tv Countdown With Keith Olbermann MSNBC August 14, 2009 1:00am-2:00am EDT
doesn't the white house have to be very worried about dealing with senator grassley now? >> if his view is he put his finger in the dike, that doesn't seem to be in a good position. that sounds like the dam is about to break. we don't know what his position is when he's negotiating behind closed doors and what he's doing trying to play to the crowd. there's an inside game and outside game. we don't know how large the gap is. >> roger simon, did that sound like an iowa senator in iowa saying what his audience wants to hear ready to go back to washington and work hard on health care reform? >> it sounds to me like an iowa politician playing to the crowd. iowa, in terms of the age of its population is one of the oldest states of the union, and one of the highest percentages of people who live in care facilities. seniors, 65 and over is the one
age group that barack obama did not carry. one reason is it's the most resistant group to change, which is obama's central message. people out there have their medicare and they're worried about anything changes that. we're only a few days from the 20th anniversary of the famous senior citizen riot in chicago, where danny rostokowski was chased down the streets by senior citizens, because he was trying to raise the cost for an added benefit that they didn't want. it didn't go through. it's very easy to scare seniors. chuck grassley doesn't need to do it to get reelected next year. >> roger, we're going to have to leave it there. thank you. join us again tomorrow night at
5:00 and 7:00 eastern for more "hardball." "countdown with keith olbermann" starts now. which of these stories will you be talking about tomorrow? congratulations, chuck grassley, you just denied counseling to grievously ill people and their heartbroken families. if they want end of life care advice now, they will have to pay for it themselves. it is out of the bill. grassley now boasts he exploited the bipartisan negotiations just long enough to push the health care vote beyond the august recess to enable the chaotic perverted paranoid death panel talk to unfold. congratulations, senator. you just saved the insurance company millions. millions taken out pockets of the people of your state and the
people of your age. palin the pathetic refutates her brief visit to reality. she says there were two death panels and that they were orwellian like she knows what that means. april 2008 governor sarah palin proclaimed health care decisions day in alaska to raise public awareness of the need to plan ahead for health care decisions, and another genius chimes in. >> i think it is proper because it is within the context of what people are seeing in front of the legislation that's floating around out there. >> the lessons of the republican hit job using stupid people to scare other stupid people. with eugene robinson, the lessons of pointless bipartisanship, senator grassley using inclusion to force exclusion with howard dean, bush v. cheney. the statute of limitations expired on what the ex-v.p. wants to dish like when the president made decisions that i
didn't agree with, i still supported him and didn't go out and undercut him. he thinks bush went soft and is going to tell all in his book. so reports bar don gelman of "the washington post," our special guest tonight. plus, john dean on why cheney may be admitting he ran the bush administration. and bush v. gore. publicly addressed by the secretary of state in nigeria. >> in 2000, our presidential election came down to one state where the brother of the man running for president was the brother of the stay. we have our problems, too. >> and limbaugh whines he was compared to nazis and then a moment later compares his critics to nazis. all that and more now on "countdown." good evening from new york. at some point in the future you or a loved one will be dying. you will want to know all the options and their implications. thanks to the republican party today, sarah palin, senator chuck grassley and others, thanks to them, if you cannot
afford to have your doctor at your side for those questions, you will face death on your own. how sarah palin's functional illiteracy and senator's dysfunctional pandering just killed reimbursement for end of life counseling. senator grassley, top republican of the finance committee put out a statement today saying, quote, we dropped end of life provisions from consideration entirely because of the way they could be misinterpreted. misinterpreted, of course, by him. deliberately to his constituents. on tape. as, quote, death panels. quoting the aarp a sensationalized misinterpretation of a common sense compassionate and bipartisan measure. a misinterpretation that the gop has happily and enthusiasticall endorsed. >> i just wanted to get your reaction to some of the --
co-party members, former alaska governor palin who called the panels dispensing care and deciding, death panels. is that proper, is that right? >> i think it is -- i think it is proper because it is within the context of what people are seeing in some of the legislation that is floating around out there. >> death panels, key issue pier and furry around the town panels. a goal senator grassley was pursuing even while pretending talking bipartisanship. >> if i had not been at the table there would have been a bill -- committee the week of june 22nd and without it have been through the senate by now because of 60 democrats. so i think that i have by sticking my finger in the dook, i have had an opportunity to give the grassroots of america an opportunity to speak up and as you are seeing every day on television and i think that -- i think that that's -- i think that's a good thing. >> stick your finger somewhere else and see if your honesty is stuck there. woman that trumped up death panel, a lengthy for her defensive. with footnotes. she had mott just screwed over dying people it would be almost funny.
