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tv   The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell  MSNBC  October 1, 2019 7:00pm-8:00pm PDT

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department of president trump. they started investigating her emails again. they started it again in august, which is roughly the same time the trump administration found out about the whistleblower complaint, about president trump's behavior toward ukraine. the response of the state department was to start to reinvestigate hillary clinton's emails and they're doing that now. but i'm really looking forward to her being live in the studio tomorrow night. i'll be a guest on steven colbert tonight. then because who needs to sleep, i'll be on the "today" show at 8:30 eastern. but that hillary clinton interview would keep me up all night, anyway, in terms of prepping for it. thanks, everybody, for the launch of my book. lawrence o'donnell is next. >> your book launches today, and
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right after midnight last night, i got the audio book and just poured it into my phone. >> you are very kind. i feel like i should reimburse you for this. >> it is so great and the audio book really moves like a great movie. and i know that's you and scott shirat, your director of this great audio book. it's a separate experience. i'm advocating people get both. >> did you get to the point in the book yet where there is a cameo appearance by pussy riot? >> yeah. >> we had to move heaven and earth to make that happen. before we go, this letter from the three chairmen in the house to secretary pompeo, this battle now is truly engaged. >> in terms of -- this is in response to pompeo saying he doesn't want to let these -- >> yeah, the three chairmen saying you absolutely have no
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right to block any of this testimony, and you don't have any right to have state department lawyers in the room during these depositions, and oh, by the way, you used those rules yourself when you were a member of the house of representatives in that little benghazi investigation that you were so obsessed with. and this is now just as hard-hitting a battle as i've ever seen in situations like this. >> well, and, you know, it has been one thing, and i think it's been a frustration for democrats in the house to be trying to get testimony from witnesses who don't want to testify and don't want to be in the middle of this, and are trump loyalists and they're kicking and screaming being dragged in there and they don't want to do it. that may not be the case for all the witnesses in the trump campaign. and pulling rabbits out of their hats trying to block witnesses who are part of an impeachment proceeding now, and those
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witnesses may not go along with their games to try to keep them out of there, and i don't think this will end well for all of them. the state department implicated itself for the president's call for which he is being impeached, he's not in a strong position. >> that's what the chairmen were saying last night. their letter was to the deputy secretary of state because they're saying mike pompeo can't even be in the dialogue about this. he's a witness. he can't be in the dialogue. >> it's a fair opinion. it involved the president repeatedly mentioning him as part of the scheme for which he's going to be impeached, bill barr should have recused and taken himself out of it because he's implicated in it. it's the same thing with mike pompeo, and i think ultimately those norms will be ratified here, and i don't think it's going to i understand well for barr or pompeo. they don't have the same kind of immunity from liability that the
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does by virtue of the oval office. >> they might have a new justice department with a new attorney jegeneral appointed by a democratic party looking into what they've been up to right now. >> attorneys general have been indicted in the past, and attorney general john mitchell went to prison for having done stuff for richard nixon that he knew better than to do himself. these guys saying they'll do anything for the president not necessarily will save themselves even if it will help him in the long run. >> we will begin tonight with the breaking news about the state department's inspector general's urgent request tonight to brief house and senate committees about documents related to the state department and ukraine. the inspector general wants to brief several committees, including the senate intelligence committee. we'll be joined by a member of
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the senate intelligence committee, senator kamala harris, who is now a candidate for president of the united states. she also serves on the senate judiciary committee with republican senator chuck grassley who picked sides today in the battle between donald trump and the whistleblower, and it will surprise you whose side senator grassley is on. but it is not so surprising for people who know senator grassley and who have worked with him in the senate. we will consider why donald trump has not yet attacked chuck grassley for chuck grassley's very strong defense today of the whistleblower. and at the end of the hour, we will be joined by american journalism's highest authority on impeachment. elizabeth true is now covering her third impeachment proceeding of the president of the united states. she is a washington congresswoman for the new yorker. elizabeth true wrote the book about that process which remains the highest standard in impeachment reporting.
