tv MSNBC Live With Craig Melvin MSNBC August 30, 2018 10:00am-11:00am PDT
senator biden has been teaching and lecturing as we know and has not ruled out returning to politics despite his age. >> there are no rule s anymore andrea. >> no rules indeed. that is pastor noah garcia, north baptist church. bridget mccain will be reading from ecclesiastes. there will be a tribute by grant woods. a hymn performed by johna little. a reading from andrew mccain, one of the elder sons from his first marriage.
the hymn "going home" of course from the bagpiper which is the navy hymn. then the processional "my way." this is so perfectly in tune with arizona. all of those elements. as we see cindy mccain. and the casket coming down the aisle. as john mccain said so memorably when he was accused in his first house race of being a carpetbagger. he said, well, the only place i've spent a longer amount of time is the hanoi hilton. that silenced all of the -- >> little bit hard to come back from that.
>> you may be seated. on behalf of the mccain family, thank you all so much for being here this morning. as we remember and celebrate the life of senator john mccain. a man loved by this church. a man loved by this nation and this city. a man of courage. a man of faith. a man who dearly loved his family. as we celebrate and get into the service, i want to offer you a word of scripture from the word of god. it comes from the book of 1
the thessalonians chapter 4:13. the word of god says this. brothers and sisters, we not want you to be uninformed by those who sleep in death. so that you do not grieve like the rest of man kind who have no hope. for we believe jesus died and rose again. we believe god will bring with jesus those who have fallen asleep. what a word of promise, hope and comfort from the word of god. let's pray together. father in heaven, the creator and maker of all things. there's nothing new under the sun for you, father. we pray for the friends and family of senator mccain. we will grieve, we will mourn, father.
we will do so with a different hope because of the faith he has placed in jesus christ. that we can with confidence grieve with the hope to know this very moment he is spending eternity with jesus christ, his lord and savior. what a comfort. it's in jesus' name we pray, amen. ♪ amazing grace how sweet the sound that saved a wretch like me ♪ ♪ i once was lost
ecclesiastics 3:1-2. to everything there is a season. a time for every purpose under the heaven. a time to be born. a time to die. a time to plant. >> i was 28 years old. i'd only been a public defender as a few years out of law school. for some reason, john mccain asked me to be his chief of staff when he got elected. so my first day, at 7:00 a.m.,
john mccain picked me up at my house. i went to the car. i said, well, you want me to drive. he goes, no, no, i'm going to drive. so i said, well, maybe i can sit in the back seat. i'm no expert on this but i thought the staff -- he said no, get in the car, get in the car. for the next half hour, we just talked about the football games the day before and whatever's in the news and politics and told a few jokes. it was at the same time just really a lot of fun and also quite terrifying because of his ridiculously bad driving. as we get excited, he would kind of -- he drove like this anyway. he would get excited and just start drifting open. like, hello over there. so we finally got where we were going. i said, oh, hey, by the way, what are we doing? he goes, oh, hired the whole
staff and i want you to meet them. oh, okay, that's good. so we met the staff and then we went back to the car. we got in the car and all the staff came out. they were all waving and things. i said, well, they seem to be very nice. he goes, you're going to have to fire half of them. i said what? what are you talking about? and he just sped off and the staff was waving. and about one minute later, we went right back by because he'd gone the wrong way of course. waved again. and i just say that two hours kind of epitomized the next 35 years for me with onjohn mccain. a little bit harrowing, a little wild, a little crazy, but a lot of fun. and the greatest honor of my life. i have people ask me all the time, did you ever know in those early years, did you have a feeling you had someone so special there.