on health care decisions day in skwa ask a last year governor palin proclaimed her goal was to -- now she blogs section 1233 of the house bill, subsection hhh requires consultations. practitioners must explain the continuum of end of life services and cites "the washington post" editorial opinion that says the same thing. unless you can actually read, section 1233 does say, quote, such consultation shall include the following. listing all of the end of life stuff but what consultation shall include the following turns out section 1233 is just amending a section 1861 of the social security act which is just a list of definition. so in this panel, when it says such consultation shall include the following, it does not mean doctors have to include the following in their consultations. it means that the definition of reimbursed advanced care consultation includes any of the following. got it? on the subsection hhh in your footnote, it does not exist. see any quote marks?
the bill is quoting a hope thet cal subsection that it would add to the existing social security law. good thing do you not have a job where you need to know stuff like this. right? this panel and also quotes jean robinson of "the washington post" who presently will tell us the sentence miss palin chose not to quote from his piece, pair now yeah, if it is all about obviating suffering, emotional or physical, what's it doing in mesh a measure to bend
the health care costs? reimbursing doctors for the counseling gives them financial incentive to counsel patients to kill themselves. point of fact. end of life directives save money, unquote. newt gingrich said that. point of logic, if your patients kill themselves, you stop making money off them. as promised, "washington post" associate editor, eugene robinson joins us now. good evening. so sarah palin quotes your column. the quote she used citizens are not dilution alto conclude the goal is to conclude end of life spending. if you read the sentence that she left out. >> yes. the sentence in the same column, immediately following, is, quote, it is irresponsible for politicians such as sarah palin to claim outlandishly and falsely that there's going to be some kind of death panel to decide when to pull the plug on aunt sylvia. yes, sarah palin somehow is --
bolstering her argument on death panels by quoting a column of mine that calls her out by name specifically as outlandish, false, and irresponsible for making up this whole death panel canard. >> intellectual dishonesty. moving on, the point of what she wrote seemed to be that the president made a strategic mistake by linking reform of health care to cost cutting and that that linkage, however tenuous it was and theoretical, opened the door for grassley and palin and others to obfuscate and obfuscate successfully today. >> yes. i questioned that strategy or at least how it was carried out tactically. because it seemed to me to have
created an opening for the likes of palin and grassley and the -- and the town hall meeting. if you say we are -- we have to reduce health care costs and you say we want to encourage end of life counseling which absolutely, by the way, we should encourage and medicare should pay for it. you know how difficult these -- that time of life is. you just lost your mother, keith. i lost my father in january. it is a wrenching decision that families have to make. and it is so much better if they are thought about beforehand. and so absolutely medicare should pay. but if those two concepts are allowed to be linked, cut costs, talk about what to do at the end of life, it does create an
opening for demagoguery, frankly. that's what has been going on. >> what will it say about democrats at this point if they accept exclusions like what grassley and baucus pulled off which they are no -- know are based on bull crap? >> it will -- well, what will it say about democrats? it will say that there is not yet -- it is awfully late in the day -- a unified coherent democratic vision of exactly what the health care reform package is supposed to look at. and i think, frankly, that -- president obama, while he has gotten -- he would say 70% of the -- by essentially allowing congress to do it, and see what they come up with, i really think he needs to help define it. and -- you know, we are at the point where congress is going in all its different directions and now with the recess and the town halls, it is -- it seems the
debate is a bit out of hand. >> eugene robinson, msnbc political analyst, "washington post." gene, thanks for your time tonight. >> great to be here. at the white house briefing today, mr. gibbs refused to take the bait when senator degreesly's suggestion about the death panel was dangled before him. with us on the political panel, dr. vermont governor howard dean. also serving as and consultant, providing guidance to clients particularly in home health care and alternative energy resources. governor, good evening. >> thanks for having me on, keith. as a result of filling in for you two weeks ago, whatever you get paid it is not enough. >> mr. obama has spoken about not making the mistakes the clintons made. we saw chuck grassley bury a provision, based it on a lie pushed by sarah palin but originally written by betsy mccoy, same big shil disdecreeded lies got the first reform killed while the clintons were in power. how is mr. obama doing any
