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tv   The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell  MSNBC  October 14, 2019 7:00pm-8:00pm PDT

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applebee's new pasta and grill combos. choose from up to 12 combinations starting at $9.99. we are just about done for tonight but i have to make a correction before we go. this is interesting. at the top of the show i cited the "wall street journal" reported that lev parnas and igor freeman has been released. the "wall street journal" said they had both been released on $1 million bond. i am now being told that is not correct. despite the fact they have had the conditions for their bail set, they are not out. the "wall street journal" reported they have been released
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on bail, but the southern district tells us parnas and fruman are still in jail. quote, they remain in federal custody. so the "wall street journal" still as of right now as their story the way we reported it. we're told that's incorrect. i'm sorry for any confusion but it's kind of intriguing just the same. now it's time for "last word with lawrence o'donnell." sorry i went into your time. >> no, thank you for that correction. these guys are obvious flight risks more so than the average person who has a mortgage to pay. some are not too far from the courthouse or something. so it must be that they are working on really locking down these conditions for release. in a case like this, it's going to be more complex than a normal resident and citizen of the united states who has a mortgage, a job, the wife, the kids, all these things you look for, as anchors in the
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community. >> yes, and they're expected in federal court in new york really soon. they're due to be in federal court in new york on thursday, so the idea they would be out in the meantime and it would be no big deal that we would hear about many paragraphs in a "wall street journal" story was super intriguing to me, which is why i put it at the top of the show. we never get a call from sdny. getting a call from them in the middle of the show was like, okay, got it. we have breaking news at this hour. nbc news is reporting some very, very important breaking news. u.s. ambassador to the european union, gordon sondland, will tell congress on thursday that he thought ambassador marie yavonovitch of ukraine, our ukranian ambassador who donald trump got rid of, he's going to say that he thought she was great and that he has nothing negative to say about her performance as ambassador to
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ukraine despite her removal from that job by president trump,. a person with knowledge of sondland's testimony is telling nbc news tonight that yavonovitch was an able and professional diplomat and that he had absolutely no issues with her whatsoever. that's a big piece of breaking news from nbc news tonight. and there's another also from nbc news. correspondence between fiona hill's lawyers and white house deputy counsel michael papora obtained by nbc news show that the white house counsel tried to limit fiona hill's testimony today in her closed door deposition with the congressional impeachment investigation by raising the issue of executive privilege. they tried to impose that on her. she, of course, is the former national security council adviser to president trump on russia issues, primarily. the white house did not try to
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block her from testifying, but according to the correspondents, they said there were areas she could not possibly testify. they said those areas were direct communication with the president, phone calls, foreign heads of state. they immediately wrote back to the white house, sunday, the day before the testimony, and said they did not believe the white house legal reasoning, and they said some of the information that has already come into the public's fear can no longer be considered privileged, and hill's lawyers also made the legal argument. that is correct, the executive privilege disappears when there is reason to believe there is government misconduct. hill's lawyers told congress to add any comments they wanted to make to that, but the white
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house lawyers said absolutely nothing, apparently, that actually did inhibit hill's testimony today. and there have been no reports of any of the testimony delivered to the impeachment committees about donald trump's dealings with ukraine that are in any way favorable to donald trump. no one is coming out of those depositions saying here's all the favorable things said for donald trump in those depositions. every new witness appears to be adding more corroboration for the whistleblower's complaint that started this investigation. the complaint said donald trump was soliciting help in ukraine in his election campaign by asking ukraine to investigate joe biden. this is not the way trump followers imagined president trump taking on joe biden. they think trump is tough enough to fight biden face to face. to be a trump supporter is to be, to varying degrees, a
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fantacist. some businessmen supporting donald trump might like to live with the fantasy that they just vote to support his giant tax cuts that bankrupt the treasurer of the united states and want his racism, not his vulgarity, not everything he speaks about publicly. some trump supporters live in a world of complete fantasy about donald trump himself. the fantasy that somehow donald trump will still get mexico to pay for the wall. the fantasy that there will be a wall to pay for. the fantasy that donald trump is smarter than anyone in politics. the fantasy that donald trump is a tough guy, even though he grew up a spoiled rich kid. the fantasy that donald trump is brave, even though he got repeated draft deferments to avoid the war of his era and has not once since then ever exhibited a single moment of bravery of any kind in his life. still, the trump fantacists see
