>> announcer: from 30 rockefeller plaza in new york, it's "late night with seth meyers." tonight -- keri russell, star of "the catch", actor peter krause, author, j.d. vance, featuring the 8g band with nicko mcbrain. ♪ [ cheers and applause ] ladies and gentlemen, seth meyers. >> seth: good evening. i'm seth meyers. this is "late night." how's everybody doing tonight? [ cheers and applause ] fantastic to hear. in that case, let's get to the news. last night, rachel maddow aired an exclusive report on how to stretch out an hour. [ light laughter ] who produced that segment, ryan seacrest? [ laughter ] we'll find out the punchline to this joke -- after the break.

[ laughter ] rachel maddow aired an exclusive report last night uncovering a portion of president trump's 2005 tax return. specifically the part where he claimed ivanka and donald jr. as dependents, and tried to write off eric as a loss. [ laughter and applause ] maddow also reported last night that president trump claimed over $100 million in business losses in 2005. how do you lose $100 million in 2005? did you buy stock in heidi montag? [ laughter ] in this day in history, julius caesar was stabbed by his own senators. so if i were trump i'd watch out for -- eh, he'll be fine. [ laughter ] according to a new report from the department of health and human services, 2017 has marked the first ever decline in signups for obamacare. because frankly, it seems like obama don't. [ laughter ]

today was justice ruth bader ginsburg's 84th birthday. i don't know how she celebrated, but i hope it was carefully. [ laughter and applause ] stay safe out there. according to politico, white house staffers are scared of the hostile environment around the west wing. and terrified of the thing that's been lurking around the east wing. [ laughter ] "can i come to the west wing father?" [ laughter ] the lottery for free tickets to president trump's first white house easter egg roll is launching tomorrow. but heads up, parents, the bunnies have changed. [ laughter and applause ] "there's an egg. there's an egg." according to a new study, four in five elementary students in oklahoma city cannot read a clock. four in five is also what time they think it is. [ laughter ] according to a new report, the

main ingredient in the widely-used weed killer roundup could cause cancer. okay, but that seems like a really slow way to kill weeds. [ light laughter ] get your affairs in order, weeds. [ laughter ] a new study found that dogs are capable of lying. and the most common one is, "it's fine. i'm neutered." [ laughter ] ladies and gentlemen, we have a great show for you tonight. [ cheers and applause ] she is the star of fx's "the americans." one of your favorites, keri russell is back on the show. [ cheers and applause ] from abc's "the catch", he's a fantastic actor. peter krause joins us. very excited for that. [ cheers and applause ] and he wrote an incredible memoir. "hillbilly elegy" author j.d. vance joins us to talk about this really fantastic book. [ cheers and applause ] before we get to that, as we've seen repeatedly over the last few months, when the trump administration is confronted with facts that don't support

their agenda, they try to discredit the sources of those facts. and right now, they're using that same strategy on healthcare. for more on this, it's time for, "a closer look." ♪ [ cheers and applause ] >> seth: of course, since basically the beginning of his campaign, trump has tried to undermine the press as a source of information. in fact, even when he's making small talk with world leaders, he can't help but make sarcastic comments about the media. on tuesday, he held a photo op in the oval office with the crown prince of saudi arabia and it was super awkward >> very nice people. >> we hope so. >> seth: are you guys in the white house, or on a terrible first date? [ laughter ] "do you always wear that thing on your head?" "i do. do you always wear that thing on your head?" [ laughter and applause ] of course --

of course, trump dislikes the media. because they often report basic facts that challenge his world view. for the same reason, his administration now dislikes the congressional budget office, which released a damning report on the republican healthcare plan on monday that projected the bill would cause a stunning 24 million americans to lose coverage. now, that might seem like a disaster, but house speaker paul ryan actually tried to spin it as a positive. prompting skepticism even from straight-laced fox news anchor bret baier. >> if you read this entire report, i'm pretty encouraged by it. i'm excited about this analysis and i'm really actually, frankly, encouraged. >> mr. speaker, if you're encouraged by this cbo report, what's a cbo report you're discouraged by? [ laughter ] >> seth: that's the closest bret baier has ever come to saying, "bye, felicia." [ light laughter ] also, paul ryan, you're encouraged that 24 million people will be thrown off their insurance? is that really the word you want to use or are you thinking of a different e-word? >> excellent. >> seth: there it is. [ laughter ] so how can paul ryan's say he's encouraged by this report?