better at this point? >> first of all, i don't think grassley has p power to bury anything. the way the republicans are behaving they are digging themselves deeper into a hole and playing to the base. the trouble is their base is shrinking and nobody cares if you are under 35 and voted 3% for barack obama about what the republicans have to say because they are becoming increasingly irrelevant. so i don't -- chuck grassley is probably not going to have a vote that matters at tend of it because the republicans aren't going to play. >> are the end of life provisions going to be in this bill? is this just the first thing they cut out? >> no, they will be in the bill. it has nothing do with death panels. they are making that up. i think at the end of the day you have to have a decent bill and that's part of it. >> is this -- i -- i don't know if there is a word that characterize it is last week and a half of death panelitis and paranoia that has managed to damage something had a would benefit so many people who are yelling about it as if it were a
gunshot threat. i don't know what we are -- word describes that. is it necessary to this process or was the correct move in retrospect taking input from the gop at the beginning and then writing a good bill and telling them vote for it or not, bringing it to a vote before this august dog and pony show can be conducted around the country. >> i don't think a dog and pony show is all bad. people are angry. they are mott just angry about health care and they, frankly, most don't know what's in the health care bill. what they have been told is totally untrue. but they are angry because it is a recession going on. i would venture to guess 90% of the people shaking their fists and shouting down didn't vote for obama in first place a generational change going on in the country and the folks that are uncomfortable with it. look, i -- it is not obama's fault. he tried to get the gop to cooperate. they are not interested in cooperating. chuck grassley bragged that he is sending the bill to the bottom and he is one of the guys supposedly. this is -- it is not going to
work. we have to pass this thing with a big majority of the american people gave us and this vote of the minority will have to custom itself to the change. they will because an awful lot of them are already on a governor-run program. it is called medicare and they like it. >> we kept hearing what a brawler the chief of staff would be, rahm emanuel in that position as he has been in so many others. betsy mccoy dragged his brother into this, the doctor. dr. emanuel into this. why is there not more dukes up quality of this in the white house? the press secretary was very cautious about what he said today about senator grassley. >> i think these guys are digging themselves as deep hole and will encourage their base and base will get all -- their sbas getting smaller and smaller and smaller. i think it is -- you know, they are doing themselves enormous damage for their future. and, frankly the smart thing do is step out of the way and let them keep doing this. nobody really truthfully, except for the most faithful of the far right, believes there is a death
panel in this bill. nobody believes that. and the more they talk like this, the harder it will be to convince anybody there is substance to their proposal. >> shouldn't there be somebody out there handing out pieces of paper that has sarah palin's name it in which she declared a day devoted to the things she is calling a death panel now a year and a half ago? shouldn't that be the approach at these town halls? shouldn't there be something more organized by the democrats? >> i think people are speaking up. when they get a chance to get a word in edgewise at the town hall, that's great. the truth is that -- just ask you, frankly, do you think sarah palin has any chance of getting elected president of the united states? i don't. she can get the nomination but she will get 40% of the vote. >> i would agree with you in terms of forecasting. i'm just more worried about what somebody who has a certain cache to them, whether it is positive or negative, can do to people who don't understand and it are scared. >> here is the danger. the danger is that they further divide the country, convince this 39% or whatever it is that
they really are being screwed and the government is coming after them in every possible way. and that does lead to problems. there's no question that leads to problems. the end of the day, this is a short-term political tactic to embarrass obama by beating the health care bill. i don't think lit work. i think it will cost the republicans a great deal by 2012. >> governor, thank you. if you could send me an e-mail on that salary point i could forward to my boss, i would appreciate it and i will give you a cut. howard dean, thanks. if you ever got the impression the previous vice president of the united states was convinced all around him were soft, wishy-washy to the apocalyptic terror that would come in the morning you are underestimating it. insight into dick cheney's memoirs includes this astounding conclusion. bush had gone soft on him. what "the washington post" gelman learned about what might actually be dick cheney's tell-all autobiography and john dean's assessment of how this changes our investigation of that administration. investigators of another kind have begging for an utterly different kind of revelation.