and my answer is yes, absolutely. no question about it. and i'll tell you one -- the first time, it was december. it was over in my hometown of mesa, arizona. we were at a rotary club. and i think it was all men at that time. and, you know, these are tough guys and kind of cynical about things. and here's this new guy in town. and one of them asked him, since it was december, he asked him, what about christmas in prison. and he told them a couple of stories. he told them one night when he was being interrogated for quite a long time and it didn't go too well for his captors. they were upset with him. and so they tied him up and they tied the ropes tight and it was very painful and they left him there for the night. and some guard came in who he did not know and never spoken to. and at 10:00 p.m., the guard
walked in and unloosened the ropes. and at about 4:00 a.m., the guard came back and tightened them up again so he wouldn't get in trouble. and john didn't know why that happened. but he found out a little clue a couple weeks later right before christmas when he was standing in the dirt yard and that guard just walked up next to him and the guard didn't say a word, but with his sandal, he drew a cross in the dirt. and looked at it for a minute. and then the guard rubbed it out and went on his way. and it was quiet in that room when ontojohn told that. and then he said, you know, on christmas eve, we celebrated, and we got together under this bare light bulb and we sang
christmas carols and we quoted bible verses that we could remember. and we told the gospel story to each other. and i guess just that image of this band of brothers together in this god forsaken place singing to each other and there at the front, our guy, john mccain. beaten up but not down. singing his favorite christmas carol. silent night. holy night. all is calm. all is bright. round yon virgin mother and child. holy infant so tender and mild. words seem so far away from that place. but they leaned on the faith of their fathers. and their faith in each other. and their faith in their
country. and their faith in god. i looked out into that audience there in my hometown and those were some of my peers and the peers of my parents. those are tough independent guys. they're ranchers and farmers. there's so many cowboys. businessmen. entrepreneurs. and they were crying. because they saw in john mccain a little bit of what they hoped to see in themselves. they saw in john mccain the embodiment of values that they hoped to see for their country. over the next few months and years, john got to know this place. and he fell in love with arizona. he loved the people. our diversity. our native american community. our hispanic culture.
and he loved the place. in particular, the grand canyon. the colorado river. we floated down that twice together and then he kept going back and back. he loved it. he hiked the canyon with jack not that long ago. rim to rim. he loved sedona. he loved this place. and if john mccain fell in love with arizona, arizona fell in love with john mccain. we ran a lot of races here. a lot of elections. he never lost. never really very close. arizona loved him. we had one little blip one time. when he ran for the senate the first time. he called me on the phone. he go, well, boy, i think i might have screwed up. i go, what? he said, you know, talking to these students of u of a and they said why are you the only
politician that comes down here. he said, well, it's because you guys don't vote. okay? those other dudes vote like 100%, you know, so you want people to come down here, you need to vote like they vote out at seizure world. i said, you didn't say that, did you? 'cause there's this big retirement community called l z leisure world in the east valley. they weren't real happy with their new nickname out there. so john said, like he always does, said, okay, i screwed up, let's go, we got to go out there. "we." and so we went out and i remember we drove in and there was about a 90-year-old guy in a golf cart right there and he was giving us the finger. and little did he know we both
said "that's great." we loved that. john was like, hey, good to see you, good to see you, thank you, thank you. so he went in, went to work. i think he won that about 85/15 in that election in that precinct. so we're going to miss so many things about him here in our state. his leadership here on these important issues. going to miss his sense of humor. going to miss his love of sports. he loved the teams. all of our teams. i mean, by love them, i mean love them, like nonstop, okay? and he loved you guys. fitz and gonzo and shane. he really did. not a coincidence. he didn't become friends just with the best players but with the best people. and he loved you guys. but i think we also worry here
in arizona about a bigger picture. and i hope that what he stood for will maybe get renewed look in our country. that's what he would want. he would want us to, okay, we recognize him now, but now let's get to work. and i'm sure the vice president will talk about john and bipartisanship. but he believes so much that this -- in the end, when it's all said and done this republican/democrat thing is not that important, is it? we're all americans. we got to get to the point where we can work together as americans. his support of a military. i hope you members of congress will keep that strong. it was so important that he had their backs. and one other thing. onmccain believed in our constitution. john mccain believed in our constitution. and he stood up for it every step of the way. he would not stand by as people
tried to trample the constitution or the bill of rights, including the first amendment. you know what, he believed in the declaration of independence. when we proclaimed to the world that every single human being is important, every single human being is precious, every single person in this world has the right to live free. not because the government says so but because god gave us that right. so john mccain, his entire life, stood by the freedom fighters across the world. he was there. he was there figuratively and literally by their side, wherever they were. acknowledging their right to live free. it's a long and winding road that took him from that dirt yard in hanoi to the dirt back roads of hidden valley. but through it all, he was resolu
resolute. he was courageous every step of the way. and in arizona, he was our hero. i think you can see from this outpouring of support and love for john mccain that he was america's hero. senator john mccain from arizona. he served his country with honor. he fought the good fight. he finished the race. he kept the faith. now, my friend, we can finish
this off. sleep in heavenly peace. sleep in heavenly peace. amen. >> well, i had the great opportunity of meeting congressman john mccain in washington. see how it was back there. and i was visiting. and he said "you need to meet this congressman, this young maverick, full of energy. i said, oh, yeah? he said, besides that, he's going to become president of the united states one of these days so you need to meet him. i said okay. so we met in virginia at ala --
ah, my apologies. it was rough getting up here. alexandria. cindy and c.a., myself. we had dinner, this nice little restaurant. we chatted for a while. then all of a sudden with john mccain you just bond. i mean, there's something about his energy level that goes up. he starts talking. starts asking me about my background. of course, i, not knowing him that well, asked him about his. before i knew it, we felt very comfortable with each other going back and forth. then i got enounerve to ask him. i said, congressman what was it allowed you to be in a prisoner of war camp, i mean, what kept you together. and he said, well, you know, most people ask me how they treated me. obviously, they treated me pretty bad.