well, he makes several misleading claims. for example, ryan says the report confirms that the bill will lower premiums, which is technically true, but only for young healthy people. older people would see their premiums skyrocket. in fact, the cbo report finds that the average 64-year-old earning $26,500 would see their premiums go up from $1,700 to $14,600 a year. so get ready to start running into your grandpa working at subway. "when i was a kid, 12-inch italians weren't even allowed in the country." [ laughter ] so paul ryan has chosen the strategy of trying to make the cbo report sound positive. and what about trump and his surrogates? they're just saying we shouldn't believe the cbo at all. like cnn commentator and trump supporter jeffery lord, who tried to discredit the cbo report by making an analogy that didn't quite hold up. >> we don't know what the weather's going to be. it was gonna snow, but how much? i mean, we don't know. we don't trust weathermen, you know? so why should we trust the cbo? >> seth: all right, so first of all, the reason we don't trust weather men is because they have names like dallas rains, or

storm tornado. [ laughter ] and second of all, in this analogy, if the cbo is the weatherman, then that makes donald trump this kid. >> dew point's in the 20s and near 30 degrees across central mississippi -- well hey, there. >> i don't know what's going on but they gotta know. are you sure? are you crazy sure? >> well -- [ laughter ] we've got a little bit of an interesting things going on right now. take a look at what's going on right now. you want to point out the weather right now? >> yeah, there are farts everywhere, and toots, i don't know. it's crazy -- [ laughter and applause ] >> seth: you can laugh -- you can laugh, but donald trump just made that kid secretary of weather. [ laughter ] and then yesterday, a white house spokesman/hostage sean spicer -- [ light laughter ] also tried to discredit the cbo report. spicer tried to claim that the new gop bill was only the first part of a three-part healthcare plan. meaning the cbo's report was inaccurate, because it didn't take no account future legislation that doesn't exist

yet. and he kept using one word in particular. r >> the comprehensive nature of this three pronged plan. in prongs two and three. doing the first prong of this. on first prong alone. prong one of three prongs. but the second prong of this. so prong two is actually fairly easy to do. the third prong, this piece of this prong only, without looking at prong two and three. [ laughter ] >> seth: wait. is "prong" sean spicer's safe word and he forgot to tell everyone? [ laughter ] "prong, you guys, prong! i'm going back to the oval office, but prong!" [ laughter ] of course, as usual, trump is doing a complete 180 here. because, he used to love the congressional budget office when it suited his needs. tweeting about the cbo at least 13 times to criticize obama. the only constant in all of this is that trump likes something if it agrees with him, and he hates it if it doesn't. take for example, the monthly jobs report. trump famously used to call the unemployment rate phony, but now that he's president, he's bragging about the jobs numbers.

so how does the white house explain the flip flop? sean spicer had this to say last week. >> i talked to the president prior to this, and he said to quote him very clearly. they may have been phony in the past, but it's very real now. [ laughter ] [ mock laughter ] >> seth: oh, my god. we're so pronged. [ laughter and applause ] even when trump makes a claim in his own words, like when he accused president obama of wiretapping him, we can't be sure if we're supposed to actually take him literally. remember, trump tweeted -- "terrible. just found out that obama had my wires tapped in trump tower. and president obama was tapping my phones in october." and yet, when spicer was asked if trump had any proof that trump was indeed wire tapped, spicer responded with this. >> he doesn't really think that president obama went up and tapped his phone personally. the president used the word, "wiretap" in quotes to mean broadly surveillance and other activities. >> seth: because what is wiretap if not a cool slang term that means a bunch of different things.

like, "we should wire tap some molly." or, "i want to wiretap dat ass." [ laughter ] now today, the attorney general jeff sessions, who would know if there was any evidence of wire tapping was asked if he had provided any such evidence to the president. and he seemed flustered. >> did you ever have a chance to brief the president on investigations related to the campaign? or did you ever give him any reason to believe he was wiretapped by the previous administration? >> um -- look, um -- answer, no. but, um -- [ laughter ] [ southern accent ] >> seth: well, you better get that man some sweet tea and a porch to sit on, because he is sweating more than a gator in a boot store. [ laughter ] but trump's own attorney general couldn't give us any evidence. then there was the republican overseeing the investigation in the house, devin nunes, who offered a similar argument to spicer, claiming obama didn't personally go to trump tower and put in a wire tap. >> we don't have any evidence that took place. i don't think there was an actual tap of trump tower.

president obama wouldn't physically go over and wiretap trump tower. so now you have to decide, as i mentioned to you last week, are you going to take the tweets literally? and if you are, then clearly the president was wrong. >> seth: stop telling us obama didn't physically go to trump tower. nobody thought that! [ laughter ] [ as obama ] "uh, hello -- i'm here from at and -- uh -- t." [ laughter ] so sometimes trump is pro-cbo, other times he's anti-cbo. sometimes he says the jobs numbers are phony, other times says they're real. sometimes he says things in quotes, other times he really means them. but one thing we do know is we can't believe his promises on healthcare. like when he promised during the campaign that he wouldn't let people suffer as president. using one favorite phrase over and over again. >> i said nobody's going to be dying on the street if i'm president. >> did you say you're a liberal on healthcare?