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did you know that in his second term president bush went soft? in this universe, dick cheney think it is true and writes so in his ought biography. the reporter that broke that story, gel sxhan it is terrifying by forensically invaluable. videotape surfaced of the crash of a sightseeing helicopter over the hudson river. we will show it to you ahead on msnbc. tell-all books, in the midst of writing one. once a power senator in his own right but complained about how and when that all changed. dick cheney's disappointment with george w. bush and bush's break with him has fueled cheney's willingness to write about it. all about it. new details from one of the informal gatherings, former vice president has been holding to discuss his upcoming memoir according to "the washington post," gelman who will join us in a moment. in the second term he felt bush was moving away from him and in the recent gathering. bush was shackled by the criticism he took. and it may soon be directed at bush. quoting again from the article. cheney has said without explanation that the statute of limitations has expired on many of his secrets. when the president made decisions i didn't agree with, i didn't go out and undercut him. let's bring in national reporter and author of angler of the cheney vice presidency, in paperback later this month, barton gellman. is there far more to it than that. >> sure. cheney's not so much about keeping score or taking credit. hay is a guy that cares about outcomes. let's assume the universe in which cheney appeared on your show. he would say to you don't you acknowledge that there is a
possibility that terrorists will acquire nuclear weapons and no hesitation in using them. once you can see that -- what wouldn't you take the gloves off for if it wasn't for that? where would -- where would you not say you -- use harsh interrogation measures on terrorists or look for a way to topple the regimes in iran and north korea? he thought he had george bush convinced of this. and bush walked away from it in the second term. it gets more personal than that, however, because cheney is saying bush did so for the wrong reasons. when he describes bush as caring too much about public opinions, that's a cardinal sin in cheney's world. people who seek after popularity, who -- change their mind in response to polls, show resolve. those are people that are -- are
morally lacking at and point. dick cheney is an anti-politician a guy that thinks that -- unpopularity in the service of the right policy is a badge of honor. >> are there any indications -- did you get any indications at this point what specifically he thinks bush did or did not do or is it still in those generalized sort of being responsive to the american public? >> look, dick cheney is not a guy that spills his guts in even in small group, private meetings. it is surprising and unusual he said as much as he did. the question was about rexwrets he, cheney, had and regret was bush walked away.
the subjects we know that he was unhappy with were there was no more waterboarding, no more secret prisons, there were -- there was a decision to go to congress for permission to do domestic surveillance which cheney didn't think a president needed. there was a decision to engage diplomatically with iran and north korea and to give them small carrots that cheney didn't think they deserved when the whole game for cheney was keeping unrelenting pressure on those governments in hopes that they would fall. >> the statute of limitations expired on many of cheney's secrets. from that do you infer that this book would be filled with detail, the kind which we would
not expect from cheney? >> well, i sure hope so. i would buy that book. >> all right. >> i'm all for openness. the -- look, he needs -- meteaphorcally in context that -- you know, the game is played, the -- the decisions are done. and it is okay to talk about it now. this is a departure from his old view that i memoirs were inherently self-serving and damaging to the process of government because a president had to believe and his advisers had to believe in order to foster a candidate debate that what happened in the oval office stayed in the oval office and dick cheney is going to talk about that. how far he goes? i don't know. what i do know is that he is being fairly open in his private talks now about his disagreements and his legness to describe those. >> any sense of any -- any contradiction within the former vice president about being over,
enough, to have memoirs written but not be over enough for him to have shifted from any of his positions? presumably you would not want to write about any of these things you thought were so tightly important and not being done unless they had somehow lessened, unless that threat had become less immediate, don't you think? >> well, i don't -- i'm not on the -- i don't know definitely how he would see that and he -- he has -- he cares about affecting the debate. he cares about shifting policy. he is not moving into this sort of statesman-like above the fray self re-reflective way many politicians do in memoirs. he wants to convince us he was right and his legacy needs to carry on. >> bar don gellman of "the washington post," extraordinary story and something to look forward to for historians in the making. thanks for your time tonight. implications of all this and
our understanding of the crimes of the bush/cheney administration or cheney/bush, john dean joins me. chicago, hospitable place. you are from out of town. have a beer. what's now happened after this incident, late-breaking developments. there has been an arrest. i'm racing cross country in this small sidecar, but i've still got room for the internet. with my new netbook from at&t. with its built-in 3g network, it's fast and small, so it goes places other laptops can't. i'm bill kurtis, and wherever i go, i've got plenty of room for the internet. and the nation's fastest 3g network. gun it, mick. (announcer) sign up today and get a netbook for $199.99 after mail-in rebate. with built-in access to the nation's fastest 3g network. only from at&t.