goes, but he said one is my faith in god. my love for my family. and my affect in my country. and my faith in my country. he said those things kept me together. so we kept talking that evening. and as i thought about that, that discussion, and for this, this talk, i wanted to reflect with you a reading from corinthians 13, which i think captures, captures senator john mccain. it's corinthians 13. though i should give away to the poor all that i possess and even give up my body to be burned. if i am without love, it will do me no good whatever. when you think about an
individual like senator mccain. who suffered, who was imprisoned. was injured. and yet with all that was able to keep his faith together, his focus on his country, focus on his family. i believe that that period of time, those five years, is where god molded this fantastic hero. for god took an opportunity to humble this young man who came from a military family. god used those minutes, those hours, those days, those years, to put together a human being that we'll be talking about the senator for generations. john mccain was a person who
loved with his energy. who loved all of us. who loved his country. that evening, while we were having dinner, he said, when we get back to phoenix, we need to get together and have dinner. and of course back then i was pretty cocky. so i said, well, congressman, i know a number of congressman and i know a couple senators and, you know, we always hear that. he said, well, no, when you get back, you give me a date and i'll be there. i said, well, i want to invite you to my house. us mexicans-americans love to cook and we love to have folks at our homes if you're really going to be a friend. he chuckled. a couple of months later when i got back home, we called, set up a dinner at the house. and of course i was preparing tortillas and all this stuff that you all know about.
and my homemade salsa. and i get a call from his office. they say he's running late. so i asked, what's the problem? he said, well, it's his birthday, he wanted to spend a little bit of time with his family. sorry, cindy. and of course i panic and say, you know, if he wants to cancel, i understand, please. they said no, he made it very clear to us, he's going to your house tonight to have dinner. so i scrambled and got a mariachi group. i figured, i got to do something really good. mexican food's not going to get me there. and luckily they got there about 10 minutes before he arrived. so when cindy and the congressman then walk into my house, the kitchen, the mariachi started playing. they're singing the traditional
mexican birthday song for -- in our culture. and of course john and cindy lit up and there was a great evening and we enjoyed the night. that's senator john mccain. keeps his word. that's the senator that we've had all these years that sometimes we'd beat up on. that's the senator that i hope people can embrace what he stood for for our country. and yes, he was a maverick. in his first senatorial campaign, i get a call and it's him on the phone. with father tony, a dear friend of mine. they say he's -- you got the congressman on the phone. i don't know how he tracked me down but we're in the restaurant. so i get the phone and he says, sorry, i'm running for u.s.
senate. i'm at lunch. you know john, he was going 100 miles an hour. so i'm going, okay. then he said, i want you to co-chair my campaign. said, well, john, you know i'm a democrat. i'm not sure that's going to help you with your republican campaign. said, i don't care, you're my friend, i want you to co-chair it. i said, well, let me sleep on it. no, no, you give me an answer right now, yes or no. of course i said yes. once again, senator john mccain. goes over to the other side. and don't forget, i was like an -- i mean, we were not the most liberal organization or the most conservative organization in the country. and we go back and forth with -- with john, you were either a
friend or not. at the end of the day, we could go a couple of years without seeing each other but when we did, it was like old home week. he was warm, he was energy, he was going 100 miles an hour but yet he made time to be with you. and then the second time we get a call to come to las vegas. this is of course when he's in his presidential campaign. and we end up in las vegas with his two right-hand folks that have always run his campaigns, which i have the greatest respect for. so we do the quick chitchat. then john says, i want you to speak on my behalf at the republican convention. i said, senator, i want to remind you, i'm a democrat. ah, i don't care. i want you there.
