they shared the same in punjab. that's where the key is because you could have a similar situation in tunisia. again, something he talks about in his book. >> i am at the new america foundation. a question on the narratives are talking about the money being spent. the u.s. government has history of a successful narrative in the absence of a vibrant media in his population to the tune of $51 million with the university of nebraska to further a communism. since there has been lessons learned from successful narrative operations, how much money has been spent by the u.s. government was counting that narrative in the vibrant media in the country today? my second question is that the pakistani army since 1954, $21 million is the first amount of money given by the u.s. government and continuously have been that level of support. what would be a ballpark figure by the u.s. government to the pakistan army and how much is spent in education and pakistan tories the narrative in the media? unit that's a great question. i don't

but i went up to the punjab where the green revolution was trade out and so miraculous, and i made with the head of the green revolution there, who explained to me that to grow up a these crops fast, they dug a lot of holes in the ground to get water which they hate at 50-75 feet. and then went down to 150 and 250 and 500 feet when it got so expensive to drill and to pump, indian farmers started committing suicide, and i spent a day the punjab talking to widows of green revolution farmers who no longer can afford to keep drilling now below 1,000 feet to get to that rapidly depleting water. since 1995, their farm union told me, and i corroborated this with the indian government, 270,000 green revolution farmers have committed suicide in india, and they do it symbolicallily by drinking pesticide. the numbers have grown, water is diminishing, the use of chemicals to force feed the lan to get more food for us, this is serious stuff, which is why i -- i decided i had to write this book. but in the midst of it all, i was watching, as all of us now watch, what is going on with the atmosphere a

groups in punjab the americans who have infiltrated or who have joined the ranks of pakistani taliban in a very big fashion. the number of in terms of the threat by the pakistani taliban all you need to see is read about the major terrorist attack at the karachi airport. the major attack on the milita military -- military headquarters destroying one of the most important aircraft that they had. the attack on the air force base and in one case they successfully attacked a location where pakistanis were believed to have kept some of its nuclear arsenal. the point is a case of the pakistani taliban there are linkages of security forces behind the scene in terms of some insiders and in terms of some people who are radicalized enough, that is a much more dangerous phenomenon. security analysts -- if i were security analyst i would spend more time looking at the pakistani taliban. there were attempts made to engage pakistani taliban during these issues. part of the reason the pakistani taliban art directed is because the only way pakistan attempted to get at them was through kinetic needs.

that is to say something is good for the punjab based or pashtun upsetting the ample quarter or third business and transit has to be balanced within pakistan, that will be what makes decisions about afghanistan. so for the military, there will be the question of yes, let's say we are past strategic depth of a concept, but we are still concerned what is going on in world order if this particular warlord for people is in power here and they are inclined to be friendly to us, we can respond with another move forward and talk to people who might be friendly to us. but i don't sense a broader vision of how often the pakistani military, a vision of what not to happen. i think they believe in a broad sense are they to have a friendly country next to us. would like to have a country don't feel threatened by, we'll have to wait and see what happens in the election, and the reconciliation process in order to decide that. so i get back to the lack of vision, rather than competing visions. >> thank you. it's very clear. please, let me get my attention away for a microphone and identify yourself.

pakistani police officer said to me, kidnapping for ransom, bank robbers from karachi and in south punjab. the political economy of religious politicalization has taken a life of its own. you can go start a small -- pakistan is one of the few countries you need no license, no registration of any sort if you want to build a mosque of any sort. the point is this political economy also gives this funding to the phenomena so the problem of taliban fighting in pakistan is -- when i discussed this with the pakistani military who i must add has been very open to me when i was doing this research and i asked him the same question because i was making the case to them you are always using the kinetic approach and you have no law enforcement backing to cut these financial links which are linked to criminal areas. they mentioned we have evidence that the indians are funding. where is the evidence? "the new york times" -- we have ever asked them to show evidence. why does only pakistan which is asked to show evidence of involvement? i said i would like to know what is the nature of that evidence? the

girl who had committed blasphemy and the tragedy is some i must say this that it was the government of punjab. there was not a single imam the day that he was killed he was ready to stand and lead the prayers for her. including the officially paid imam who had been fired. the imam was still the official imam so there's that fear and that's why it's important but your point is well taken. in case of sharif raising the salaries is only one part of the problem. the real issue is your transformation as an institution in terms terms of current six and investment in new technologies in terms of many modern states there are these cameras on the highways and other places because you can -- is not meant to stop terrorism. the modern policing concepts are not particularly focused on stopping terrorism. they are focused on investigating terrorist might happens. pakistan has not invested in that in any case. that is a choice pakistan has to make and with respect from my friend from pakistan air force, don't take it personally. pakistan wants modern police stations. for the price of one f-16 you can build

law enforcement enhancements a and -- bishop bartsch a brief doubled the forces in punjab in the same way. my question to you is based on your recommendation this pluralism and law enforcement, my question is in most of the cases in pakistan the prime ministers became prime ministe ministers. if you become prime minister through accident and if you are asked to make a recommendation to advise the prime minister practically what is something specifically the three or four steps you will do to bring this kind of terrorism and instability to an end? thank you. >> thank you very much. you are right about benazir bhutto but the reason i would really like pakistan to thoroughly investigate and figure out who killed mr. bhutto and hukill -- because in the absence of a very clear answer it continues to become more popular and those who are behind the killings continue to think that they can kill and get away with it. we have seen in the recent past many politicians were killed. people of the national party in that area and members of the pakistani people's party. there was a very aerial and c

