagement of the intelligence community. et cetera going to be relying on that community to build support amonthe american peopl so he can take action, hopefully he will, even stronger action than prest obama s taken. there was lot of support, myself included, senator mccain, for stronger sanctions as lindsey graham said, throwing rocks, not pebbles. and i think that the president-elect better reconsider his use of these tweets because they may give a misimpression. but it's not the media that is misinterpreting. >> at the same time there was a general admission by the spy chiefs that they don't know how
to counter-act this kind of spy attack and concern among democrats and republicans that our defenses are not up. >> our defenses are inadequate. that's why we need to coordinate better with the private sector where our electronic and electricity grid, our financial systems, our transportation network all are at risk. and there needs to be better information sharing which right now is barred by some apprehension about the legal effects. but even more important, how do we respond to a cyber attack that is an act of war? and i strongly agree with senator mccain as i said repeatedly that these acts of war need to be deterred not just in the cyber domain bye-bye use of sanctions against oil exports by russia, use of foreign exchange by russia, as each done with iran. those sanctions brought iran to the negotiating table on the nuclear issue. and i think sending that kind of message, deterrents, punishing,
heightening our defenses are what is needed here. >> senator bloomenthal thank you for joining us today. coming up, the top member of the intelligence committee joining us after this hearing. stay with us andrea mitchal reporting life from capitol hill only on msnbc. at planters, we're all about great taste. and we thoroughly test all our nuts for superior craveability. hey richard, check out this fresh roasted flavor. looks delicious, huh? -yeah. -richard, try to control yourself. -i can't help it. -and how about that aroma? -love that aroma! umph! -craveability, approved! -oh, can i have some now?! -sure! help yourself. -wait, what? -irresistibly planters.
there is still much we do not know. but rs's involvement in these intrusions does not appear to be in any doubt. russia's best cyber operators are judged to be as elusive and hard to identify as any in the world. in this case, however, detection and attribution were not so difficult. the implication being that putin
may have wanted us to know what he had done seeking only a level of applausability deniable to support a official rejection of culpability. >> senator jack reed at today's hearing suggesting that vladimir putin may have wanted the u.s. to know that russia was behind the hacking. joining me now is california congressman adam shift the top democrat on the house intelligence committee. there is going to be a briefing for the gang of eight, including you the top intelligence and the armed services members. that said, why would putin want us to know, you know, hey there, i'm in your face. i'm there and you cap do anything about it. >> it's possible that putin was trying to send that message. it's also possible that they were just clumsy and didn't use all the tools and tactics they may have to try to better hide their hand. we'll get a fuller statement of the intelligence community's assessment on that this week, which i look forward to. but i think they certainly could
have tried a lot harder to hide themselves if this was their goal. >> the president-elect is today taking back or trying to take back what he said in black and white on twitter about julian assange yesterday and saying that the media misinterpreted him. your view about all of this, and the way he has expressed himself about julian assange? >> first of all, it was astounding and apauling that you would have the president-elect siding with this accused sex offendser holding up in an embassy somewhere over our own intelligence agencies. but the supposed walkback to me rings so much like the whole propagation of the birther stuff that trump put out earlier. the way he did that was by saying this is not me, i'm just telling you what other people are saying. i'm just letting know what some people think. he is now taking the same approach with the julian assange thing. the dismonies media is saying i meant one thing. i'm just saying this is what some people are saying.