you're my friend. i want you there. i said, yes. i'll be there. he said, well, he said, with a big smile on his face, watch out when you start your car. i said, okay, senator. i'll do that. so john kind of put me out on the international scene. and i must confess, he did a number of things that i could stand here all day and share with you different stories. i will tell you that one time that we met is when meghan was on the tv program and i don't even remember the name of the tv program, meghan, but he said, you know, meg is on tv now. i go, yeah, okay. do you see her? no, senator, i don't watch tv that much.
well, you start watching her. okay. so that was our great senator. as we were walking out, he asked my wife, he said, i got a question for you. if i put a woman on our ticket, as vice president, what do you think about that? well, my wife isn't the type that holds back. she's a mexican from mexico city. and they have a tendency of just telling you how it is. and of course the senator liked that. she turns and said, i really don't care if it's a man or a woman. if something happens to you, i want to make sure that person can run the country. so john looked at her and said, okay. he looked at us two guys. of course we walked out. needless to say we heard later who he selected. but, again, regardless, there was the senator again, taking the risk of putting forth a
woman for vice president of this great country of ours. so it's no surprise. it's no surprise also that he got together with kennedy to push forth immigration reform. because when he talked about immigration, it wasn't so much the politics of it. it was, you know what, i can't believe these families that come from another country, from mexico, from central america, to work, cutting our grass, feeding us, bringing in the labor force that we need, and now we turn on them? that really struck at the heart of what he thought our great country was about. i believe it cost him a presidential campaign. so to me it's very dear what the senator's about. to me, john really did reflect our country and its true form.
my father is a marine. passed away in february. once a marine, always a marine, he's say. got wounded in guam. got a purple heart. when he talked about onmccajohn mccain, he said, he understands us. he understands us. and i must confess, he did understand us. he understood all of us. whether it was white, black, brown, asian. to him it didn't make any difference. what he knew is that we all make america great. we all make america great. so i hope in his legacy the senators, governors, mayors, city council members, elected officials, embrace the thought of love. because john reflected love and
love of a strong man. and that is now a days hard to come by. so his legacy will go on for generations. because people will talk about senator john mccain as one of the greatest heroes in our lifetime. and with that, if you permit me, read timothy 2. as for me, my life is already being poured away as a libation and the time has come for me to depart. i have fought the good nigfight the end. i have run the race to the finish. i have kept the faith.
a fiery navy pilot shot down by the vietnamese. he bailed out just in time to plunge into the lake below. that pilot, a young john mccain, was taken hostage as a prisoner of war, where he spent more than 5 1/2 years, almost 2,000 days he what endure countless beatings, torture, solitary confinement and mental and emotional anguish that none of us will ever have to endure. after getting to know senator mccain, i felt compelled to visit vietnam. i wanted to see the places where the will of john mccain was tested and forged. i saw the lake. i walked the steps. i sat in the cell. and the ordeal that my friend survived became all the more real. many people might wonder what a young african-american kid from minnesota and a highly decorated
vietnam war hero to a united states senator might have in hero. well, i thought of a few. i'm black. he was white. i'm young. he wasn't so young. he lived with physical limitations brought on by war. i'm a professional athlete. he ran for president. i run out of bounds. he was the epitome of toughness and i do everything i can to avoid contact. i have flowing locks and, well, he didn't. how does this unlikely pair become friends? i've asked myself the same question. but do you know what the answer is? that's just who he is. over the several years i had the privilege of spending time with senator mccain, sometimes it was
just a visit to our practices. other times, it was him texting and saying, you need to pick it up this sunday. i'm thankful that through these moments, the opportunity that we had to share our lives and, more importantly, our stories. while from very different worlds, we developed a meaningful friendship. this highlights the very rare and special qualities of senator mccain i came to deeply admire. he didn't judge individuals based on the color of their skin, their gender, their backgrounds, their political affiliates or their bank accounts. he evaluated them on the merits of their character and the contents of their hearts. he judged them on the work they put in and the principals they lo lived by. it was this approach to humanity that made senator john mccain so respected by countless people around the world, including me.