>> i will not let people on the streets if i'm president. >> people are not going to die in the middle of the street. people are not going to die on the sidewalk . >> you're not going to let people die sitting in the middle of a street. >> seth: why does he think people are walking out to the middle of the street to die? [ light laughter ] must -- make it to street. it down in middle of street. and die with dignity. [ light laughter ] so trump made huge promises on healthcare that he clearly had no intention of keeping. his bill would cut medicare and kick millions off insurance. if it passes, we're all going to need a safe word. >> prong, prong, prong, prong. prong, prong, prong -- ♪ prong p-prong prong prong ♪ [ light laughter ] >> seth: this has been "a closer look." [ cheers and applause ] ♪ we'll be back with more, "late night," everybody. [ cheers and applause ] ♪ something big is happening at olive garden.

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♪ [cheers and applause] >> seth: welcome back, everybody. please give it up for the 8g band, right over there. [ cheers and applause ] also joining us again tonight, he's the iconic drummer for an esteemed heavy metal group who have sold more than 90 million albums worldwide, and are performing in brooklyn at the barclays senator -- center on july 21st and 22nd where they'll conclude their globe-spanning "book of souls" world tour. from iron maiden, nicko mcbrain is here everybody. [ cheers and applause ] thank you so much for being here. >> thank you very much, mate.

>> seth: i appreciate it. our first guest tonight is an emmy-nominated, golden globe-winning actress who stars in the critically-acclaimed series "the americans." the fifth season airs tuesdays nights on fx. let's take a look. >> do you think it would have been fair to tell him the truth? to put that burden on him? >> so that's how it's gonna be. just for the rest of my life i have to be fake with my boyfriends. >> paige, wait, it's not being fake. it's -- being in a relationship is complicated. you don't share everything. you hold back what you need to. >> seth: please welcome back to the show our friend keri russell, everybody. [ cheers and applause ] ♪

>> seth: welcome back, keri. >> thank you very much. i was just watching that clip realizing -- wow. that's -- >> seth: it's really intense. >> she's a hard-core mom. >> seth: yeah. 'cause again, this is the fifth season. this is a show i've loved for a very long time. but world events have sort of shifted the focus. because you -- you and matthew play russian spies living in america. >> we do. >> seth: and now it feels so very real -- [ light laughter ] do people assume you're an expert on russian-american relations? >> every interview we do now people are like, "so talk to us about what's going on." i'm like, guys, this is -- first of all, i'm an actor. >> seth: yeah. >> i wear makeup for a living. i know nothing. >> seth: right. >> and they're like, "tell us about -- so is this affecting your show." it's like the show already happened! it's 1980! >> seth: yeah. >> like there's nothing this is going to affect. >> seth: that's right. >> but i know. everyone thinks we're experts. i'm like, no. >> seth: nope, we're just regular actors telling a kick ass story. >> yeah. >> seth: this is -- obviously we sort of first got to know you as felicity.

and this is a very different character you're playing now from felicity. as we could tell from that clip. i feel like i would never hear felicity say that. >> who knows? who knows? >> seth: felicity would say, "you're withholding from me. you need to tell me everything." >> tell me everything. >> seth: but j.j. abrams wanted -- actually considered making felicity a spy. >> well because the whole show, felicity obviously, you know, is this college girl. and at a certain point you run out of stories. and they were like, you know, how stressful -- you're supposed to make these like life and death situations so people will watch. and they're like what -- what big is happening? like you're not going to pass your exam? >> seth: yeah. >> like someone is going to break up with you again? and he's like, "it would just be so much easier if you were a spy." >> seth: yeah. >> you know and like someone could die. and then he created "alias." >> seth: he did "alias." yeah. >> like, this is a much better idea. >> seth: yeah, we get out of college game and get into the spy game. >> yeah. >> seth: so you and matthew, your co-star, you guys are partners in real life and you got to -- you got invited to the state dinner. >> i guess. >> seth: you'd guess? [ light laughter ] here you guys are. look at you guys going to the white house. look at how great you look. [cheers and applause]

>> that was so fun. that was just -- it was so cool. >> seth: and you just had a baby, right? >> i just had a baby, and i had to show up to this black tie dinner with my breast pump. >> seth: okay. >> and because we you have -- just had a baby, you know, that's what happens. >> seth: yeah. >> and i couldn't be out of the house for more than three hours without that. and so i went and i brought the little breast pump to the coast check and she said, "you're not the first." >> seth: that's good. i'm glad to hear it. >> and i was like, i know. >> seth: i will say the first time i saw my wife's breast pump, it looked like an explosive to me. so i'm glad they let you bring it in. [ light laughter ] >> it was -- yeah, yeah, well. and the coolest thing about this dinner, well the coolest thing was that president obama is a fan of the show. >> seth: that's fantastic. >> that is the coolest thing. >> seth: that's a great thing to hear. >> and why we got to go. [ cheers and applause ] and then right before we got seated at this fancy, fancy dinner, samantha power, the american ambassador to the u.n., came up and she was like, "i've got to talk to you. i've got to talk to you.