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him as tough and brave and even thin and energetic as they do in this video that was shown at a trump campaign event at a trump property in florida. that's about the only place where people would show this video publicly. we aren't showing the video, and i noticed today that cnn hasn't been showing the video, because in this video, the fantasy version of donald trump shoots and kills someone from cnbc, someone from cnn, someone from bbc news, along with many other news organizations. congressman joe kennedy whose grandfather was shot and killed while campaigning for president, and whose great uncle, president john f. kennedy, was shot and killed, assassinated. in the video, the fantasy trump kills more people than you can count, including rosie o'donnell, congresswoman maxine
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waters, and of course transferable concludes one of the most reporting in this trump video for trump fantacists by breaking president trump's neck and killing him. many claim they knew nothing about this video, including donald trump jr., who was at the event where the video was shown. donald trump has not seen the video. that is code for his followers that he really does not condemn the video. when he's telling them he condemns the video without seeing it, he's telling them this is a political thing i need to say about the video, and i hope you watch and think of me this way, especially the thin part. fantasy. so far that is all donald trump has to offer in his defense in the impeachment investigation, and the fantasy is crumbling. donald trump is completely unqualified ambassador to the
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european union who purchased his ambassadorship to the trump organization has been subpoenaed to testify to the impeachment investigation on thunderstorms, and all indications are, as nbc news is reporting tonight, that he will finally testify by the state department last week. the "washington post" reported over the weekend what to expect in gordon sondland's testimony about the now famous text of is, which is a reply to a more famous text to acting ukraine director bill taylor who says i think it's curious to hold texts from a political campaign. we now know that somewhere in those four hours, donald trump didn't know what to say in response to bill taylor's text. then gordon sondland wrote back and said, according to the
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"washington post." he said, i believe you have been correct about the president's intentions. no quid pro quos of any kind. the "washington post" reports r someone plans to tell lawmakers he has no knowledge of whether the president was telling him the truth at that moment. it's only true that the president said it, not that it was the truth. leading off our discussion tonight, our henchman. also emily vargas, secretary of defense in the obama administration. she's msnbc national security analyst. and national political reporter for nbc news. josh is the reporter that broke the news tonight we began this discussion with. and josh, because of that breaking news you revealed to us
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at the beginning of this hour, these indications are that ambassador sondland's testimony is not going to be the kind of testimony that donald trump wants to hear. >> it's certainly going to be a different narrative than we've been hearing from trump and the white house. and what sondland plans to say, particularly on marie yavonovitch, the ambassador that president trump didn't want to call, said she is a professional diplomat and he has no reason to doubt her qualifications for the job. let's take stock in this. we now have gordon sondland to testify. so folks are testifying that yavonovitch did a good job, didn't have a reason to be pulled out, and that will raise
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further questions by democrats as to why she was removed, supposedly this plot by giuliani to get rid of her because he thought she was blocking what he and the president were trying to do in ukraine. >> josh, you're reporting on the white house letters to hill prior to her testimony, telling her about executive privilege, all these things. one thing i noticed in your reporting that i read was that the white house lawyers tried to say to her lawyers, this is not a real impeachment inquiry. >> yeah, it echoes some of what was in that letter that the white house lawyer sent to nancy pelosi just about a week ago when they were saying they're not going to comply with this impeachment inquiry. this came as this was a flurry of negotiations just in the last couple days leading up to this testimony today between the white house lawyers and fiona hill's lawyers about what exactly she could say. the white house didn't go as far as to exert executive privilege
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and say, we don't think she can testify at all. that had been a big question. but they did lay out several areas where they said, we think this is covered by executive privilege, communications with the president, diplomat conversations. we think she should not be able to talk about these things. fiona hill's lawyers pushing back and saying, look, there is an implication here that there is wrongdoing by the government and executive privilege doesn't apply in that instance. and basically where things ended up as they headed into this very lengthy testimony today was with the white house lawyers reminding fiona hill and her lawyers, we advise you, do not talk about anything out of school, anything that could be classified or that we consider to be covered by executive privilege. >> carter, was it your sense that fiona hill had any intention of answering those kinds of questions from the