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washington journal reporting watergate and richard nixon's downfall. elizabeth's reporting has always been mandatory reading for me, and i can assure you, her op-ed speech in the "new york times" has been treated as mandatory reading by the staff of all the house committees involved in the impeachment process and all of them members of those committees. when elizabeth true talks about impeachment, i for one listen, take notes and i learn, and i will be doing that at the end of this hour when we are joined by the voice of experience on impeachment, elizabeth drew. the breaking news of the hour is a letter signed by three house committee chairmen to the deputy secretary of state responding to a letter earlier in the day by secretary of state mike pompeo in which secretary pompeo attempted to block testimony from current and former state department officials. the letter tonight says, dear mr. deputy secretary, we are
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responding to a letter sent earlier today by secretary of state mike pompeo attempting to block testimony from current and former state department officials sought by our committees for depositions as part of the house of representatives impeachment inquiry. we are writing to you because secretary pompeo now appears to have an on yus conflict of interest. he appeared personally in the july 25, 2019 call. the president convinced the american president until the ukranian president tried using aggression. he should not, but a saw no effort from the state department to protect witnesses from dying, and it shall be levels of obstruction and reports of other
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state department officials being involved in or knowledgeable of the events under investigation. the committees may be including, by the president. this would be a blatant cover-up and clear abuse of power. that letter to the deputy secretary of state tonight follows a report by nbc news tonight that the inspector general of the state department has made an urgent request to brief several congressional committees tomorrow about documents related to the state department and ukraine, according to multiple congressional sources. the request from the state department's inspector general comes on the same day that the head of the state department of state mike pompeo sent a letter to the state department saying he will not make voluntarily available five witnesses for
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depositions. one of them has already agreed to appear. vol volker resigned last week. the pompeo letter says, quote, the invitations the committee sent to the five department officials include requests that each of them personally produced a vast amount of documents. these requests appeared to duplicate the subpoena that was previously served on the secretary of state. the requested records constitute the property of the department of state and are subject to restrictions on the unauthorized disclosure of classified information and various executive branch privileges. the pompeo letter went on to say that the committee is asking witnesses to, quote, produce materials that are not theirs to produce. the inspector general of the state department is steve
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linnick who was appointed to that position in 2015 by barack obama. the inspector general would like to meet with the staff of the house intelligence committee, the senate intelligence committee, the house foreign affairs committee, the senate committee, as well as the senate appropriations committee. it includes democratic staff and republican staff. this is a request the likes of which i for one as a former staffer have never seen or been a party to. fortunately tonight we are joined by guests who have much more experience than i do in intelligence matters. we will be joined later in the hour by a member of the senate intelligence committee, senator kamala harris, who is now candidate for president. pompeo's letter blocking the testimony says anyone should be able to attend depositions of
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employees. the secretary of state says, the same rule has been in place fofr over a decade on the committee for oversight and reform, and it was in place during secretary pompeo's tenure on the benghazi select committee, the regulations that govern house deposition and state. they may be urging them, advising them of thifr rights, only members designated by the chair or ranking minority member. an official reporter, the witness and the witness' counsel are invited to attend. jurors are counsel for other people. the chairman's letter says, the rule is intended for exactly these circumstances, to prevent an asian head who is directly contributes to the dwis could
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make the -- the foreign affairs committee and elijah cummings of the oversight committee tell the deputy of state, it is a prisonable or by any threatening letter or communication to influence, obstruct or impede oren did he ever to do so, the due and proper exercise of the power of inquiry under which any inquiry or investigation is being had by either house or any committee of either house. and we begin our discussion of all of this with someone who would be in that meeting with the inspector general tomorrow if she still had her old job at the house intelligence committee. meek a oyang is a former staff member of the house intelligence committee and now vice president of the third way. also executive armed services committee. she's an msnbc national security