you have changed my relationship with the russian ambassador to the u.n." and we're like, "what?!" and she's like, "we meet for drinks." and in fact there was some situation. she was like, "you know just recently" -- it was the anniversary. i think it was like, crimea and something going on. i had to meet him. i'm like, "first of all, where do you meet? and what do you drink?" >> seth: right. yeah. >> and she's was like, "i always drink whiskey. he always drinks vodka." >> seth: cliché, but sure. [ light laughter ] >> totally. >> seth" he's like -- [ russian accent ] "i'll have a -- don't tell my friends, but cosmo. i'll have a cosmo." [ laughter ] >> i would love that. that would be so good. so they meet, and she's like, "and you know i have a heavy heart, because of all this stuff i'm thinking about over the past years." and he says, "you know what, i just want to make a toast." and she was like, "wow, he's going to make a toast about this really awful event." and he's like, "i want to make a toast. it is the season premiere of 'the americans'!" she's like, "what?" and then they have this whole -- she's like, "you've changed my relationship. we argue about the show all the time." >> seth: that's fantastic. >> he's like, "we would never do that! we would never raise our kids like that!"

>> seth: oh, that's great. so he thought -- he was defending the russian side of it. that's perfect. >> yeah. absolutely. so good. >> seth: you -- so matthew, i had always assumed you guys met working on this show, but you had met him ten years previous. >> we did. >> seth: and so where did you meet ten years previous? >> something really cool. >> seth: okay. >> at a kick ball party. >> seth: you were at a kick ball party? >> yeah. >> seth: now, that's weird, because ten years ago you were not 12. so -- [ laughter ] why were you at a kick ball party? >> we were at a kick ball party because jennifer grey is married to clark gregg. >> seth: yep. both fantastic actors. >> and randomly we both got invited. and we were like the last to leave. and my memory is being, like as the sun was going down in this parking lot and matthew and his friend were trying to, i guess get me to stay and open up these beers without a beer opener. and he blooding his thumb to try to make it work. >> seth: gotcha. so you thought this guy's a catch. [ laughter ] i got to -- >> and then i think i moved to new york and i didn't see him again for ten years. >> seth: and so did you remember as soon as you saw him again that he was that guy? >> nope. >> seth: really?

so who brought it up? did he have to remind you? >> so we had auditioned together. we had done readings together. we had done script work together. and then, you know, like three weeks into rehearsal, after this big fight training thing we had to do together, he's like, "we've met before." and i was like, "no, we haven't." and he's like, "yeah, we have." and i was like, "what?" and he's like, "we were at a kick ball part" -- i was like, "oh, my god! the kick ball! i know exactly -- you left a drunk message on my answering machine!" [ laughter ] >> seth: wow. he plays the long game. [ laughter ] he's like, i like to meet them at a kick ball party, wait ten years, get cast with them, and then bring it up. >> and then bring it up. >> seth: and then make a baby. [ light laughter ] i want to -- i want to bring up one other thing about matthew, because i was -- he was in an episode of "girls" a couple weeks ago. >> he was. >> seth: he was fantastic in it. >> oh, i'll tell him you said that. >> seth: please do. but there was some male full-frontal -- >> there was. >> seth: nudity. i've since it was -- what i saw was a prosthetic. >> it was. >> seth: okay.

>> it was. >> seth: because it looked great. [ laughter ] >> and i will say, you know, he said he was going to go do that and i was like, "who are sleeping with?" like, "who do you have sex with on the show?" >> seth: on "girls." right. when you're on the show "girls", you're gonna have sex with someone. >> which version of all the girls are you sleeping with? and he's like, "well, it's not quite like that." and then there's the whole thing where he had to -- he got to choose his own -- >> seth: prosthetic. >> yeah. and he's like, but this is -- puts me in such an awkward position. like if i choose a giant one, people are gonna be like "what a dick." [ laughter ] >> seth: right, yeah. i guess that looks about right. >> yeah, this is -- i mean this is normal for me. but so he's like, i just let someone else do it. >> seth: they had to let somebody else do it. well again, i thought it was great prosthetic work. >> i'll tell him you said that. >> seth: and certainly. you know, and again, i don't -- i've never seen it, but it fit his personality. [ laughter ] >> i'll tell him you said that. >> seth: thank you so much for being here. >> thank you for having me. >> seth: it's always the best. >> and congratulations. you're doing such a great job. >> seth: thank you so much. keri russel, everybody. "the americans" airs tuesday

