we are knocking on the door of fantasyland right now. >> we are still looking at fantasyland because the sustainable price of $30 just will not physically work. take fiveyou need to dollars for shipping from australia, $15 for shipping from brazil. so that means you are talking about a price of 25 from australia or 15 from brazil. there are a lot of high cost producers that are not going to pass muster at that sort of price range. it is not sustainable. it is fantasyland at that level. happenhat what needs to -- that prices need to go lower? grexit is what happens in every cycle. that thereight now are people suffering pretty loudly. be a lonelyit would place if we got anywhere near 30. it is still looking pretty crowded in many ways. it is crowded and there are a lot of producers hanging on by their fingernails. up the cashning reserves of their shareholders. that's a decision for them, not for me. that was sam walsh. before we go to break, u.s. natural gas sold at its lowest level since 1999 and you can thank el niÑo for that and the warmer than expected winter we have had. 20ing

. >> i think that is fantasyland. a wish list idea. it simply cannot happen if you look at the impact on the broad on supply.st we are right down at the bottom, as i mentioned. we are making very, very healthy margins. david: fantasyland. he said it could not happen. what do you say? ken: sam looks like he is in fantasyland right now. [laughter] cannot getjor miners it through their head how bad china is. they keep producing. on what wea study think the copper producers will produce. even though the price of copper was down 20% last year and down 30% this year, they are going to raise copper production of the other -- and 9% next year when copper demand is down. the stocks have sold incredibly hard. toaking as someone who used be an activist investor, i'm going to these boards and saying, "what the heck are you thinking? what is going through your heads?" on inof insanity is going this industry right now and it is only showing up in the equities, which are just really trounced, and the prices of from materials, which are being absolute

s "daybreak a fantasyland according to current anderson. this is a new book he considers the political consequence. next. this is bloomberg. ♪ david: this is "bloomberg markets: balance of power." i'm david gura. the late senator says everyone is entitled to his own opinion but not to his own fact. that is a jumping off points for the critic curt anderson. he looked up a line between fact and fiction and how it has been blurred. >> fantasyland is the local election of previous -- predispositions toward believing the untrue. passionately. americans have always been inclined to underscore mergener -- as part of our character. toy have been encouraged embrace the untrue. believing that anything on your own privately, i have no problem , but once at least since the public spear, that is the problem. david: how is what we seeing today different from 300 years ago? this phenomenon of there being a subjectivity to truth. not come from nowhere. it's a not start in 2015 or 1969. there are habits of mind that define americans that go way back. and

view, the fed kind of ,stablished this fantasyland but a credible fantasyland in which, for 30 quarters in a row, they've been saying next year conditions will be really strong and we are going to raise. and then the data comes in and it is not that strong. and they say, well, we won't raise yet. we will wait until next quarter with the forecast says we will be great and we will raise. now we are back on that cycle. david: you advise the new york fed. in a way, the new york fed has been better than the board offeds are the governors. i think it is because -- the fed is not alone in this. i think it is mostly the forecasting models are fundamentally about reversion to we predict the future will look like the past saying ind they are the model implicitly, when house prices go up, the data from the 2000s tells us that people spend housing starts will skyrocket and the economy will come booming back. 2006 is thepened in thing that is abnormal, not now being the thing that is abnormal. david: if you are running a company and you had a model that was running the norm -- the wrong numbers, wou

yesterday, i played a quotation ,rom the ceo of rio tinto calling it fantasyland that iron ore prices would get to $30. you correctly prognosticate it that the news that would set it in motion scrapping its dividend. >> i wish it was that easy. the mining industry needs to adjust to the new chinese reality. they need to cut substantially. the disappointing thing investors are finding with freeport-mcmoran is that they said they were cut another 100 million pounds of production, but did not say anything about company production expected to be up 15% next year. they are not fooling anyone. the stock heavily shorted went and then down. mines,ed to cut production, and capital expenditure to low levels to get the supply and demand back in balance. david: for seeing that scaling back across the board. >> freeport-mcmoran tells us that we will curtail copper and aluminum production more. we'll also pull back on the expenditures on oil and gas. we saw the same yesterday from anglo american. every day i'm talking to traders and i keep saying, do you think we will see more cuts very what we're