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analyst, and we're joined by democratic senator mike fa las can i -- i sper, i should have be been. >> this request by the inspector general is to meet with the committee staff. surely the members would be welcomed at the meeting, but most members are not in washington. this is a request to meet with the republican staff, the democratic staff of all of these committees, house and senate combined. it's maybe the largest collection of committee staff that will ever be gathered in one room at one time. what is your reading of this situation tonight with the state department? >> well, i think it's really interesting. first of all, steve linnick, let me give you some context. steve linnick is a former prosecutor. he spent a lot of times in corruption trials, which is
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paper-intensive trials. those are the kinds of cases that are built on documents. so he understands the importance of documents. the fact that he is bringing documents, that means that something is in those documents, that he thinks it's really important that the people who are doing this impeachment inquiry see immediately. it will be very interesting to see what we find out tomorrow, but this is unusual for an. i found an inspector general to step up like this -- because typically they want to go through protocols and procedures. something else is up. >> you might be in your old room
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a . that was the inspector general that asked for this meeting. so this would not be a follow-up in secretary pompeo's letter where he's raising questions about the documentation of some of these documents and the imelda. because it's coming from the sena senate. . thz different from members of the committee to earlier where they point out to dhuk volker heard on the call with the president of ukraine. there have been so many things that have been happening inside the state department, it's sort of hard to.
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. >> but what's cleefr is. he's bringing forward things that we may not have heard of before into this conversation. >> senator mng cass skill began, so that will provoke trump world into thinking, he's bias. he is the inspector general who sin at the sized the report that actually was highly critical of they said she, in fact, did not comply with the federal records act. he found that vee. so that was the last big moment we've heard from 20 people.
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>> it probably pertains to the secretary of state if not the president himself. why do i say this? i don't know if this is news or not, but the department of defense is also doing -- i understand there is an i.g. investigation occurring also, a d and d, and they're looking to what happened with the ukranian pund punds. >> that, inspector general, has not taken mp it letting my personality go and speak to the independent branch of government that has a right to talk to them. if they go, the need to intimidate them main not telling congress as much as they no. ly.
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state department experts and senior personnel. >> let's all keep in mind of the sequence today fortunate state department. it was the pompeo letter to the then after that, and only after that, came the inspector general's urgent request. then the other letter i was reporting on from the three chairmen, that came after the pompeo letter denied the access to the witnesses and the documents. . listen to what he said when he was asked last week. let's listen to the way he reacted to questions about that
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last week. >> you just gave me a report, none of which i've seen. >> i haven't had a chance to actually read the whistleblower complaint yet. i read the full i'll ultimately get a chance to see it. >> now you know what mike pompeo is like when he's not telling the truth. listen to what he said today when asked about this. >> mr. secretary, do you have any comments on? dwrufr live. >> senator mccaskill, the new technique for mike pompeo is to turn and walk in the other direction. >> his business is not clearly
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going to be mark .pay o'. if he was doing what trump said to him him to do. ez. by not admitting in that moment to martha, stonewalling and stiffening the constitutional rormt in an impeachment inquiry. >> first of all, this meeting is as unprecedented to you as it is to me. you've never seen anything like this. >> i've never seen anything so like this. i'd like. >> what can you imagine the
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next. that only his meeting wb the foreign reettles committee. >> it was a complaint that came in fofr oufr new to ukraine. then they feefr he'll be digging up a initial crab rating about the prison by. in the trx of foreign ail pold back these. >> he may have a problem here with the ninside filing that
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whistleblower report with the house committee. we saw that process. it was paper. intentionally wrote a cover letter to a kiflly written when i say be, race over to the ho e house. i need to come in and see you right away. there is no time to happened he will this on may men this. the whistleblower is two long words here. the whistleblower knew, has
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documents that a sdpl of that nature. in another context we're having all these. rachel keeps really good track of them, and you do. but one of these, and the government holding onto critical information due to this or someone else, he might also that he turn over other documents. >> i've been sitting here the wos. you know it was something that he did not know existed in the vovt until he had fwhen there for a while.