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♪ [ cheers and applause ] >> seth: welcome back, everybody. you know our next guest from shows like "six feet under", "parenthood", and "sports night." he is currently starring on abc's "the catch", which airs new episodes thursday nights. let's take a look. >> you don't want me to spend time with your brother. >> no, it's not that. it's just -- >> i'm a bad influence. >> sweetie, you're a criminal. >> i was a criminal. am i not now one of the good guys? do i not work for the fbi? >> can you keep your voice down? my brother's in the guest room. >> your brother is not the problem, you are. you still don't trust me. >> that is not what this is about. >> how long is this gonna take? five years? ten? what do i have to do? i just went to jail for you. >> for 72 hours. and then you made a deal without consulting me. >> i was in prison without a phone, how am i supposed to tell you?

>> seth: please welcome to the show, peter krause, everybody. [ cheers and applause ] ♪ >> seth: welcome to the show! >> how are you? >> seth: i'm well, thank you for being here. >> yeah, you bet. >> seth: this is -- congratulations on season two. >> thank you. >> seth: an interesting thing happened with your show, which is it sort of changed it's person -- >> it's personality? >> seth: perspective? or personality i think is a better word, yeah. >> it's the "sybil" of tv shows. the first season was a little more serious, we found out, then we wanted it to be. and allen hienburg, our executive producer-writer, decided to go on more of a romantic comedy direction. but they call it a rom-con. >> seth: oh, a rom-con? >> with an "n." not a rom-com. >> seth: oh, gotcha, 'cause you're a con man. >> con artist, yeah. >> seth: there you go, that's very nice. this is the first of the rom-con's, i believe. >> yes, it's the very first rom-con ever. >> seth: yeah, congratulations. >> so, you should watch it just for that. >> seth: and this is a -- this

is a shonda show. >> yes. >> seth: and so, that must give you a great deal of freedom, because i feel like shonda now, has this permission to sort of do whatever she likes. >> yeah, there's some freedom. uh, you know, 'cause if you're a guy, on a shonda show, you're -- you're kind of get objectified a little bit. >> seth: yeah. >> for instance, i was gonna wear a tie, but this shirt, it won't -- it's too tight, because i have to workout for this show, because our clothes are off half the time. >> seth: they are. [ light laughter ] i'm glad you noticed, 'cause i noticed. >> other than that -- >> seth: other than that -- >> other than having to diet and workout, a lot of freedom. >> seth: there are a lot of sex scenes in your rom-con. >> there are. >> seth: and in television, i don't know if people understand this, but there's almost a different director every week for episodes of the show. >> yes. yes there are. >> seth: so, have you found a difference in how directors approach sex scenes? >> uh, absolutely. the one thing that they're all told to do is to push the limit. so, we have made, you know, some of these sex scenes, that they can't use some of the footage. >> seth: oh, wow. >> you know, until they release it, you know, with the -- in pornoslavia. >> seth: yeah, right. [ light laughter ] >> small country.

>> seth: small country where anything goes. >> yes. >> seth: "we like 'catch' here. it's two hours long, lots of -- lots of nakedness." >> right next to trump -- right next to trumpistan. >> seth: yeah, exactly. >> but the -- the directors, julian robinson, who directed our pilot, is a -- is a brit, so her thing that cracked me up was she said, "now the two of you just start to make small, pleasurable movements." [ laughter ] without your hands. kevin dowling, one of our directors, asked us to think more like animals. >> seth: uh-huh. would he give you different animals? that he wanted -- >> he suggested jungle cats. [ light laughter ] >> seth: okay, gotcha. >> which is probably better than anteaters or something. >> seth: sure. [ laughter ] well the worst is, you're a jungle cat, you're an anteater. >> yeah, exactly. so, mire and i laugh about that kind of stuff. and then we had, another director who said to mire, "okay, climb on top of uncle pete." which made us a little uncomfortable. >> seth: yeah, that's not great. [ laughter ] >> not something i wanted to hear. >> seth: that's a -- everything for me, would have been a step forward sexually, and that was a big step back. >> yeah.