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white house? >> no, i think she did a remarkable job. she was completely nonpartisan, apolitical, an uncanny ability to remember facts and meetings. she really handled herself better than any person i've seen in a deposition. a real patriot and we should all be proud of her testimony. >> what would you say she added to your understanding of this case at this point? >> it's a good question. i'm not going to go into the specifics, but i will tell you that for me personally, her testimony today makes me further believe that we need to continue this investigation, because as we peel the layers of this onion back one layer at a time, bewe' finding more and more information and evidence that demands further investigation for the american public. >> congressman, the closed door
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nature of the depositions has been criticized by some. my understanding is this is things that take place that you don't want these witnesses to publicly share information through their testimony that other witnesses might then be affected by or adopt or change their stories to fit it. but does that mean at some point we will see all of fiona hill's testimony, or will she then be brought into a public hearing to do it again publicly? >> lawrence, you're spot on. that's exactly the point. be we want to make sure that each of these witnesses that come through and testify, that they're able to do that based on their knowledge and understanding without being tainted, so to speak, by previous testimony. that's why we're going to do each one systemically in this process. to see whether the testimony that was provided today, as well as future and past witnesses, whether that's going to be released in its entirety or partial parts thereof will be
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determined by chairman schiff and the other chairmen of the committee. but i would suffice it to say once we get through this process a little bit further, you will start to see some of this evidence coming out of the general public. >> ellen farkas, i've never heard -- harley rouda is the second person to come out of that deposition room to say this about fiona hill. the best deposition i've ever heard. i've never known anyone to say that about anyone before. >> i've known dr. hill for several years now. she's incredibly smart. i said the doctor thing to give her credentials a the blittle b. she knows ukraine inside-out, she knows how things are
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supposed to function because she's worked for several administrations. we know she was quite angered by the administration that ride giuliani was running. it sounded like she was advocating for ambassador yavonovitch behind the scenes. sondland, i think, is behind the kabol, if you will. i think they were trying to have something. we know she can't get away from lying because we know those other two guys are being deposed by attorneys in the fbi. >> evan, there is some feeling that the dam was breaking and witnesses they were trying to block are getting around those
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blocks and getting to testify. as someone who worked inside an administration like this, you probably have a sense of what it's like for the other people who are either still inside this administration or who have left this administration who are watching this happen, who might also have something to say themselves. does this become contagious, this kind of willingness to step forward directly to the committee and testify? >> yes, lawrence, and i think in a good way, because my understanding is that morale is really low, not just at the state department but also at the defense department. my successor once removed the woman in the job right now. she's going to be deposed. i can well imagine that for a lot of these people, it's a relief to go in there and tell an oversight body that has equal power with the executive branch what's going on. because many civil servants, most of them, are truly disturbed by all of this. they would like to go back to business as usual, and the only
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branch of government that can force business as usual in this current situation looks like congress. >> congressman roeuter, it does seem like president trump can hire the best defendants in town to tell about his testimony, and according to your government's salary who donald trump wanted to get rid of. wynn in the phone call transcript that's even in there, donald trump going after the ambassador, we know from his own words that donald trump was extremely negative about this ambassador and it sounds like he hasn't gotten any scht to that point in the testimony you've sheerd far.
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is that correct? >> -- i think if he does that, he'll be fine. i'm hopefully. i think if he goes that direction, the country will be ve very dplglad he did. >> congressman rouda, evelyn farkas. t the office that rudy giuliani used to run is now studying his financial records. that's next. studying his financial records. that's next. is that what i think it is? that is an armada of tiny sushi boats. awesome! i forgot to pack lunch. you had one job...