but that's his way of propagating this misinformation or outright fabrications in the case of birtherism and trying to maintain some deniability. >> what concerns do you have for the spy agencies going forward where theyave been so much criticized by president-elect? it'sextraordinary. it has never happened before. >> i worry about what it does for moralend recruiting. i worry about what it does for men and women who are thinking about putting their lives on the line to get information to the policy makers and thehief client, the president of the united states, are they willing to do it if he is going to disregard what he is being informed. but you know, i also worry about what steps he may take to retaliate against the agencies. these potential reforms of the director of national intelligence office or the cia. >> there has been past criticism that they areloated and their bureaucracy exceeds their mission. >> you know, there is certainly room for improvement with all of our agencies and there has been
a continuing discussion as there should be about whether we are appropriately staffing and organizing the office of national intelligence. that's one thing. but if you are going to make rash cuts without analysis, if you are going to propose restructuring the cia before you even know how it's operating, that strikes me as something that's being done in response to the fact in a the intelligence community is sticking to their guns about the russian hacking. and if that's where they are coming from, if that's their motivation, then the intelligence committee mass more to be worried about than a few random tweets. >> how much of this could be personal? mike flynn was forward by the retired general clapper who is the outgoing head of the national intelligence office. >> it is a good question, and a lot of people in the ic are asking right now. >> ic meaning intelligence community. >> exactly. how much of this is personal. we've seen from the
president-elect let alone those he surrounds himself with a high degree of personal pique and sometimes a petty reaction where hes willing to lash out and retaliate. he is willing to use all the power he has as a president-elect. imagine how that power can be abused as president. >> thank you for joining us. coming up, trump versus the intelligence community continued. jeremy bash chief staff or leon pannetta at the cia. you are watching andrea mitchell reports. only on msnbc. listerine® kills 99%
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edition of andrea mitchell report here on capitol hill. after that cyber security hearing all on russian hacking and the larger question of if failure of u.s. defenses against cyber attacks coming up at the armed services committee today. joining me now, jeremy bash former chief of staff for leon panetta. and defense secretary. leon panetta said cyber security was going to be one of his major focuses. all these years later we are told by the spy chiefs and by their critics on the hill that we still do not have american defenses adequate to counter-act china when they go after our more than 20 million job
applicant and people who have gone through security here in the united states skpa tax from north korea. >> secretary panetta actually started warning the public about this in a very public way in 2012 when iran launched those denial of service attacks against american banks in a response to our international sanctions on iran's nuclear program. and so we saw iranian attacks against wall street. we saw that attack by north korea against sony. we saw china attack the office of personaling management. we have seen russian now try to hack into our election processes. >> russia also taking the state department, and the white house. state computers were taken down for a month in 2015 skmoo and trying to infiltrate pentagon networks. this is something our government has been grappling with. i think we need to learn more from the private seconder. after all most business, most
companies,l are also the target. they are on the front lines of cyber attacks and hacks, people trying to steal their data, steal their intellectual property. we have got to do a better job working with silicon valley working with tecology companies here in this area tryingo fure out how to make these defenses stronger for our government. >> jeremy i was struck today when dni clapper said that one of the imped mepts to striking back is that you engage in a cyber attack against russia for instance. you have to go through in through another country. and that's a violation of international law. are those kinds of legal prohibitions observed here in the u.s. and not in russia? are we fighting with one hand or two hands tied behind our back for very good legal reasons perhaps? >> in some respects yes i think it's accurate tosy say the russians don't respect international rules of law, international rules of warfare. they have attacked us, will continue the do so. our lawyers wrangle and have
long meetings about it. i think we have to do a reassessment of what our capabilities are, what our legal authorities are because we are going to have to take the fight to our adversaries in the cyber domain. that's clear. we have to elevate cyber command, the element out at fort meade by the nsa that actually is responsible for our cyber military operations. we will have to elevate them to full military command. we will have to get the intel junes community, the military department to really upgrade. it affects not just the pentagon, it affects homeland security, the irs, and the health care community because they have personal data. this is something where we have to up our game. >> it was said we threw pebbles in the actions last week. we need to start throwing stones. are we throw stones and would you agree they were pebbles? >> i wouldn't agree. the action that the
administration took thursday was significant. we declared persona none grata 35 russian officials and their families. kicks them out of here. we closed two intelligence facilities. we sanctioned kgb officials. we took a number of other steps including releasing the specific internet codes that the russians used to hack our election processes, gave those out to the private sector so they could build their own defense of systems. i think we did a lot. we will have to do more. we will have to deter this if we can figure out a way to do that. we will not just focus on russia. and this is key for president-elect when he raises his hand and becomes two fridays -- >> not far from here. >> 200 yards from here, he is going to become the number one cyber target in the world from russia, china, iran, north korea, and terrorists, and it's going to be his responsibility to rely on the intelligence professionals that he has been denigrating and dissing and
actually bring them into the fight, empower them, build their morale, give them capability and make them part of his team because they, after all, are his troops in this fight. and really help them help him defend our country. >> how damaging to morale are his criticisms? >> it's pretty unbelievable andrea. i have been talking all week, in particular yesterday and today to uniformed military first and those intelligence professionals who operate in the shadows, some who are operating in some very dangerous and tricky situations even at this hour in some us a steer corners of the globe. and they have i think been hurt personally by the comments that have come out. they don't want praise. they don't need praise but they also want to know that their conversations with their president are going to be behind closed doors that if the president wants to challenge them he will do so in a respectful and presidential and professional way behind closed doors in the situation room, not out in social media and not in a
way that makes julian assange seem more credible than our own patriots. that's a ridiculous paradigm that we have to get right. >> much more ahead live from capitol hill. we'll be right back. will your business be ready when growth presents itself? american express open cards can help you take on a new job, or fill a big order or expand your offic and take on whatever comes next. find out how american express cards and services can help prepare you for growth at open.com.