[ laughter ] and -- and then regina king directed an episode. >> seth: who's a fantastic actress. >> she's awesome, and great director as well. i just saw her the other night, we were at a rangers game together. >> seth: there you go. >> but her thing that she said -- to us, she said, "all right, now give me some more of that, 'i want to [ bleep ] the [ bleep ] out of you' face." [ laughter ] >> seth: i hope that wasn't it. >> no, no, no, yeah. [ laughter and applause ] that was not the phrase. >> seth: okay, good, good, good. >> that was not it. >> seth: 'cause that's -- that was not what i was getting from that face at all. [ laughter ] >> yeah. i tried to say that kind of lightly, but they'll just bleep that out. >> seth: yeah, they'll bleep it out. we get bleeped here all the time. they bleep stuff where we're not even cursing. >> yeah, yeah. [ laughter ] >> seth: uh, and so, i want to ask you -- you have this incredible career. you've been with so many iconic shows that i feel like people still talk about, and still remember. >> sure. >> seth: and in the course of that, you've obviously had the chance to cross paths with people. have you ever met celebrities, other people, who are fans of -- of the work that you've done? >> uh, i have. the story that comes to mind is i was doing letterman. i was promoting "six feet

under." and somebody's manager came up to me afterwards, and he said, "you know my client is big fan of yours, he'd like to meet you." so he brought me into the greenroom without telling me who it was. i walked in, and the gentleman stood up, and i was looking at his torso, he was kareem abdul-jabbar. >> seth: there you go. >> and i became instantly stupid. >> seth: sure. >> i'm shaking his hand, looking up at him. and i said, "i'm so sorry. he didn't tell me it was you. and you're just the tallest person i've ever met in my life." [ light laughter ] and he was totally cool. he looked down at me -- [ light laughter ] >> seth: yeah, of course. >> 'cause there i was, and he said the nicest thing. he said "it's all right, you're tall to me. it's all relative." >> seth: oh, there you go. >> but he was a big "six feet under" fan. gave me a t-shirt. i still have it today. >> seth: and have you -- when -- 'cause again, "parenthood", "six feet under", "sports night" -- they're all sort of different kinds of shows. can you tell when someone approaches you, what -- which of your shows they are fans of? >> i can't. i have some guesses here and there, but there was one particular instance where i -- i knew, what the guy was into.

and it was when i had to go to a funeral home, because my dad had passed. and so the funeral director came walking in, and he has a big smile on his face, and "what an honor it is to be working with you." [ laughter ] >> seth: but i guess, if you're a funeral director, and you meet one of the guys from "six feet under", i mean, basically -- >> there are no other funeral home shows. >> seth: he's like yours, "yours is my favorite funeral home show." >> yeah, this is it. [ laughter ] yeah, exactly. >> seth: yours is -- you're the "cheers" of funeral homes. [ light laughter ] >> exactly, exactly. >> seth: thanks so much for being here. >> oh, you bet. >> seth: congratulations on the show. such a pleasure. [ cheers and applause ] peter krause, everybody. new episodes of "the catch" air thursday nights on abc. we'll be right back with j.d. vance. [ cheers and applause ] ♪ can a toothpaste do everything well?

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♪ [ cheers and applause ] >> seth: welcome back, everybody. you know, it's important to remember there are two sides to every news story. to make sure you get to see important issues from all sides, we have invited two of our writers, who have very different points of view. we will examine their opinions in a segment we call "point, counterpoint." ♪ [ cheers and applause ] >> seth: ally, amber, thank you so much for being here. first topic bathroom laws. donald trump revoked landmark guidelines, which instructed public schools to allow transgender students to use the bathrooms matching their gender identity. ally? >> this is literally an attack on disenfranchised youth and their civil rights.

why? just so he can say he overturned something obama did? why does he care where a trans teen goes to the bathroom? america apparently didn't care about his terrible "locker room talk." and don't tell me he's defending christian beliefs, because that's just putting lipstick on a pig. >> seth: you have a point. amber? >> putting lipstick on a pig sounds like the best thing you could do to a pig! [ laughter ] can you imagine a little-bitty pig wearing lipstick? and she'd be all like, "i'm a successful business pig!" [ light laughter ] just kidding. i wouldn't do that to a pig. i would want my pig to know she's beautiful no matter how much makeup she has on. >> seth: you have a point too, amber. [ light laughter ] next topic. paid protesters. trump and now other members of the republican house and senate are claiming people protesting them are paid protesters and are a fake representation of how real americans feel. ally? >> seth, my kingdom for the confidence of a white male republican who doesn't think anyone could dislike them. they're enacting policies that affect millions of people every

day, so of course constituents are angry. especially with them repealing obamacare! people's lives are at stake, and they don't even seem to care. >> seth: scary stuff. amber? >> remember the care bears? [ light laughter ] i loved them so much. heck, i still do! they were so happy. except the one with the rain cloud on his belly. and if you ask me, he was faking it. 'cause by the end of every episode, he was just as happy as everyone else! [ light laughter ] how could he not be? he's a teddy bear who lives in the clouds with rainbows. >> seth: i wish i lived there. [ laughter ] >> me too! >> the topic was obamacare. >> he does? >> seth, she didn't even make a point! >> seth: you're right. she made a counterpoint. >> ugh, next topic please. >> seth: toxic waste. trump recently repealed an obama-era ban that prevented coal companies from dumping refuse into streams and rivers. ally? >> is trump just openly trying to kill us now? does flint or standing rock, mean nothing to him? he and ivanka claimed the environment was important to