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rudy giuliani is under federal criminal investigation tonight by the same u.s. attorney's office that he used to be in charge of in manhattan in the 1980s. rudy giuliani's friends who were working with him on trying to get ukraine to help the trump reelection campaign have been arrested and charged with federal crimes, and some trump administration officials are now coming forward to testify to the impeachment committees after the trump administration has tried to block their testimony. tonight chris hayes asked congressman denny heck, a member of one of the impeachment investigating committees, if it feels like the dam is breaking. >> it feels like the dam is breaking, right, chris? i thought the fact that mr. mckinley agreed to come before
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us, i believe it's the day after tomorrow, was very significant. he's a distinguished career diplomat who has an incredible depth of understanding about how diplomacy should work. he's had some of the most significant diplomatic postings within the state department. and i think we're going to learn a lot from him, but then again, i think we're learning a lot from each and every one. >> joining us now is joyce vance, former attorney and msnbc political analyst, and sam kislin, msnbc political analyst. he just quit last week. here he is very quickly agreeing
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to go urnder oath to the investigating committees. >> yeah, the sense you get from talking to people on the hill is there are people in the administration that might not be trump loyalists who know where the story is going and don't want to be a part of it or at least want to get their side out. i think part of this is how the trump administration is handling this, but not releasing the transcripts after the interviews are done so potential witnesses don't know exactly what to say would compel someone to come forward to make sure they get their story out there first. but i think a lot of is revealing the house of cards element in the trump presidency. once someone steps out of line and isn't punished, it's an invitation to other people to do the same thing, so that comes in the form of testifying and not having the president go after you, but it also comes in the form of speaking out and not having the president go after you. what i was alluding to there was
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when mitt romney spoke out initially about how troubled he was by the phone call, trump did hit him back pretty hard. but it wasn't to the degree that you would normally expect trump to go after a republican. i think that's invited other republicans to stick their necks out more than usual. a lot of this is unraveling and i think the administration and the president himself are getting a bit spooked by it all. >> why don't you tell us what you're learning tonight about the investigation of rudy giuliani. they're looking at his bank records, they're looking at financial records. they've been doing this for months now. >> it's very clear after what we're learning tonight that rudy giuliani isn't just an incidental player, that he's someone that prosecutors are taking a hard look at as at least a subject of this investigation, possibly a target. here's what it means for prosecutors to be looking at his bank records. it means that they're trying to figure out who is paying rudy
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giuliani or who is paying for his travel. and that may hold very important elements of this case. and as you point out with the dam breaking, i sort of think what we're seeing on capitol hill comes together with rudy giuliani's exposure. this is more like reven"revenge the nerds" than a normal dam breaking. they kept their heads down and suddenly they look like superheros with capes. it may be their investigation this brings this down. >> on giuliani, we've gone from michael cohen, trump lawyer now in prison, rudy giuliani, trump lawyer, trump's so-called lawyer now under federal investigation. >> first of all, i'm going to ignore the reference to me as a
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nerd, okay? i'm just going to skip by that. rudy giuliani is not in an enviable position right now. all roads are leading to him. it's an open construction in public circles about whether trump cuts bait and throws him under the bus. there was an elusion to it. does he talk to congress about his involvement in ukraine? we hear that ambassador sondland is going to testify and whether he can see trump had to be cleared by rudy. will he wait for a lifeline from senator lindsey graham who last week hinted he would invite rudy to hiss senate to testify about