still ahead, there is fantasyland, tomorrowland, a venture land, and soon there will be star wars land at disney parks. get excited, mark. mark: we will tell you what it means for the disney bottom line next. scale back on the coffee. ♪ betty: welcome back. williams companies is the best-performing stock in the s&p 500. julie hyman joins us to tell us why. julie: it looks like the company has put its up for sale. we knew that already and we reported friday that they got a bid from spectra energy. this is after williams companies had rejected an offer from energy transfer of 48 billion come -- of $48 billion saying it was not enough. the idea that it's potentially getting another bid could be good news. we have seen a pickup in these midstream energy deals for the year to date. williams companies as a pipeline operator. we did analysis and looked at the midstream m&a action. you can see the uptick we have energyen though the stocks have not been as high as some might estimate given the decrease in commodity prices. this is the five-year chart of m&a. the blue is the volume and size of

stockman: it is basically fantasyland. they have been kicking the can so long that the magnitude of the problem is almost insuperable. mixesmagine policy make that have no chance of happening. not only does this budget project gdp that can't happen, but they also have what they trillion,s $7.5 doubling the standard deduction all the rest of it, and yet they say they are going to pay for it with 100% offsets so there's no revenue loss. david: if the double count? mr. stockman: it is a double count. i'm all for lower rates, as that's what reagan did in 1986, but how are you going to come up with $7.5 trillion of offsets when you have k street lobbyists lined up from one end of the swamp to the other? the big dollars or really be on reach. the biggest loophole that you can close is the health exclusion. the house republicans chickened out on that during the obama care repeal. the next biggest one is $180 billion, which is pensions and iras. the third one is capital gains and dividends treated on a preferential basis. when you

is fantasyland. it may be a wish list. it cannot have been if you look -- they cannot happen. if you look at the broad range, the cost curve of supply. we are at the bottom making healthy margins. betty: well, sam. you are in fantasy-land, right? there is virtually no commodity in the mining space that you could not have someone that has lost. if you put too much production into the market in a market that is oversupplied, prices will decline. for many commodities, that has not happened. you have the big three or big five trying to gain market share. they are putting more supply into the market. it is a painful game to play. productionn a lot of falling out, that prices came down along with it. betty: that is the game that opec is playing, right? will seesible that we oil prices going into the impossible territory that people were saying? $20 for oil? trump, oil has become unhinged. we are seeing the risk of unhinged capacity in saudi arabia and you ran. in saudi arabia it is $2 -- it is 2 million and in iran it is one million per day. opec's past the golden age. demand is not

his article was adapted from the upcoming book, "fantasyland: how american went haywire." that will be published later this month.

head of fiat chrysler and his mission is to reach eliminating debt targets, targets that have been fantasyland or not realistic by analysts for several months. thatood news for them is executives expressed higher confidence in reaching those targets in investor meetings the after theonths strategy in the u.s. was changed. they ditched the production of sedans, which are not very profitable for much more profitable jeeps, suvs, and ram trucks. the end of this month, when they their 2016 results, he may show on how they plan to reach those targets. it looks like investors are starting to believe it. vonnie: well, they are. if you look at my chart on the bloomberg and you see the relevant performance of the stock compared with volkswagen and general motors, it is up way more. is this on the actual products it is selling right now or expectations for a brighter future? especially it is expectation on the fact that in the next couple of years the will be a will to produce -- fiat will be of to produce and boost margins -- will be able to boost margins in the u.s. we have seen analysts changing on f