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a >> in fact mpgs at the beginning of his administration tlfrks a little kerfuffle trying to get ridor general to get their people in. guess who raised their hand and said, no, no, you can't do that. none other than that chuck grassley. >> because he's been strong on whistleblower issues. >> always. >> senator mccass kill, alice and miake yang, thank you. stomp more questions are being asked of william barr, what did they know and when did they know it? a member of the senate committee and senate judiciary committee. she asked william barr in the judiciary committee one of the most important questions he's ever been asked under oath. senator kamala harris joins us
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last week senator kamala harris of california sent a letter to the state department inspector general, steve linnick, demanding that he investigate whether state department officials worked with rudy giuliani, quote, in violation of restrictions on engaging in partisan political activity. nbc news is reporting that inspector general steve linnick made an urgent request tonight
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to brief several house senate committees tomorrow about documents related to the state department and ukraine. and joining us now is democratic presidential candidate senator kamala harris of california. she's a member of the senate intelligence committee and senate judiciary committee. senator harris, i have to ask you, isn't it possible that your letter to the inspector general is what triggered some kind of inquiry by him that has him rushing to congress tomorrow for a closed door briefing? >> i'm sure it's possible, lawrence, but as claire mccaskill said earlier, the inspector general as carryover from a previous administration knows that fundamentally their duty is to incrementally share the issues. they had a question to answer
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with rudy giuliani's engagement with officials, and what resources or tax dollars were used to facilitate basically the request of political favors from a foreign head of government by donald trump. >> mike pompeo's letter today to the chairman in the house refusing to comply with their request to depose state department witnesses complained of bullying in their tactics because in their notices of the request for these depositions, they reminded the secretary of state what the law is and what they would interpret as obstruction of their activity. tonight in response to pompeo's refusal, those chairmen now have sent a letter to the deputy secretary of state reminding him that it is, as they put it, a criminal violation punishable by fine of up to five years in
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prison to buy threats or force or buy any threatening letter or communication, influence, obstruct, impede the due process exercise of their governmental powers. is it appropriate to be citing these criminal statutes when talking with the state department about obtaining information? >> in an inquiry that is a legitimate and important inquiry about how the resources of this secretary of state and the state department have been used, and have they been ugsd for tsed fo political benefit of this president and not for national security. while we're talking about who is reminding who, i think congressman mike pompeo needs to remind secretary of state mike pompeo of what he argued when he had hillary clinton before the committee on benghazi. because it reeks of hypocrisy and of one standard in one
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situation and one that doesn't suit him, and all of a sudden he goes quiet and shuts down the process. so there is that, lawrence. but the bottom line is i'm very happy and excited that the i.g. has kicked in and is doing the job that he was designed to do as inspector general. and i think the inquiry is proceeding as it should in that regard, but secretary of state mike pompeo really has a lot of questions to answer, and frankly, i think that we all see that he is on the verge of object strubting justice if he is going to suppress evidence that may very well be evidence of a crime. >> senator pompeo was in italy tonight a week after, it turns out, attorney general barr was secretly in italy which we've now discovered, and he was there once again apparently trying to
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help the president's reelection campaign. they hope to undermine the offer engines of what became the mueller investigation. you asked attorney general barr whether he'sr enasked to do investigationeded. let's take a look at the way he handled that question. >> has the president or anyone at the white house ever asked or suggested that you open an investigation of anyone? yes or no, please, sir. >> the president or anybody else. >> it seems you would remember something like that and would be able to tell us. >> i'm trying to grapple with the word "suggests." there have been discussions of matters out there that they have not asked me to open an investigation. >> perhaps they've suggested? >> i wouldn't say suggest. >> hinted? >> i don't know. >> so for william barr, it all turns on the definition of the