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all this and his escapades in ukraine. when i last talked to rudy a week ago, he said he had no plans. he did not return my comment about lindsey graham's committee. i'm curious if he engages and these leaks that come out about sondland throwing him under the bus, if that makes him leak more. >> if he has talked to rudy giuliani, that lawyer is telling him, don't you dare talk to the judicial committee while you're under investigation by the fbi. >> donald trump used to love to talk about merge traps. that was his excuse ultimately for not sitting for an interview with bob mueller. if rudy giuliani walks in front of this committee, it seems like almost a sad and foregone
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conclusion that he'll put himself in a perjury box, that he'll run into trouble. sometimes it looks like he doesn't even know what the truth is, his stories shift so much over time. they say the lawyer or the client that's his own lawyer, i'm going to now completely mess up that statement but you probably know better than i do. it's essentially you're a fool if you act like your own lawyer once you become the client. and that, you know, i think would be a terrible mistake for rudy giuliani here. he certainly needs a lawyer, he certainly has exposure. there is an intriguing possibility here, and we've seen this before in trump world with manafort. weaver be we've been here with michael cohen. will rudy giuliani be the person, the former u.s. attorney, who looks at the prospect if he is ultimately indicted, maybe spending the rest of his life in prison, and finally decides that donald trump isn't worth it, and that will require him a good lawyer to get him across that
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threshold. sam stein, joyce vance, thank you for coming. and the damage donald trump has caused by abandoning our allies, the kurds. allies, the kurds. no signal goes farther or is more reliable. so you can get more out of the new iphone. better battery life, new ultra-wide camera, now on a network that goes farther than ever. and right now, switch at a t-mobile store and get the new iphone on us! that's right, the new iphone on us! only at t-mobile.
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catastrophic. that's what mitch mcconnell is calling what donald trump did in syria after donald trump withdrew a small group of military personnel from northern syria which then allowed turkey to invade the area and kill as
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many of our kurdish allies there as possible, which is yet another trump decision that works perfectly for vladimir putin. the kurds, who u.s. forces were working with and protecting in that region, now need protected by someone after being abandoned by donald trump, so they are turning to vladimir putin just as russia and everyone involved in this conflict knew that they would. donald trump is now turning to a very weak packet of sanctions for the tushish minister, but not tushish president erdogan, who got exactly what he wanted from donald trump in their last phone call before turkey embarked on its attack on the kurds. democrats and republicans in congress are now working on actions that they can take that they hope can reverse the president's decision. the united nations secretary general said in a statement today that the turkish attacks
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in syria have resulted in many casualties and displaced at least 160,000 civilians. today the "new york times" reports that the foreign ministers of 28 european union member states agreed to stop selling arms to turkey in an unprecedented step toward a fellow nato member. they abandoned some of the camps where they were keeping isis fighters and supporters in custody. nbc reports that the kurdish-led syrian democratic 40s and syrian observatory for human rights said sunday that close to 800 mebds of members of a camp holding the families of isis fighters had escaped after turkish shelling. all of this is on donald trump. all of this happened because donald trump decided to allow it to happen and no one knows why. the president of the united states has not explained his decision to the american people.
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he has not explained it to anyone in congress. donald trump abandoned american allies and has left them to die, and no one knows why. one element of this story that links it with many other decisions donald trump has made as president is that it is very good for vladimir putin. after this break i'll ask former undersecretary of state, wendy sherman, why she thinks donald trump did this and what she thinks will happen next. d this thinks will happen next. ♪ the calming scent of lavender by downy infusions calm. laundry isn't done until it's done with downy.