his accomplishments were many. u.s. senator. presidential candidate. statesman. warrior. and hero. his work ethic, tireless. his fight, legendary. what made senator mccain so special was he cared about the substance of my heart more so than where i came from. while some might find our friendship out of the ordinary, it was a perfect example what made him an iconic figure. he celebrated differences. he embraced humanity. championed what was true and just. saw people for who they were. yes, ours was an unlikely friendship. but it's one that i will always cherish. i've had the honor of attending several of the sedona forums hosted by senator mccain and his remarkable wife cindy. there were world leaders in
politics, business, science and education to discuss the most pressing matters of our time. issues like health care, global warming, technology and human trafficking. these leaders gathered to find real solutions. and they gathered because senator mccain asked them to be there. his devotion to making arizona the united states and the whole world a better place for everyone has aspired countless leaders like those at the sedona forums. i'm confident his legacy of devotion and to the common good will continue to inspire people around the world long after today. a few years ago, he was kind enough to take me on a personal tour of the u.s. senate. it was obvious that senator mccain was highly regarded. he believed to be right. and was good, regardless of which political side of the aisle his opinion fell on. i saw how respected he was and how much admiration he commanded
from people across the political spectrum. but that admiration wasn't surprising. because senator mccain was known as a man of integrity and conviction. a man who, at times, just as he sacrificed himself for his fellow pows in vietnam, willingly chose to sacrifice his own political gains in order to accomplish what he believed was best for all. as a result of this type of sacrifice, he may have lost the support of a political ally here and there, but he gained the respect and admiration of an entire nation. in closing, i'd like to honor the love i saw in senator mccain. he loved the people of arizona. serving them patiently and diligently for decades. he took that same love to washington and boldly advocated for the freedoms and liberties he had grown to love as a young navy pilot. but the love i saw most was the love he had for his wife cindy and his children. i heard him speak about them
often. and the love always came pouring through in every word. senator mccain, it's been a true honor to call you friend. your toughness and bravery inspired us. yo you sacrificed and risked your life. your devotion to the people of arizona won our admiration. your love set an example for all of us to follow. jackie robinson once said a life is not important except on the impact it has on other lives. senator mccain, we will miss the blessings of being in your presence. but we will never forget the impact you had on the world and, more importantly, on often eache lives that you touched. we are all better for having known you. rest in peace, my friend. [ applause ]
>> my name's joe biden. i'm a democrat. and i love john mccain. i have had the dubious honor over the years of giving some eulogies for fine women and men that i've admired. but lindsey, this one's hard. the three men who have spoken before me i think captured john, given aspects of john in a way only someone close to him could understand.
but the way i look at it, the way i thought about it, was that i always thought of john as a brother. we had a lot of family fights. we go back a long way. i was a young united states senator. i got elected when i was 29. and i had the dubious extinction of being put on the foreign relations committee. which the next youngest person was 14 years older than me. and i spent a lot of time traveling the world because i was a signed responsibility. my colleagues in the senate know i was chairman of the foreign affairs committee. so i spent a lot of time on nato
and then the soviet union. and a long came a guy a couple years later. a guy i knew of. admired from afar. your husband who had been a prisoner of war. who had endured enormous, enormous pain and suffering. and demonstrated the code, the mccain code. people don't think much about it today. but imagine having already known the pain you were likely to endure and being offered the opportunity to go home. and saying no. in the navy, last one in, last one out. so i knew of john. and john became the navy liaison
officer in the united states senate. there was an office then. it used to be on the basement floor of members of the military who are assigned to senators when they travel abroad to meet with heads of state or other foreign dignitaries. and john had been recently released from the hanoi hilton. he became the navy liaison. for some reason, we hit it off from the beginning. we were both full of dreams. and ambitions. and an overwhelming desire to make the time we had there worthwhile. to try to do the right thing. to think about how we could make things better for the country we love so much.