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word "suggest." >> clearly for william barr, it also turns to the fact that he di dint. at that very moment, i think it became clear that he was not being forthright with the american people and the congress of the united states of america. that's why i have called for him to come back and, under oath, testify an answer to that question yet again. that's why i called laurn, lawr on the inspector general to find out how the inspector general was used in that matter. i wrote a letter to dorsey saying mr. trump should have his license suspended, because he really has been pleading for terms of use. >> i have former chairman of the committee, chuck grasslee, you
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know p entering -- taking his own position in the battle between donald trump and the whistleblower, and guess whose side he's on. he followed the wind, and ought to be making. we're kafrlly following up on the facts. uninformed speculation wielded by politicians is counter turg the concerns between first and secondhand knowledge weren't legal ones. were you surprised that mr., but he has been a champion in my time in the senate. i've watched anymore defense of whins and whistleblower statutes. they he, unlike so many others,
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to put country before party, and has been willing to have the courage to stand. >> he was, and the current chairmen of judiciary. if you've met chuck grassley, you know. when he sticks up on the weekend, it's twun. in the design of our democracy, it's one of the most important metd. therefore, it is an opportunity in a way we can correct and an
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abuse of taxpayer resources. good for chuck grassley on this one and i hope that more of my colleagues will recognize that this is really a matter about the integrity of our system of government and our democracy and should not be a partisan issue. we should all stand together saying that we have in common a desire to know that there is integrity in these systems, and in particular when it relates to our nation's security. >> senator harris, please stay with us, because when we come back after this break, i want to ask you about new reporting in the "new york times" tonight that president trump wanted to shoot immigrants at the southern border, and when he was told that was against the law, he said he wanted to shoot them in the legs, and he was told that was against the law. he said he wanted to build a moat at the border, fill it with alligators. little the wildest, craziest stuff we've heard from donald trump about the border. it's all reporting in the "new york times." i'm going to ask you about that right after this break. please stay with us. >> sure. i will. break please stay with us. >> sure. i will i've been plotting to destroy you. sizing you up... calculating your every move.
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tonight the "new york times" is reporting new details about ideas president trump has for the southern border. according to an excerpt from the new book "border wars" written by the "new york times," privately, the president had often talked about fortifying a border wall with a water-filled trench, stocked with snakes or alligators, prompting aides to seek a cost estimate. he wanted the wall electrified, with spikes on top that could pierce human flesh. his staff told him that was illegal, but later in a meeting,
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aides recalled he said they should shoot migrants in the legs to slow them down. that's not allowed, either, they told him. senator kamala harris is back with us. your reaction to this new reporting about trump ideas for the border. >> i'm beyond words, to be honest with you, lawrence. it is outrageous. you know, we have -- we have a person occupying the white house right now that is not only lawless, not only probably the most unpatriotic president we've ever had, we have someone who is mean and mean-spirited and is confused about what is the real measure of strength and power. because if he were clear about it, he would understand that the true measure of strength and power is not based on who you beat down, it is based on who you lift up. but what you are telling me is that there is a report that basically has the president of the united states advocating
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what will be torture, mayhem of human beings when there is so many other tools available to address what we need to do to deal with immigration, which, by the way, is a passing comprehensive immigration reform with a pathway toward citizenship. i'm beyond words to describe how outrageous i think most americans would feel about what he advocated, and by the way, just like what we saw as the bipartisan reaction when people became aware of a policy that was about putting babies in cages and separating children from their parents in the name of border security, i believe that the american people will recognize that advocating for moats filled with snakes and alligators, that the american people would be outraged regardless of their party affiliation just knowing that's not reflective of the values of who we say we are.