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visit it's either the acertification process.t or it isn't. it's either testing an array of advanced safety systems. or it isn't. it's either the peace of mind of a standard unlimited mileage warranty. or it isn't. for those who never settle, it's either mercedes-benz certified pre-owned. or it isn't. the mercedes-benz certified pre-owned sales event. now through october 31st. only at your authorized mercedes-benz dealer. who made an abrupt decision without diplomatic advisers is creating a chapter here where the only real winner is russia. >> joining our discussion now is ambassador wendy sherman. she is former undersecretary of state in the obama administration. she's now msnbc global affairs
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contributor. ambassador sherman, i want to get to something that actually president trump said. he said he's absolutely fine with the kurds becoming an ally of russia. he said anyone who wants to assist syria in protecting the kurds is good with me whether it is russia, china orna pole na b bonaparte. yes, the president of the united states actually did say that. >> i think it's extraordinary, but i think we all get surprised every single day. he's the arsonist and now he wants to be the fireman? i think he did this again because he wants to put russia in charge for a reason we all still don't understand. i think he did it in the moment he did it because he wanted to take attention away from impeachment. but because he's so kbimpulsive
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he didn't stop to think about the consequences. he didn't stop to think that this might cross the line for members of congress. lindsey graham came out strongly but now he sort of roped him back in in common cause to try to solve a problem that didn't even need to exist. >> and what about institutional resistance to this? there have been times in our history when we've seen the resignation on principle. it happened in the clinton administration over domestic policy. would this be a moment for a secretary of state, for an undersecretary of state, for a secretary of defense to resign, to stand up and just resign? >> well, i think it would be a moment except that i think secretary pompeo is all in with the president of the united states. i think secretary esper, the secretary of defense, is brand new and doesn't really know how to get his hands around any of this. and most of the other senior officials in our government are
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acting officials with no authority. the president says that it is the deep state who is really holding him back from doing the things that he knows needs to be done but is, in fact, the patriots, the civil servants who service every day who are the ones who are bringing out the truth. so we have bill taylor, the acting ambassador in ukraine. we have marie yavonovitch masha, who has come out and spoken. and fiona hill today and mike mckinley who is just a superb ambassador. all of these people are coming forward to really tell the truth to the american public. and it's quite wonderful, i think, that it is public servants who really serve the constitution and serve all of us who are going to show the president what the truth really is and what the constitution is really about. >> the latest reporting from the "new york times" indicates that the thousands of troops that we have there that the president
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moved are now trapped. they don't have an actual way out since turkey has cut off the roads and the exit routes that they might use, and so now there is the question of will there be an airlift? how will we get the u.s. troops out? >> this is reminiscent, you'll know this. we haven't had to get troops out like this since the fall of saigon. this is going to be very, very difficultme difficult. it is one of the many, many down sides of the dangerous kbimpul e impulsivity of the president. we also have 50 tactical weapons at the air base in turkey, and turkey is, in assess eessence, our tactical weapons hostage to stop the death to the kurds. the president has basically handed the country back over to assad, to putin and to iran and
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to isis. and meanwhile, turkey is going to use those tactical nuclear weapons and millions of refugees as leverage to make sure it can hold on to a piece of syria. >> i guess we'll continue to be asking this question for a long time, but why does he want to do these things for vladimir putin? >> this is the more than $64 million question. maybe this is the $10 billion question if that's what donald trump is really worth, though i doubt it. clearly he has business interests. clearly putin has something on donald trump. but the other thing, and i hate to say this, is donald trump really believes in strongmen. he believes that the president should have unbridled powers. his attorney general, william barr, believes the president
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should have unbridled powers. and secretary pompeo, who just gave a speech before it was pulled down, was headlined on the website for being a good christian on a government website. i'm all for christianity and christian values but totally inappropriate for a secretary of state. so the president of the united states likes strongmen. he wants to be vladimir putin, and clearly vladimir putin has something on donald trump. >> ambassador wendy sherman, thank you so much for joining us. i really appreciate it. when we come back, we have breaking news from ft. worth tonight. the police officer who shot and killed a 28-year-old woman in her own home while she was playing video games with her eight-year-old nephew. that police officer has tonight been arrested and charged with murder. we'll have more on these late developments next. next.
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breaking news, aaron dean, police officer who shot and killed 28-year-old tatiana jefferson in her home in ft. worth, texas, was arrested tonight and charged with murder. at 2:25 a.m. on sunday morning, resident of ft. worth, it can, called the nonemergency police hotline after noticing that his neighbor's door had been left open. within minutes of that call, the man's name, 28-year-old tatiana jefferson was shot and killed in
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her own home by officer aaron dean. tatiana jefferson was playing video games at the time with her 8-year-old nephew. officer dean entered her yard through an open gate, approached the window of her home and, without identifying himself as a police officer, shouted put your hands up. show me your hands. before then firing a single shot. less than two seconds later. that shot killed tatiana anderson right in front of her 8-year-old nephew. body camera captured video. we'll show you a portion of that video now. we will warn you, you may find some of this video disturbing. you won't see the actual shooting on that th video but here is that body cam video.