>> but through pluralism and enforcement and enhancement enhancement, but the chief -- of forces in punjab. based on your recommendation my question and one dash my question is in most of the cases they became prime ministers by accident. if you become prime minister by accident, pragmatically what specifically are the three or four steps you would do to bring said instability and terrorism to a close? >> thanks very much. you are right to about the issues. the reason i would really like them to clearly investigate is because in the absence of a very clear answer it could become more popular and those who think they can kill and get away with it. as we have seen in the recent past seeing in the national party, led many of those leaders there was a christian leader in one part of the parliament that was the member of the cabinet because they said the fact your the tragedy is there was not one single imam that was willing to stand to the the prayers for him. including the official imam. not the one from moscow. the recent but the chance for region as the institution withfgxam to ensure

groups in punjab the americans who have infiltrated or who have joined the ranks of pakistani taliban in a very big fashion. the number of in terms of the threat by the pakistani taliban all you need to see is read about the major terrorist attack at the karachi airport. the major attack on the milita military -- military headquarters destroying one of the most important aircraft that they had. the attack on the air force base and in one case they successfully attacked a location where pakistanis were believed to have kept some of its nuclear arsenal. the point is a case of the pakistani taliban there are linkages of security forces behind the scene in terms of some insiders and in terms of some people who are radicalized enough, that is a much more dangerous phenomenon. security analysts -- if i were security analyst i would spend more time looking at the pakistani taliban. there were attempts made to engage pakistani taliban during these issues. part of the reason the pakistani taliban art directed is because the only way pakistan attempted to get at them was through kinetic needs.

from 1947 where the youth think about kashmir these are from telling ghana punjab the army is constantly deployed against people that are supposedly within the nation. now because of this new aggressive economic policy which involves selling the mountains, the rivers, privatizing and mining there is a war going on against the indigenous people in the forests of central india. but the war is not just in the forests. there's a a whole bandwidth of resistance movements. inside the forests are the armed maoists gorillas. outside there are militant people's movements. there's a whole bandwidth of movements which academics and journalists like to class of high as this is violence and this is nonviolent. this is violent and this is maoists but in fact people don't think like that. they think strategically so when you are out in the villages and the planes you can actually have the guerrilla army. you have movements which call themselves, in any case there are militant but not armed. inside the forests which are now filled with paramilitary forces like in latin america and like in colombia and p

sharif, he doubled the forces in punjab. my question to you is, based on your recommendation, based on pluralism and law enforcement, my question is, in most of the cases in pakistan the prime minister's became prime ministers to an accident. if you become the prime minister, or if you are asked to advise prime minister, pragmatically what is something specifically, three or four steps you will do to bring this kind of terrorism and instability to a close? >> thank you very much. and you are right about the issues. the reason i would like pakistan to click invested in figure out who killed -- in the absence of a very clear answer, a continues to become more popular and then those who are behind killings continued to paint -- they continue to kill and get away with it. we have seen in the recent past many of the politicians were killed, actually of the pashtun party and that it, members in the people's party. many of the leaders to there was a well-known member of the parliament come a christian leader who is a member of the

so from 1947 where the -- whether you think about kashmir punjab, the army is constantly deployed against people that are supposedly within the nation. and now because of this new aggressive economic policy which involves selling the bounds, the rivers privatizing and mining there is a war going on against indigenous people in the forests of central india. but the war is not just in the forests. there's a whole bandwidth of resistance movements. inside the force are the armed maoist guerrillas. outside there are militant people's movements. there's a whole bandwidth of movements which, you know, academics and journalists like to classify as oh this is gandhi and this is nonviolence this is violence, this is maoist. but, in fact people don't think like that. they think strategically. so when you're out in the villages, in the plains, you can't really have a guerrilla army. so you have movements which call themselves gandhian or, in any case there are militant but not armed. inside the forest, which are now filled with paramilitary forces like in latin america and like in colombia in peru y

tool to -- i am interested because sunni and shia, but one thing is in common, these are the points in punjab, or whether these are shabaab -- i start my book there. they had some common ideas which were -- which was complete nonviolence, which was always honoring the poor and giving them hope and was also nonenforcement. you'd be surprised go to sharif, a shrine, and you would be amazed at times more hindus than muslims there. why? becausecpa they never forced ane to convert. and those who -- i don't want more investment, more political support for them bump their tradition provide a bridge to different muslim sects and not only tolerate each other -- if you tolerate others that a success. i think it respect for the other, which is -- and all the sufi teachings, about human being as a human being. that's why in terms of ideals, i support that sufi cause. but if anyone try to choreograph it, negative reaction. totally unprecedented in the history of south asia, never before there was an attack on a sufi shrine. that happened because of two reasons, one, because of the biggest -- bigoted peopl