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and it's just not reflective of what should be a modern president in america who values human rights. >> there is another passage in the reporting of these "new york times" reporters about the customs and border protection chief when the president said to him that he wanted him to stop letting migrants cross the border at all anywhere with no exceptions. if you get into trouble for it, mr. trump told him, i'll pardon you. now, does that qualify as a possible article of impeachment? >> well, listen, i mean, what he is basically saying is if you commit a crime, i got your back. so let's start with the fact that we have the president of the united states encouraging someone to break the law. again, further evidence of the fact that donald trump is lawless. as i've said before -- look, maya angelou told us that you should listen to people when they tell you who they are the first time. donald trump told us who he was
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when he was campaigning for office, when he said if i shoot someone on fifth avenue, i can get away with it. he told us then who he is, and all of this is evidence of the fact that we knew a long time ago. and so let the impeachment proceedings begin, and i have full faith in the ability of the united states congress, certainly in the house of representatives, to do the right thing. >> senator kamala harris, candidate for president of the united states, thank you very much for joining us tonight on this important news night. >> thank you, lawrence. thank you. take care. when we come back, what should the democrats do on impeachment? one article of impeachment quickly or multiple articles of impeachment? that is the biggest decision they are facing, both strategically and substantively in the house of representatives. that's next. that's next. just scan the sensor with your reader, iphone or android and manage your diabetes. with the freestyle libre 14 day system,
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nicotine to addict them. 5 million kids use e-cigarettes. juul is "following big tobacco's playbook." and now, juul is pushing prop c to overturn e-cigarette protections. vote no on juul. no on big tobacco. no on prop c. the big question facing speaker nancy pelosi and house democrats is how many articles of impeachment? should they deliver one clear article of impeachment based on the rough transcript of the president's phone call soliciting help from ukraine? that's what made the democrats in favor of impeachment. it is for the democrats at this point an open and shut case, and very few republicans are actually specifically defending what the president said on that phone call. that phone call has dramatically pushed up support for the
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impeachment investigation to solid majority support at 55%. but we've never seen the congress pursue only one article of impeachment. the house judiciary committee voted on multiple articles of impeachment against richard nixon and bill clinton. and the votes on those articles of impeachment were different. the vote totals were different on each count. some articles attracted more votes than others. so strategically, you might want to include three or four articles of impeachment so that a republican senator could vote against three articles of impeachment before voting for one article of impeachment. the article of impeachment about that phone call, for example. it only takes one successful article of impeachment to remove a president. elizabeth true is now reporting on the third impeachment process of her distinguished career as a journalist in washington. in today's "new york times," she writes, house democratic leaders follow frustrated efforts to hold president trump to account, understandably want to strike
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quickly to impeach him on the grounds of one extremely serious issue, his pressuring the president of ukraine to get the goods on his democratic rival joe biden. but they're risking making their target too narrow and moving too in so doing, they could end up impliftly bestowing approval on acts that amount to a long train of abuses of power and going too quickly could shut off the oxygen that might fuel republican acceptance that it's time to break with mr. trump. perhaps enough of them to end his presidency. elizabeth drew join us next. performance comes in lots of flavors. there's the amped-up, over-tuned, feeding-frenzy-of sheet-metal-kind. and then there's performance that just leaves you feeling better as a result. that's the kind lincoln's about.