and john and i ended up traveling every time i went anywhere. i took john with me or john took me with him. and we were in china, japan, russia, germany, france, england, turkey, turkey. all over the world. tens of thousands of miles. and we would sit on that plane and late in the night, when everyone else was asleep, and just talk, getting to know one another. we'd talk about family. we'd talk about politics. we'd talk about international relations. we'd talk about promise. the promise of america. we both were cockeyed optimists and really believed there is not a single thing beyond the capacity of this country. i mean, for real. not a single thing. and when you get to know another woman or man, you get to know their hopes and their fears, you
get to know their family even before you meet them, you get to know how they feel about really important things. we talked about everything except captivity and the loss of my family, which had just occurred. my wife and daughter. only two things we didn't talk about. but i found that it wasn't too long into john's duties that jill and i got married. jill is here with me today. five years i had been a single dad, and no man deserves one great love, let alone two. and i met jill. it changed my life. and she fell in love with him, and he with her. he'd always call her, as lindsey later would say, call her jilly. and sfaft, when they'd get bored
being with me on these trips, i remember to see -- and i later learned they are down in a cafe at the port and he has her dancing on top of a cement table drinking uzo. not a joke. jilly. right? but we got to know each other well, and he loved my son bo and my son hunt. as a young man, he came up to my house. he'd come up to wilmington. out of this grew a great friendship that transcended whatever political differences we had or later developed because, above all, above all, we understood the same thing.
all politics is personal. it's all about trust. i trusted john with my life, and i would, and i think he would trust me with his. we both knew then from our different experiences that, and as our life progressed we learned even more, that there are times when life can be so cruel. pain so blinding. it's hard to see anything else. it's the disease that took john's life. took our mutual friend, teddy's life, the exact same disease nine years ago, a couple days ago, and three years ago it took my beautiful son bo's life. it's brutal. it's relentless. it's unforgiving. and it takes so much from those we love and from the families who love them that in order to
survive, we have to remember how they lived. not how they died. i carry me, with me an image of bo sitting out in a little lake we live on, starting a motor on the little boat and smiling and waving. not the last days. i'm sure vicki kennedy has her own image maybe, looking seeing teddy alive on that sailboat out on the cape. and for the family, for the family, you will all find your own images whether it's remembering his smile, his laugh, or that touch on the shoulder, just running his hand down your cheek. or just feeling like someone is looking at you, and turning and
just seeing him smiling at you. just looking at you. or when you saw the sheer joy that crossed his face the moment he knew he was going to take the stage on the senate floor and start a fight. god, he loved it. so to cindy and to the kids, doug, andy, cindy, meghan, jack, jimmy, bridget, and i know she is not here, but to mrs. mccain, we know how difficult it is to bury a child, mrs. mccain. my heart goes out to you. and i know right now the pain you are all feeling is so sharp and so hollowing. and john's absence is all consuming for all of you right now. it's like being sucked into a black hole inside your chest and it's frightening. but i know something else, unfortunately from experience.
that there is nothing anyone can say or do to ease the pain right now. but i pray, i pray you take some comfort knowing that because you shared john with all of us, your whole life, the world now shares with you the ache of john's death. look around this magnificent church. look what you saw coming at the state capitol yesterday. it's hard to stand there, but part of it, part of it was, at least it was for me with bo standing at the state capitol, you knew it was genuine. it was deep. he touched so many lives.
and i've gotten calls not just because people knew we were friends, not just from the people around the country, but leaders around the world calling me. i'm getting all these sympathy letters. i mean, hundreds of them, and tweets. character is destiny. john had character. while others will miss his leadership and his passion, even his stubbornness, you are going to miss that hand on your shoulder. the family, you are going to miss the man. a faithful man as he was who you
knew would literally, give his life for you. for that there is no bomb but time. time and your memories of a life lived well and lived fully. but i make you a promise. i promise you the time will come, because what's going to happen is six months will go by and everybody is going to think, well, it's passed. but you are going to ride by that field or smell that fragrance, receive that flashing image, and you are going to feel like you did the day you got the news. but you know you are going to make it when the image of your dad, your husband, your friend
crosses your mind and a smile comes to your lip before a tear to your eye. that's when you know, and i promise you, i give you my word, i promise you, this i know. that day will come. that day will come. you know, i'm sure my former colleagues and all who work with john, i'm sure there are people who have said to you not only now, but the last ten years, explain this guy to me. right? explain this guy to me. because, as they looked at him, in one sense they add miranmire but in one sense the way things have changed so much in america, they looked at him as if john
came from a different age, live by an ancient antiquated code where honor, courage, integrity, d duty, that was how john lived his life. the truth is john's code was ageless. is ageless. when you talked earlier, grant, you talked about values. it wasn't about politics with john. he could disagree on substance, but it was the underlying values that ant mated everything john did. everything he was. you could come to a different conclusion, but where he'd part company with you is if you lacked the basic values of decency, respect.