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why did people have to ruin the portrait of that nice squirrel? phoebe anne mosey. sharpshooter anny oakley. whose aim was so precise while entertaining royalty she shot the ash off the cigarette of the german prince wilhelm. if she missed hitting him in the ash and somewhere else she may have prevented the first world war.
at wrigley field, chicago. the chicago cubs chairman apologized to the center field for this incident. bottom of the fifth inning last night, a ball hit to deep center, victorino retreated to the warning track and as the ball reached his glove, a fan chucked a beer on his head. right there. victorino made the play but security fingered the wrong guy and ejected the wrong guy. if you look again, it was not the cubs fan, cubs jersey. the guy in the white shirt a few seats down and who tossed his cold one and dpass an assault charge and this man seen in "the chicago tribune" graphic has, after a few hours as a fugitive, today turned himself in to the police. his name, dr. richard kimball. innocent victim of blind faith. they haven't released the guy's name. this is not first time this happened. mott even in chicago. 1959 world series, al smith of
the white sox retreat order a home run by charlie neil of the dodgers and a fan accidentally bumped his suds as the ball sailed into the crowd. no charges filed. the moment was captured by an associated press photographer named charles e. chuck knoblauch. janesville, wisconsin, security video of a guy with a blue bandanna over his face. his hand in his pants pretending to have a gun allegedly trying to knock over this bar. this bar filled with 20 off-duty policemen. in fact the whole town was filled with policemen there for a charity golf outing. the robber was you subdued by the men in blue. 18-year-old ruker was charged with one count of disorderly conduct and one count of not reading the janesville, wisconsin, community calendar. why the second bush administration might have been scarier than the first. john dean's read on cheney revelation promise. in nigeria the secretary of state warns of the growing pains of young democracies like the
2000 election. our 2000 election. number three, best news decision, john klein, president of cnn, says he will ban radio talk show hosts as guests and because what they say is all too predictable. much of what they had is noise. should be an industry wide standard. date line anchorage, jer el paul arnold, fbi says mr. arnold walked into a bank friday, asked about the balance in his account and the teller asked for his name, account number, i.d., which he provided. only then did mr. arnold hand the teller a note saying he had a gun and demanding money. mr. arnold sunday arrest and presumably still wondering how on earth they knew it was him. british columbia, canada. number one, best photo from vacation. melissa brandts. that's her in the middle. far right is her husband.