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. we should get this done before the end of the year for two reasons. one, so we can talk about all of our positive agenda what's been marked as we're doing on jobs, infrastructure, and gun violence, and i want our nominee to be the face of the party in 2020. i don't want house democrats to be the face. i want them to run on a positive agenda. so we should wrap this up this year and then move on. >> congress ro khanna. when i hear statements like that, i always wonder what does elizabeth drew think? no one in journalism knows more about impeachments of presidents than elizabeth drew and no one has covered its more wisely than she. she made the case today for multiple articles of impeachment against president trump, and joining us now is elizabeth drew, journalist and author of the book "washington journal reporting watergate and nixon's
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downfall." thank you so much for joining us tonight. i'm going to have you make your case in a moment about the multiple articles, but i may not want to start with something with you, and that is the feel of where we are. you lived through 1973, 1974 in washington and felt the waves of the nixon investigation and when it started to feel more important. the same thing with the investigation of president bill clinton ultimately leading to his impeachment in the house of representatives and trial in the senate. what does it feel like now? where do you think we are? >> i think we're in aiti tizzy, lawrence. with nixon it was clear what is issues were, are. with clinton it was all too clear. i mean, people talk about that that wasn't a popular impeachment or he did well
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afterwards because it really wasn't well grounded. there weren't reasons to throw him out of the presidency. so it wasn't serious enough. impeachment is very serious, and we've gotten too used to the term. but in watergate we didn't have cable, we didn't have internet. if it was kind of walden pond compared to now. each day, you know, each hour something is breaking. it's almost so confusing that we have focus. it's important to focus on what's really going on here. >> you know, i've been listening to the debate of should there be one article of impeachment well written, quickly pursued, should there be multiple. i started in the multiple articles school. i can definitely see the case for the one clear simple article that everyone understands. i get that case. i don't think it's an easy choice. is it an easy choice for you? >> no, it's not an easy choice, but i think it's very important and serious one. it's not a question of the number, lawrence. it's a question of what you
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cover. and i totally understand the democrats pouncing on the call to the president of ukraine because it's such an obvious problem and impeachable. they've been so frustrated and we could do this and get it through and impeach him, hurrah. the problem is that then you're justization what about all the other infringements and the abuses of power that have been committed, his enriching himself at the expense of the taxpayer and the government, his lying so much we don't have a accountable government, his threatening of the intelligence agencies revoking their clearance because they criticized him, his thing amazon, raising its postage rates because they own "the washington post." are we going to say that's all
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on your? are we saying that for the future? these are not things we should pay attention to? i find that a very troubling proposition. that's really why i come out. one would be ukraine and one would be obstruction because there's been an across the board inquiry. but we need one that's very much like article 2 for nixon. you don't go into great detail, but it's under the rubric of abuse of power. trump has committed at least as many abuses of power as nixon did, and i just don't think we should say that's okay for the future. that would be very troubling. it would set a terrible precedent. so under there you would have some things i listed and other matters as well. i think otherwise -- also, if it's too thin, i think the house people are mainly going on the assumption which i don't buy that those republican senators would vote to really convict
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trump out of office. i'm not sure that's true. i've never thought that's true and i increasingly don't question whether that's true. you get to the senate, do you say, well, there's this one thing he should be removed from office over, i don't know. i think that's a hard argument to make. >> you're not seeing the kind of defensive posture from mitch mcconnell that if you were donald trump you would want to see right now? >> except for lindsey graham you're not seeing much defense of him at all in the senate. i say in the piece i talked to a democrat with a lot of republican friendships. people don't think that happens, but he said they're nervous as hell, that was his term. that's because, a, they don't know what's coming. bricks are falling every day. they're tired of defending him and tired of defending the indefensible. they know it was an unacceptable thing to do to bully the president of ukraine over getting his militaries assistance as they had voted
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for. that's another one he keeps taking appropriations from congress and moving the money around. are you going to say that's will there? >> elizabeth drew always a pleasure and honor to have you with us. thank you very much for joining us. i really appreciate it. >> thank you, lawrence. elizabeth drew gets tonight's last word. "the 11th hou "the 11th hour with brian williams" starts now. tonight a big development we just don't know yet what it means, the state department's independent inspector general asks for a meeting with staff, the subject is ukraine. it comes as our secretary of state accuses democrats in congress of bullying his people in their search for the truth about ukraine. this as the president's lawyer, rudy giuliani, has himself lawyered up, while trump is pressing for the questioning of adam schiff i. trump goes on a tear alleging he's the victim of a coup attempt, telling his followers they're coming for


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