. >> we have some by parliament 8 -- bipartisanship here on the couch, i wonder how much is fantasyland. >> better chance of getting it done on the couch and over on capitol hill. >> thank you so much. we are staying here right on for raqqa overtime on the web, find us at facebook.com/outnumberedfnc. back on tomorrow at noon eastern, "happening now" now. >> we start with a fox alert, we are awaiting the first white house briefing since the collapse of the republican health care bill on friday. >> jenna: a lot of finger-pointing within the g.o.p., president trump simile he could work with moderate democrats if conservatives will not back his agenda. recovering all of the news "happening now." >> i believe it is time for the party to start governing. i think that is important. i also think that democrats can come to the table as well. >> this is all fixable if we sit down like reasonable people and try to solve the problem and not beat each other out. >> jenna: signs of potential bipartisanship after the plan to repeal and replace obamacare ins for the trump admission and house republican

she was living in that new york california liberal fantasyland. >> abby: the idea that she couldn't connect. people didn't feel comfortable going to the polls and voting for her. we showed you the leader of the democratic party saying she needs to look in the mirror and self reflect on why she lost. >> trish: it's a struggle. it's an absolute struggle and they're concerned about making sure they have securities for their families, financial security, she never resonated at that level. she never expressed any kind of understanding for what it is that people were up against. people didn't like her because she was an outsider. she was very different in that sense. people didn't necessarily like him, but they felt like he got them in a way. he was able to energize the base anyway she wasn't. you mention russia, she's continuing to mention russia, what is it that russia, and your view actually did? if anything, i would argue that the media was sold by us in her favor, the polls were sold by us in her favor that the overall climate out there felt like if anyone is influencing it, it was influenci

as much as he which in some fantasyland we could control things and force daca to four shut down, that is not how government works. and if you're going to go vote for someone else, who you going to look for to better defend? >> katie: that's a great question. when you could answer. >> marie: i would make the argument to progressives that there are two parties who run in elections and the only party i would argue who has made daca a priority as democrats. he may be mad at chuck schumer but governing is much harder than carrying signs and protesting. >> josh: welcome to the wonderful world of primary politics. >> marie: i know. >> harris: demo on dem crime. >> marie: this is a momentary blitz. i don't think you're going to see a lot of primaries before 2018 midterms, is almost too late for that. >> sandra: would you want to see chuck schumer hold out for more. >> marie: on friday i on the show said if we get an exquisite commitment from mitch mcconnell to take up daca then we should not cut shut the government down. >> harris: what we've learned is that pretty much what they had on frida

and it is part of the appeasement, appeasing vladimir putin, you name it, he has a foreign policy and fantasyland. >> he criticizes donald trump for his limited role in the global stage which is fine, but he didn't have any foreign-policy credentials when he was elected. when he was a first-term senator, it betrays the notion he thinks being liked is the most important thing, it is not the most important thing. being liked by other countries -- i did not say that. >> i thought that was where it was going. >> it is critical, it is paramount to him, to have someone else in complete contrast which is what donald trump is, a reaction to this president. arthel: i want world leaders to underestimate donald trump. >> i want vladimir putin to hang out with donald trump. you could get some good stuff out of it. >> donald trump castigated our closest allies, pretty deep with vladimir putin who is anathema to everything we stand for and said we should sit down with the head of north korea. >> i want trump to be the guy, the only one who could possibly do it. hillary clinton is stuck in the old way. traditio

we are in fantasyland. we are in the lull before the storm and it will splatter all over, i do not know when, but it cannot be much longer. david: one of the things that has happened is the fed, plus the ecb, and boj, they have been pumping liquidity into the gold market place, now coming off gradually. can we take that liquidity back out and get whatever normal is, without hurting the stock market? david: that is the fundamental question and i think the isdamental answer is there symmetry in the financial process. if taking the interest rate down to zero for nine years running, unheard of, or taking the longterm rates in europe down to 30 basis points, or japan at 10 basis points, actually activity, economic then when you go to the opposite direction it is it going to unwind. the idea that there is a symmetry here that we can push down the rates arbitrarily and make things better, but when we normalize nothing will happen, i think that is wishful thinking. david: assuming that we are heading toward a downt