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>> put your hands up. show me your hands. fast moving day in the breaking news of this case, ending with the arrest of officer dean. the officer resigned before the department could take any action to fire him. it is an american way of death. unarmed black person committing no crime, shot and killed by police. we have never before seen a case where the unarmed black person is a woman, playing video games with her 8-year-old nephew in her own home. mark claxton has seen a lot. he has never seen a case exactly like this one, a former new york
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city police detective, the director of the black law enforcement alliance. he will join us after this break. us after this break. sending her daughter to the music school of her dreams. and you help her turn it into reality. principal. we can help you plan for that. start today at at first slice pizza lovers everywhere meet o, that's good! frozen pizza one third of our classic crust is made with cauliflower but that's not stopping anyone o, that's good! i am totally blind. and non-24 can make me show up too early... or too late. or make me feel like i'm not really "there." talk to your doctor, and call 844-234-2424.
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laundry isn't done until it's done with downy. darius carr serves in the military station in san diego. he rushed to ft. worth as soon as he heard that a ft. worth police officer had shot and killed his sister in her own home while she was playing video games with her 8-year-old nephew. here is darius carr today before that officer was arrested and charged with murder. >> my name is darius carr, currently stationed in san diego. i served my country for the last 12 years. in that time, i've been trained and taught, there are preplanned responses to everything you do. everything you're trained about, there's a way to do things. when you don't do it the way you've been trained, the way you've been taught, you have to answer for that.
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this man murdered someone. he should be arrested. >> joining us now is mark claxton, retired nypd police detective and director of the black law enforcement alliance. mark, i can't say -- it's always something like this that brings you back to the show to discuss this, with your expertise. but what darius car just said seems to be the important note of the day. this was a rookie cop, apparently less than two years experience on the force and you can see in that video, he's not following what he was trained to do in a situation like that. >> yeah. yeah. and regardless of -- even the response. let me just say, lawrence, the response to this incident, to this tragedy, to this killing has been somewhat unusual. there's been a significant shift in responding to these type of incidence from government, administrative, managers, mayor, police department, et cetera.
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however, as the brother points out, until we deal with the issue of national professionals, national standards, holding your professionals accountable and responsible for adhering to those standards you can't possibly hope to avoid these type of tragedies. you must also begin to deal realistically and honestly with the relationship between law enforcement and race. there's a dynamic that irrefutable, unavoidable. >> is that dynamic, racial dynamic, addressed in training? >> there's minimal address of the racial dynamic in training. more recently, agencies have gone to dealing with or attempting to deal with what
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they call implicit bias training. however, baked into law enforcement strategies across this nation are race-based, race-driven initiatives that prove to increase the interactions between black and brown communities and police agencies. it's baked into the enforcement strategies in many agencies across this nation. you look, for example, in the dynamic that existed in new york city with stop and frisk. it existed many other large cities with stop and giricek policies that they have. explicit bias into race-based enforcement it's a recipe for disaster and tragedy. time and time again i've come here and we have had discussions about these types of incidents. they are absolutely avoidable and it's necessary for us to
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address the role that race plays in law enforcement. >> marq claxton gets the last word tonight. thank you for joining us. appreciate it. >> thank you, lawrence. >> that's "the last word." "the 11th hour with brian williams" starts now. tonight, new reporting that says some of this nation's most powerful prosecutors are collecting documents on a man who was once among the nation's most powerful prosecutors. now he happens to be rudy giuliani. plus, another witness, another former insider tells congress over another marathon session what she knows and what she saw from inside the west wing regarding giuliani's shadow foreign policy in ukraine. also tonight there's a new attempt to fix the brutal turkish military campaign, an attempt to cover the american forces who have been ordered to retreat. all of it, of course, the result of one trump phone call and the green light it conveyed as "the 11th


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