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dick cheney's ultimate break with george w. bush and before that the nation's gross excesses in national security warrantless wiretapping secret prisons, gitmo. our third story, mr. cheney's attitude about national security, inflectionible paranoid mind of view. john dean joins me in a moment. reavis itting "the washington
post" piece, john p. anna, second term national security adviser, said the former vice president is driven now as before by the nightmare of a hostile state acquiring nuclear weapons and passing them to terrorists. as promised let's turn to finelaw.com columnist, john dean. good evening. >> good evening. >> mr. cherry has a unique grasp of this. is that how he sees this scenario from what we can dedeuce from the "post" piece? >> well, i think he's always seen himself as exceptional but exception is that he has been able to get in the big jobs and fail in those jobs. you look at his job as -- work
as white house chief of staff and look at his position as the gop leader in the congress. and you look at his work as secretary of defense. look at his work at halliburton and now you look at his work as vice president and you will see a steady path of failure. and the only person that seems to understand this are -- those who are not dick cheney and his -- immediate aides but the rest of the world looks closely at that record. >> is he going to paint himself into something of a corner here? to save the world from the vice presidency of the united states is an impossibility. does he not have to admit in this book if he is going to go will to use that cliche, that he ran the bush administration? will he have to 'fess up he is in charge for the four years and then mr. bush gave up on him for some reason? >> well, i don't think that even if he does say that he was running the white house for all practical purposes in the first term which i think is pretty true, that he saved the world. he left the world under much
rougher shape as a result of his policies. he has become something of the poster boy in his policies for recruiting terrorism leaving us in much worse condition than before 9/11. >> normally central players won't admit their influence in excessive policy and the list is extraordinary that they go through in success. wiretaps, torture. that, too, is apparently going to be turn order its head in this because cheney has, what no apology and believes nothing is necessary and no explanation is necessary beyond this absolute certitude that he and he alone knows the consequences of not breaking laws? >> it is going to be very interesting to see how he handles this. had is all about a self-confessed war criminal.
and i don't think that at this point given the fact he has broken the fisa law and many statutes and treaties and that he created executive theory he pushed out, and i don't think that john yu and david adding ton's legal opinions are going to cut it anymore. he will have fancy explanations to offer us. >> cheney does want to write about personal feelings as if those were beneath him but might animate the book whether he realizes it or not. my unified dick cheney theory has always been somewhere deep inside he knows he missed 9/11. he knows he missed it while too busy looking at iraq. therefore, he must believe he alone saved us from worse and must believe 9/11 had something to do with iraq. do you have a unified dick cheney theory? >> i sort of do. i have always seen him as sort of doing for george bush what mcvely did for the prince. to show him how to corrupt power. i don't think that dick chainy an evil person.
i they hoo he did evil, however. i'm not sure how he will work his way out of this in a memoir. so i'm one of those anxious to see what he has to say. >> richard nixon, as you know, tried to work his way -- i guess to some degree was at least marginally successful in a memoir. is that plausible with dick cheney? >> i suppose it is. but -- you know, there are -- a large segment of the american public who -- i call authoritarian conservatives. these people, about 25% of the american people, who like dick cheney and so he will have a big audience for this book. that's it. that's the rest of the people aren't going to buy into this. >> except those -- unless he reveals he threw himself on a ticking bomb and blew up underneath him and he was all right. john dean. great thanks, john. >> thank you. if you think cheney feels liberated to talk the way he wants about jordan w. bush, wait until you hear the secretary of state's remarks about the former president in nigeria. the evidence the national transportation safety board has been hoping somebody had somebody did have. we will show you the video
obtained exclusively by msnbc news of the helicopter plane crash over new york saturday. when rachel joins us, she and her special guest bernie sanders will reveal who these astroturfers at the town halls actually are. than a comparable honda civic. his chevy traverse has better mileage than honda pilot. the all-new chevy equinox has better mileage than honda cr-v. and chevy malibu has better mileage than accord. however, honda does make something that we just can't compete with. it's self-propelled. there's never been more reasons to look at chevy. kelly saunder's nature valley. ♪ the place that inspires her to go faster... ♪
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tylenol works with your body... in a way other pain relievers don't... so you feel better... knowing doctors recommend tylenol... more than any other brand of pain reliever. one prospective silver lining national transportation safety board says there may be another person with a camera pointing towards the accident. it proves there was. not a regular subject matter here but we will show you this with a warning it is as disturbing as you can imagine. but in that lies its value as a forensic tool and our reason for showing it. the video has been obtained exclusively by nbc news and recorded by in a deep and painful irony another tourist from italy on a boat near the statue of liberty.