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battle over obamacare. president obama's signature health care law is in critical condition as republicans inch closer to pulling the plug. donald trump tweeting this morning quote the democrats led by head clown chuck schumer know how bad obamacare is and what is mess they are in. instead of trying to fix it they do the political thing and blame. the fact is obamacare was a mess from the beginning. time for the republicans and democrats to get together and come up with a health care plan that really works. much less expensive and far better. good to see you. your reaction to donald trump? he has the votes, doesn't he? >> oh, sure. he has the votes to pass a resolution. i'm not clur he will have all the votes he needs, you know, to put legislation in action because i do believe that the
american people are going to weigh in on this. in south carolina alone you are talking about over 1.4 million people who are benefiting from the affordable care act. they are in another what 30 million americans who now benefit from this act? when you see little children born with diabetes being denied lifetime covere it's the kind of discrimination in the health care industry that gets reinstitutionalized if we were to repeal the law. and so i do believe that the american people are going to weigh in on this. i'll never forget the lady who sent me an e-mail the morning after we passed the bill. she said she stayed up late watching that vote hoping and praying because her little 8-year-old daughter has cancer. and she had used up all of her
benefits. she had been told by the insurance company there were no more benefits left for the rest of her family for the rest of their lives. >> the lifetime cap. >> absolutely. we got rid of that. this woman was afraid she or her husband might get sick or the child's cancer might return. this is kind of life that many people live before the affordable care act. and this is the kind of provisions that's in this law. 35,000 south carolinians have been allowed to stay on their parents' insurance policies up until their 26th birthday. >> well, president obama was here pleading -- >> yes. >> -- with you all to energize the troops, get the people out there the way the tea party rebellion sfarkd the fight against obamacare in '09. do you see any evidence that you democrats can get together after all of these defeats at the polls got you back on your heels? >> there is a lot of evidence that we can. the question is, do we have the
will to do that? democrats are a little different animals. for some reason, we do not like confrontational politics. we as the "new york times" wrote in an article or someone wrote in the "new york times," we go into fights with knives. the other side has got guns. we are going to have to come out of the box with blazing guns. there was a movie or something called "blazing saddles." we are going to have to do that if we want to see this law preserved. i believe that many american people are counting on us to fight for them. i believe that over 80% of the american people are waiting for us. they are counting on us to make sure that this law, sure, modified, but not repeal it. that's a pig in a fort. we're going to repeal it now and then at some point in the future we're going to replace it with
something. that will put to test whether or not pt barnum was correct, that a sucker is born every minute. the american voters are not suckers, and we are not going to allow our republican colleagues to play them as such. >> jim clyburn, thank you congressman. coming up, west virginia senator joe mansion joining us for a special edition of andrea mitchell reports live from capitol hill.
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president-elect mike pence made it clear that donald trump is going repeal obamacare as soon as he takes office. president obama has made a personal appeal to fire up public outrage the way the tea party did for republicans in 2009nd try to block that deal. one democratic senator refused to attend president obama's meeting. why didr didn't you go to hear what the president had to say. counter-productive. the second day of a new congress. we have an administration leaving, president obama is leaving his administration. and you have a new administration coming in with the trump administration. and then you have the vice president elect mike pence coming up. both were coming up speaking just only to the caucuses again.