them for good pr, but then they turned around and did this? you can't have your cake and eat it too. >> seth: strong words. amber? >> if you have cake, you better eat it. or else i'm gonna. [ laughter ] i cannot control myself around cake. no matter whose birthday it is. and usually i don't have to. now that's the great thing about cake, is most people want your help eating it. heck, if i have some birthday cake, i'll share it with you. >> oh, my god. >> seth: uh, i think you mean thank you? she just offered to share cake with you, ally. >> she has no cake! that was hypothetical! she shouldn't even be talking about cake. >> seth: you're the one talking about cake. >> hey, there's enough hypothetical cake for everybody! >> seth: all right. next topic, trump's war on the media. donald trump called the media the enemy of the american people. dangerous or also protected under free speech? ally? >> the fourth estate is an integral part of a free and open society, but our president's fragile ego clearly can't handle anything less than sycophantic adoration. so now he's throwing a tantrum that could put the very balance of our democracy into question. the more followers blindly

accept what he says as fact, the closer we are to dictatorship. and let's be honest, that's what trump wants. >> seth: you have a point. amber? ♪ what a trump wants what a trump needs whatever makes him happy sets you free ♪ ♪ >> no! what do you think about trump's crazy followers? >> oh, i can be crazy too. [ mumbling ] [ light laughter ] >> seth: final topic, trump's 2005 tax returns. ally? >> he clearly released them as a distraction from russia. >> you want a distraction? look at this. >> oh, my god. >> it's a pig cake with lipstick on it! [ laughter ] and it's just for you! hey, cake, do you mind if ally eats you? i insist that she does! i'm too cute not to eat! oink! [ light laughter ] >> that is a really cute cake. you're right, amber's right. maybe i'm being too negative. how do -- how do you have such a good attitude? >> i live life as if the president will kill us all at any moment. 'cause he just might!

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♪ [ cheers and applause ] seth: welcome back, everybody. our next guest wrote the number one "new york times" best-selling memoir, "hillbilly elegy: a memoir of a family in culture and crisis." please welcome to the show, j.d. vance, everybody. [ cheers and applause ] ♪ >> seth: i'm so happy you're here. >> yeah. thank you for having me. >> seth: congratulations on this book. it's a fantastic read. but it's a very interesting book for you to have written in this moment in time. because you sort of wrote about the part of kentucky you're from, the part of ohio that you grew up in, that is sort of the

white working class that rushed to support donald trump. this obviously wasn't what you had in mind when you wrote this book, but now people have sort of called this trump whisperer. is that a weird place to -- is that a weird role for you to be playing? >> yeah. it's definitely a pretty weird role for me to be playing. and of course i end up on tv all the time. i'm here right now. and having never been on tv or really talked about politics in a public way, it's certainly surprising. it's pretty bizarre. you know, when people call me and ask me and want to -- want me to talk about trump or politics, my initial reaction is, wouldn't you rather to talk to somebody's who's smarter or more well-informed. but i answer the calls and i go on shows when i can. >> seth: now i want to stress that this isn't a book about politics. i mean donald trump is never mentioned, hillary clinton is never mentioned. but it is about this sort of hillbilly culture that you grew up in. and it sort of explains how these people could find their way to being dissatisfied with their current situation to vote for somebody who could tell them -- make them promises that

everything is going to get better. >> yeah, that's absolutely right. i mean the book is really about what happens when the industrial economy goes south. right? i mean so we talk about the opioid addiction. we talk about family break down. we talk about lowering life expectancy rates, which is something that's very unique to the white working class. and it's really about this idea that when the economy falls apart and everything else seems to fall apart along with it, you're one, really frustrated and you're looking for an answer about how -- how to make things better. i mean, again, i don't talk about the political answers in the book, but i think the fact that i'm sort of channeling these voter's frustrations caused a lot of people to put a political lens on it. >> seth: now the great characters -- there are so many great characters in your life that make -- that would be great characters of fiction. you're mamaw and papaw -- am i -- >> that's right. >> seth: okay good. they are -- and i should say there is some very foul language from your mamaw in this book. [ light laughter ] >> yeah. she loved the f-word. >> seth: she loved the f-word. certainly. it certainly made it here and plenty. there was -- at one point i was highlighting every time she used the f-word, because it made me laugh every time and then my