here is the videotape. >> oh, my gosh. oh, my gosh. >> you saw the helicopter, camera right, small plane coming in from the left, instantaneous disaster. the plane may have been in the blind spot. unable to see the helicopter because of the wings of his own plane. the worst possible spot. it would have crippled the copter immediately and the video shows it sheered off the plane's right wing. former investigator for the national transportation safety board says something must have distracted the pilot long enough that he didn't realize he obstructed the flight path. flying without instruction or guidance from any air traffic controllers. hillary clinton coming up. worst person next on
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>> secretary clinton invokes our 2000 presidential election as a warning to young democracies all around the world. that's next. but first, count down's number two stories, today's worst persons in the world. the coultergeist, totally ironically, on my death list, hold the applause, i'm going to be on the death panel. she did make kind of a death threat against dr. emanuel. dr. emanuel should want to be on the coulter death list. hell, i volunteered. this is what any learned at the new cornell. the runner-up, congressman republican john micah of
florida. he told a florida radio station, quote, they create a whole new category. they're death counselors. you have a whole new cottage industry, death counselors. that's one of these whack job republicans would claim the bill would fund democratic death eaters. but the worst, rush limbaugh. i'm not going to sit here and take it anymore. i'm not going to sit here and sit idly by while a bunch of fascists try to impugn mainstream conservativism rooted in the founding of this country. that was quote number one. minutes later, quote number two. if you want to do a comparison, just take this health care bill, if you want to do a comparison, you want to do a comparison between the people pushing it and the people opposing it, to national socialism in germany, it ain't a contest.
the people pushing this health care bill have much more in common with the people of germany than any of us have. if somebody where to compare rush limbaugh to the nazis, that would be a crime. and he's not going to sit there and take it anymore. but rush limbaugh is entitled to compare health care reformers to national socialism, the nazis, national socialists of germany, whatever he likes. just so we understand each other here. these are rush limbaugh's rules. rules you need when you do not have the intellectual or political chops. and not enough of a grown-up to defend a position without first tilting the playing field entirely in your own direction. this has a name. the name is cowardice. limbaugh, you are a coward.
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it happened at a town hall. all right, let's just discontinue town halls, forever. for everybody. a cautionary tale to fledgling democracies. remember the lessons learned from past elections. remember, like that one time that one guy got more votes, but the other guy got to be president and the other guy's brother was running the state where the ballots were counted. a slight twist on this. town hall was in nigeria and person issue the warning was secretary of state hillary clinton. mrs. clinton in the midst of a sojourn through africa stopping by nigeria discussing the developing nation's upcoming elections with civil activists. she used the 2008 election in this country as an example of
how democracy should work. she said, i know a little bit about running elections, i have won some elections and i have lost some elections. in my country the man i was running against spent a lot of time trying to defeat to join his government. there is a way to make this transition to lead to free and fair elections in nigeria. 2008 was not the only u.s. election that could provide a teachable moment to nigeria, she thought. >> our democracy is still evolving. we had all kinds of problems in some of our past elections, as you might remember. in 2000, our presidential election came down to one state where the brother of the man running for president was the governor of the state. so we have our problems, too. >> a spokesperson for that man in the middle, former florida governor, jeb bush, offering this reaction.
governor bush is declining to weigh in on these ill-advised comments, but wishing secretary clinton a safe and successful trip. joining me now, bloomberg news, washington editor for "the week," margaret carlson. >> good evening. >> even though former governor bush gave a measured response, the right is predictably piling on these comments from hillary clinton. might this be a case of you only get attacked when you speak the truth? >> well, you get attacked in august when you speak at all, it seems. and isn't it curious that in nigeria, at a town hall, in the land of the prince and princesses who want us to send them $100,000 so they might claim their inheritance, that they have town halls where you can actually speak. that was one of the heartening things about nigeria. did you notice, keith, the body language of mrs. clinton in that clip that you showed in which she kept patting her heart or something, she seemed very nervous as she was making the reference to 2000 now, i think
it was a bridge too far. if mrs. clinton had stopped, secretary clinton had stopped, with "yes, we have problems of our own," which i think is a good thing, that this president and others have said, listen, america is not perfect, we have our problems, we are trying to take responsibility for them, improve them, make life better here. i think that's a healing process for this country. however, to name the bushes, i think, might have been just a bit too much. leave it at, "yes, we have problems in our elections." and indeed, we do. look at minnesota. how long did it take to name senator franken senator franken? months and months and months. because the closer the elections are, the more we find out that our electoral system or our system of counting is not perfect. we are not perfect when there is a negligible difference between the two candidates.