democrats, obama speaking to the democrat caucus, vice president pence speaking to the republican. i thought that was wrong. i said the people spoke loud and clear, they don't like what we are doing it but yet they started out exactly the same way. i said i'm not going to do it. i know where i stan i'm not going to vote to repeal unless i see something to replace it. i want to repair the health care act. i want to work in a constructive manner to fix it. repealing it is not the way to do it. dividing up is not the way to do it either. i called vice president pence and i asd if he wanted to meet with me. we met and we had a constructive meeting. >> did you ask to vote for repeal. >> he knew i wouldn't. i asked him not to repeal. i said i think it's the wrong approach. there are those of us moderate democrats who are looking for repairing. we don't want to throw anybody off. we want to do everything that president-elect trump said. preexisting conditions we are
not going to prevent from you buying insurance. we are not going to throw your 13 off at 26. we are not basically going to put caps on, you are too sick and you can't pay anymore. but it needs to be xed. there meeds to be more product and more competition. let's set work to that constructive instead of saying we're going the repeal it and in two years we'll pick it back. i've been here six years and we haven't fixed many thing and people don't have confidence that will happen. >> are you planning to work with your democratic colleagues. >> sure. >> chuck schumer is your leader or are you closer as your constituents are to donald trump? >> i'm an american first. i'm going to do what's best interest for my state and my country. if it falls on the democrat side, so be it. if it falls on the republican side, so be it. my bran has been i'm fiscally responsible and socially
compassion add. my identity is a democrat and i'm happy with that. >> are you concerned that repeal will also take away some of the tax revenues that support health care. >> that's something no one has been talking about. that is a big, big concern. for the people who said go ahead just wait we won't take anything away, we are just going to repeal? what are you repealing? all the taxes that pay for it, that's $2.35 trillion of revenue, most at the high top enincome earners. we are going to do away with that so the budget is going to be broken, blown apart. if you are concerned about the debt of our nation it's going to skyrocket. if you are concerned about we are going to come back in march now and have to vote on the debt ceiling -- >> raising the debt ceiling around st. patrick's day. >> that's going to raise it further. >> what about this intelligence flap, this unprecedented war of words, one-sided really because it's the intelligence community being criticized by donald
trump's tweets. >> well, i can't speak for president-elect donald trump. i mean it's not my approach. let's put it that way. i wouldn't be doing that. on the other hand i'm sure that any agency looks -- can we make it more efficient? can we make it beer, streamline it. get the fbi, the state department, the cia working more collaboratively rather than separately. that needs to be done. there are a lot of changes that need to be made. that said there are an awful lot of good people that are truly professional and do a tremendous job for our country. >> do you have any doubt that russia was behind the hacking? >> i'm going to my first intel committee today. >> you have chosen a great time to join the intelligence committee. >> i'm looking forward to this meeting because it's going to get me into a different place to be able to understand in a higher at "today" or basic intricacies what's going on around the world. i have a been on armed services r six years.
i have enjoyed it immensely. this gives me ath opportunity. everything i've heard indicates there is no doubt they were involved. we can't allow whether russia china or anyone else thinking they can disrupt and change the way we do business and live our lives. >> lindsey graham said today we are throwing pebble at russia and we need to throw rocks? >> he has an eloquent way. he is a dear friend. his heart is pure. >> do you think we need to be tougher? >> absolutely. we need a plan. we need a plan that basically this is what happens to you as a country whether it's someone in our country or someone internationally if you hack into our military, if you hack into our political, if you hack into our commercial -- you are going to pay this price for this, this, this, whether it's higher rates, less money for the international bank, different
things, restrictions and sanctions, this is the price you are going to pay. let them know it. put it in writing. let's vote on it and say this is what we agree on, and it will be done. >> senator joe manchin, going to your first intelligence meeting today. >> i'm excited. >> thank you senator. before we leave, breaking news coming out of new york. one of the spokespeople for donald trump confirming that he is being deposed today by the judge in the jose andres chef dispute that was a contract between the chef who was supposed to be the chef for the new trump hotel and after what donald trump said about mexican immigrants he broke that contract. and that is a civil litigation. and there will be a deposition today of e president-elect. well that does it. a very busy day up here on capitol hill. stay tuned to msnbc for all the breaking ne. remember follow our show on line, on facebook, and on twitter at mitchell reports. craig melvin is up next. >> andrea, thank youle we'll
come back to you in just a bit. spy games. top intelligence leaders laying out russia's actions of hacking. this as president-elect considers a complete overhaul of spy agencies. will intelligence officials finally be able to convince him of russia's role when they brief him tomorrow. charges expected today against four people after a video appearing to show a gup torturing a yng man with mental health challenges after it was all streamed live on facebook. and life or death? the charleston church shooter face to face with the families of his victims in court as the jury weighs whether to give him the death penalty. let's start with the senate hearing that just wrapped up. much of it deve