highlighter ran out. [ laughter ] but, talk real quick -- because you know you came from -- you had a very unsettled family situation with your parents. and your grandparents sort of were the stability in your life. talk about, for these communities and any sort of any community like this, how important family structure is. especially in regards to how it affected you as a student when you were younger. >> yeah, absolutely. so my grandparents i think of as really the heroes of the story, especially mamaw who i spend a lot of time with later, later in my childhood. i mean, you know, people often ask, "how did you not succumb to a lot of the influences that were going on in your neighborhood?" and i always say, it's because of mamaw. right? i mean, i remember the first that i ever smoked pot. i was hanging out with one of the bad kids in the neighborhood, and mamaw told me, look, if you don't stop hanging out with that kid, i'm going to run him over with my car and -- [ laughter ] and no one's ever going to find out. >> seth: yeah. [ laughter ] >> and i don't think she would have actually ran somebody over with her car, but i thought that she might. so i stopped hanging out with the kid and i didn't do any more

drugs. so it's sort of interesting that having that really powerful matriarchal figure is something that is really common in this particular culture. it's something i've actually heard from a lot of black readers of the book. black americans who say that powerful, matronly figure is a really critical part of our culture, too. and i do think that's one of the reasons the book has resonated with a lot of readers is because mamaw is so incredible. >> seth: and it's interesting, so you mentioned black readers of the book -- you make the parallel, you draw it yourself in the book, that this hillbilly community you grew up in and black communities are very similar. which is they migrate away from where they went. they go to industrial areas and then the industry leaves and they're sort of in these, you know for a lack of better terms, like sort of dying communities. and yet a lot of the trump voters, it seemed like the racist rhetoric of donald trump did not disqualify him as a candidate to them. so i'm not saying that if you voted for donald trump you're racist. i don't think that's true at all. but it is interesting that certainly the areas that you write about, that was not

disqualifying. how do you think that part of the race discussion can be addressed moving forward? >> well, yeah, the way i would frame it is, look, if you're -- you know politics is fundamentally a choice between two options. especially in a presidential race, right. so a lot of the people i know who really like donald trump, supported donald trump, they didn't love some of the rhetoric. but at the same time, they're worried about their kid -- a neighbor kid down the street who died of a heroin overdose. right? so if you are given that alternative between somebody who -- maybe you don't like his rhetoric, but he's actually speaking to your concerns, he's showing up in the areas where you actually live, i don't think it's totally surprising that they went for the guy that they didn't totally love, but at least was responsive to some of things happening in their community. >> seth: do you think -- because i think now we're seeing, even with this health care plan that i don't believe you're fan of. is that accurate? >> that's exactly right. >> seth: do you think that now -- and i should make it clear, you were not a supporter of donald trump. >> yeah, yeah. >> seth: in case that's been cleared. you're conservative but you don't -- you were not a voter

for donald trump. but do you think that these communities now will see with something like healthcare, which i think is so -- so tactile in regards to, they might not care about his taxes, they might not care about russia, but this is a real thing that might affect these communities. do you think disappointment will set in with what he's promised? >> well, i think if this bill, the one that's been talked in the press a lot for the past week, passes in its present form, then you're going to see a lot of the lower-middle income voters who flocked to donald trump either lose health insurance or see -- see their premiums go up. so i definitely think that frustration will set in in that case. i do think that there are some opportunities to salvage the bill. i'm not of these people to say it's completely unfixable. but, i mean look, the biggest crisis, the biggest thing that people talk about in my particular community is the opioid epidemic. right? so the county that i grew up in in ohio, last year opioid overdose deaths outnumbered deaths from natural causes as the leading cause of the death. the first time that happened. i mean if -- if you lose your access to treatment centers, if

you lose access to some of the prescription drugs that make it easier to fight this addiction, if you're a family that's taking care of a kid and you need to figure out how to get them health care so that they can fight this stuff and it all goes away, yeah. you're going to be really frustrated. and i think it's a real political land mine for the trump administration. >> seth: well, i want to thank you, one for this book. which is so beautifully written and i really highly recommend. your story is incredible. two, i know you've started a non-profit to help deal with opioid addiction in your area and i can't think of a better person to be doing that. so thank you so much for being here. i really appreciate it. >> thank you, seth. appreciate it. >> seth: j.d. vance, everybody. "hillbilly elegy" is available now. we'll be right back. [ cheers and applause ] ♪ my daughter is...

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[ cheers and applause ] >> seth: my thanks to keri russell, peter krause, j.d. vance, everybody! nicko mcbrain, and of course, the 8g band. stay tuned for carson daly. see you tomorrow! [ cheers and applause ] ♪ ♪ ♪ >> carson: hey there, i'm carson daly. this is the time new york hotel and you're watching "last call." tonight, "trial and error" star steven boyer gets the spotlight treatment. the music is the band jjuujuu. they're gonna make their tv debut from the glass house